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Warthog hardware deadzone yes or not??


Ala12Rv-watermanpc
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Hi guys, Im a warthog noob and Im messing with the setting yet. Couldnt find many info about the "hardware deadzone" so I wonder what do you think its better? enabled or disabled??

 

Also, I would like to know what exactly does this setting. When enabled (by default) the center zone is a perfect 0-0 and as soon as I move an incredible small amount it register the displacement. If I disable it, then its like you get "raw" data or something like that and there is a slight deviation near the center of about 150/250 points to the right BUT, it feels like you dont have deadzone AT ALL.

 

The thing is I tried the F-5 with hardware deadzone disabled and 0 deadzone in game and no curves of any kind and I LOVED IT!!;) ...its like an "hybrid" joy, an F-16 force-sensitive stick near the center and a normal stick when making hard manouvers :D...in little adjustments it soooo crazy accurate that feels like you are controlling the plane with your mind:D as there is almost no stick movement but you can perfectly well, deadly accurate and perfectly linearly controll it.

 

Never had a stick with this feeling bafore. It makes the great force you need to do in order to move it make sense and the feeling of weight an realism it gives foces you to fly the plane in a realistic way (no crazy neck-breaking manouvers anymore unless you need to).

 

Well, back on topic :lol:, even when enabling or disabling the hardware deadzone dont felt very different, and bearing in mind that of course, I will use 0 deadzone and no curves but linear response what do you think would be better setting???. Also, is there any way to keep it disabled after disconnecting the stick from the USB WITHOUT openning TARGET?? thats what I dont like about this hotas, you need a profile just for changing back light intensity or hardware deadzone??seriously?? :mad:

 

thanks guys!!


Edited by watermanpc

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Ok, thanks PiedDroit, I guess its a matter of likes after all but so far this is what I found:

 

-Disabled: The best thing when disabled is that the stick response is totally continuous even in the center spot so it feels very "analog" and you can make continuous adjustments in the center area without making any pressure on the stick. The problem is its very difficult to keep the stick in the center as there will be always little movement (its not a problem in planes like A-10c or F-5 but can be in the F-15 for example)

 

-Enabled: Its like the stick isolates the extremely small physical dead zone so no response there but in exchange its deadly perfect zero in the center and as soon as you minimally move the stick it stars from 0 to whatever value...so you have perfect linear response and at the same time perfect zero in the center area. This is not the same as disabling hardware deadzone and setting in game a dead zone.

 

For example, if I set a 2% dead zone in game and disable hardware dead zone, if I move the stick 100 points it will be ignored but as soon as you reach the 2% value (like 1200 points in the warthog) you will get an abrupt response from zero to 1200. On the contrary, with a zero dead zone in game but hardware dead zone enabled you can go from 0 to 1,2,3,20,50,100,...no problem, so extremely accurate response.

 

So, this is what I found so far, I will love to know what you guys like to set it up :thumbup:

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Where exactly do you set it?

It seems I don't have the control panel installed, the only place I could see this setting is in the TARGET GUI, and it was enabled.

Since I never bothered with this setting I can't really tell you about it - ff you really need an answer I'd suggest leaving it enabled ;)

 

P.S.: Maybe you'll fix your centering issue by doing the stick calibration in windows (with hardware deadzone disabled)?

I tried a bit this setting a bit since you asked the question, for me it doesn't seem I need to have a profile to be running for the deadzone setting to take effect.


Edited by PiedDroit
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I set it in the TARGET Gui and yes, after some testing I think enabled is the best of both worlds :thumbup:

 

I also did the calibration with it disabled but for some reason (I guess it doesnt matter how much you try you will always have some dead zone in the physical stick) when leaving the stick centered its a bit aligned to the right (just a bit).

 

My bad about leaving it enabled, it stay as you leave it when you close terget :) (sadly this is not the case with the back light intensity :huh:)

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I set it in the TARGET Gui and yes, after some testing I think enabled is the best of both worlds :thumbup:

 

I also did the calibration with it disabled but for some reason (I guess it doesnt matter how much you try you will always have some dead zone in the physical stick) when leaving the stick centered its a bit aligned to the right (just a bit).

 

My bad about leaving it enabled, it stay as you leave it when you close terget :) (sadly this is not the case with the back light intensity :huh:)

You'll find the setting you like best ;)

I never had it disabled before so I disabled it, did the calibration (as without it the stick is a bit off center) and I will test it for a while to see if it makes a difference at all. It seems it is a bit more sensitive in the center.

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Yeah!, thats exactly what I felt also...its like you can continously work around the infimal physical dead zone (which is quite logic as its call "hardware dead zone :P)...so what I guess it does is that the option has the ability to isolate the hardware dead zone of the stick, like introducing a gap in the dead zone where the response starts you you dont loose a single point of resolution and at the same time you are not influenced by the little physical dead zone of the stick so yes, I think its the best option but disabling it can be really cool for WWII planes ir civil light planes with more mechanical actuators as it gives you raw, natural response.

 

I tried calibrating with it disabled but I guess as it has to do with the physical part of the stick no matter how much you calibrate it, you will never be able to maintain the joy in a perfect center position.

 

Btw...how the hell can I DELETE a key bind in the "layers" panel in TARGET??? damn, I cant delete it once assigned :mad:

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[...]

I tried calibrating with it disabled but I guess as it has to do with the physical part of the stick no matter how much you calibrate it, you will never be able to maintain the joy in a perfect center position.

 

Btw...how the hell can I DELETE a key bind in the "layers" panel in TARGET??? damn, I cant delete it once assigned :mad:

I depends on your flying style and how your stick is configured.

I modded mine so I get almost no resistance in the center and resistance increase when going outside of the center (for choppers and also to have more natural feeling of controls, I don't want F-16 style stick resistance), so having extra precision in the center is pretty good for me (I'm still testing without the HW deadzone enabled but I didn't have much time to fly recently).

 

If you have the stock joystick, going out of the center area always require some force, so I guess in that cas it's better to have the HW deadzone and use it "F-16 style". So what's works for will probably not work for you :D

Hence my very first answer to this thread.

P.S.: To keep things flexible, maybe you can have the HW deadzone disabled, then calibrate your stick, and setup a 1% deadzone in DCS depending on the aircraft?

 

I can't help you on TARGET GUI, never used it sorry...


Edited by PiedDroit
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Btw...how the hell can I DELETE a key bind in the "layers" panel in TARGET??? damn, I cant delete it once assigned :mad:

 

You certainly can, it has been a while since I have messed around in TARGET if you don't get it figured out or someone else knows off the top of their head I will dig around in it and see what I can find.

Don B

 

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Ok I took a look:

 

Choose the profile and select to edit the configuration.

Click on next till you get to the button assignments.

Click the down arrow on the button that has the assignment you want to delete.

Click to highlight the assignment, then click on "delete" in the upper right corner.

Click finish and all done, the assignment is gone.

Don B

 

My VKB Gunfighter MK III Pro L Review

EVGA Z390 Dark MB | i9 9900k CPU @ 5.2 GHz | EVGA RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra | 32 GB G Skill Trident Z 3200 MHz CL14 | Corsair H150i Pro Cooler |VKB GF MK III Pro L Ultimate Grip| Virpil CM3 Throttle |Reverb G2 | Valve Index| Vive Pro 2 |

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I depends on your flying style and how your stick is configured.

I modded mine so I get almost no resistance in the center and resistance increase when going outside of the center (for choppers and also to have more natural feeling of controls, I don't want F-16 style stick resistance), so having extra precision in the center is pretty good for me (I'm still testing without the HW deadzone enabled but I didn't have much time to fly recently).

 

If you have the stock joystick, going out of the center area always require some force, so I guess in that cas it's better to have the HW deadzone and use it "F-16 style". So what's works for will probably not work for you :D

Hence my very first answer to this thread.

P.S.: To keep things flexible, maybe you can have the HW deadzone disabled, then calibrate your stick, and setup a 1% deadzone in DCS depending on the aircraft?

 

I can't help you on TARGET GUI, never used it sorry...

 

The problem is that, if Im correct, by disabling hardware deadzone and adding an 1% dead zone in games, you are cutting some input response...I mean, if that 1% correspond to 300 points of response, then you will have zero response between 0 and 0,99999 and as soon as you reach 1% you will get suddenly 300 points of input. Again, Im not sure if this is correct, but I think it makes sense and its what I felt when I did that same configuration...also, that explains why we have a "hardware deadzone" setting, because otherwise those configs would be the same thing right??

 

Ok I took a look:

 

Choose the profile and select to edit the configuration.

Click on next till you get to the button assignments.

Click the down arrow on the button that has the assignment you want to delete.

Click to highlight the assignment, then click on "delete" in the upper right corner.

Click finish and all done, the assignment is gone.

 

 

Sorry man, but I didnt explained myself correctly...what I cant delete is the button assigned to work as SHIFT STATE, inside the layers manu...once I select it (ie the paddle), then there is no option or way to delete it?¿?¿?. and Im not talking about replacing the actual button with another one but deleting the existing.

 

thanks!!

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The problem is that, if Im correct, by disabling hardware deadzone and adding an 1% dead zone in games, you are cutting some input response...I mean, if that 1% correspond to 300 points of response, then you will have zero response between 0 and 0,99999 and as soon as you reach 1% you will get suddenly 300 points of input. Again, Im not sure if this is correct, but I think it makes sense and its what I felt when I did that same configuration...also, that explains why we have a "hardware deadzone" setting, because otherwise those configs would be the same thing right??

the deadzone won't make a sudden 300 input, it will start at 0, if you look at the curve you will see what I mean (just play with the deadzone slider in DCS).

The DCS axis tune translates stick input into game input, the curve shows the stick input on the horizontal axis and the game input on the vertical axis.

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Ok then, I didnt check the axis in DCS but it felt like there wasnt the same accuracy but I might be wrong...anyway, doing both thing would give the same results right??

I didn't say it had the same accuracy (between hw deadzone vs. 1% deadzone in DCS),

I'm just saying that instead of toggling hw deadzone on or off depending on the aircraft, you could also leave it disabled (and calibrate the stick of course) and add (or not) 1% deadzone in DCS depending on the aircraft.

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I undertood what you said :thumbup:...I just said that doing that (1% dead zone in DCS with HW dead zone disabled) felt less accurate to me in the center, like doing that "jump" in response but didnt tested it in deph so if you say thats not what happens then I may be wrong.

 

Also, 1% in the whathog is a huge amount of points so I wouldnt recommend doing that...better enable or disable the HW dead zone but leaving DCS at 0% dead zone...btw, are you liking it disabled??:thumbup:

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I undertood what you said :thumbup:...I just said that doing that (1% dead zone in DCS with HW dead zone disabled) felt less accurate to me in the center, like doing that "jump" in response but didnt tested it in deph so if you say thats not what happens then I may be wrong.

 

Also, 1% in the whathog is a huge amount of points so I wouldnt recommend doing that...better enable or disable the HW dead zone but leaving DCS at 0% dead zone...btw, are you liking it disabled??:thumbup:

 

Don't worry there will be no jump, it might feel like a jump because when in the deadzone it will be 0 then it will suddenly start to increase, but that increase will really start at 0.

I agree hw deadzone seems a bit more accurate than a 1% deadzone in DCS.

 

Maybe instead of using a deadzone you could try a shallow curve (like 5)?

You can even use deadzone and curve at the same time, the deadzone will make sure your stick stays centered and the curve will make the first increase softer. I suggest you experiment with the axis tune in DCS.

 

And yes I like it better so far (with hw deadzone disabled) but I need to test it more.

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All clear then!:thumbup:

 

I already tested curves and dead zones long time ago with many other joys, but I find this "tricks" are somewhat for not very good devices (well, its ok if you like to use them of course) but not for top quality ones like the warthog...I think linear response is the best by far and also the most realistic (although not always).

 

Glad to hear you are linking no HW DZ :thumbup:

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  • 3 months later...

Regarding the hardware deadzone, I am having two issues with it:

 

1) It resets to "enabled" every time I click on the button to "Control Hardware Deadzone" in the GUI - this makes me suspicious that it's not saving the setting when I disable it (remove the dot in the circle)

 

2) I can't see any difference in the Device Analyzer with it enabled or disabled. I am running a profile with no deadzone, but whether the hardware deadzone is on or off, the response is the same.

 

Does this setting control whether the profile's deadzone is recognized or not? Or is this a separate deadzone that can be enforced regardless of the profile and of course the particular sim you're running?

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