Hover attacks and concealment

[ST0RM]

I've been trying to learn to fight in the Gazelle from a hover, but the tanks seem to get the first kill shot every time.

 

So a few questions:

1) Can ground objects see through trees? I'm barely above them and get nailed immediately.

2) Are buildings see-through? Again, trying to use cover

3) Not silhouetting myself against open sky above trees. Maybe use mountains behind me?

 

I understand it wont be a turkey shoot for me, but I'm trying to follow the tactics I know.

 

Thanks,

Jeff

[Sryan]

1) Yes, on the caucasus map atleast. The AI will even shoot you through the trees. You cannot even collide with the trees. I know that on Nevada atleast a section of the trees can be collided with. I don't know if the ai can see you through the trees there.

2) not afaik.

3) Yes this helps. This is why it is better to attack from near the side of the hill than going over the crest.

[ST0RM]

Thanks Syran. I'll start attacking from that direction.

 

Cheers!

[shagrat]

2) at least AI is aware of you AFTER you have been spotted, even behind buildings, obviously.

 

Two major factors are important against AI.

Direction - from behind a unit will spot you much later than from the front or sides. If the group has units facing every direction you are likely spotted after a few seconds, even if you just expose the sight.

 

Light - at night or dawn/sunset AI spotting factors decrease considerably, if they don't have NVG. So during darkness you have a considerable advantage.

 

Other factors include contrast against background (hover with a dark mountain in your back is preferable to a light sky with the sun illuminating you. (Yes, this is modeled AFAIK).

Time you spend in sight of the enemy. The longer you have a line of sight, the more likely the enemy AI "spots" you.

Distance plays a role, as well, yet at typical engagement ranges of helicopters it is negligible.

 

If you are interested, you can search for the detection.lua which plays a major part in the AI spotting process.

 

I personally hope for ED to finish the merge to DCS 2.5 and take care about the AI, as there is considerable "room for improvement", currently. ;)

[ST0RM]

Great tips Shagrat. I'll utilize these as well with the understanding there is further work necessary.

[enigma6584]

Beautiful tips Shagrat. Remember also STORM to use buildings to your advantage. They do provide you cover and concealment and if ENY AAA do fire on you, the buildings can and will shield you.

[shagrat]

AAA isn't the worst. The goddamn Tanks and BMPs with their rockets are. The more modern ones have a range of 5.000m.

Another good tactic is movement (Gazelle can fire on the move up to 120km/h), but this requires either very good piloting and targeting skills on the left seat in parallel or multiplayer dual seat.

 

The later is awesome, if you can share the workload. Pilot fly's and monitors for threats, while Commander concentrates on shooting the missile.

When evasive, pilot concentrates on flying low and fast, while Commander is eyes out and watching for incoming, and make call outs.

Edited December 31, 2016 by shagrat

[Galwran]

Because ground clutter isn't properly modelled, it would help if units at the altitude on 10 meters and slow speed would be invible randomly for around 10 seconds. A stopgap measure

[shagrat]

As I said, have a look at the detection.lua and you can better understand when and how the AI detects you.

It needs a more sophisticated system for sure, with scout and AT-Helicopters coming to DCS.

 

At least contrast against background is modeled which is something to consider.

Light, fog, etc. has an impact as well. Yet ultimately it boils down to a "time to reveal" that is modified by factors.

Bottom line, after a long enough time with LOS the AI will ALWAYS detect you.