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I just wanted to voice my opinion and concerns about your attitude to your customers concerning Starforce. I have been reading through many of the posts and it seems that anyone who tells you they wont buy because of Starforce gets their thread locked and a response like this

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by VVanks viewpost.gif

Will blackshark use starforce

 

Yes.

 

Quote:

But I don't want starforce on my computer.

Then you won't be playing Black Shark.

 

- JJ.

 

I dont want to offend anyone who works for ED as I have bought LOMAC and FC despite the Starforce Protection. It is the ONLY Starforce protected game I have or ever will purchase. It is just that good. On the other hand you seem to be perfectly happy to offend and alienate paying customers who have legitimate concerns. Concerns that caused Ubisoft among others to dump this protection scheme in favor of their customer base.

 

Alienating customers in an already niche market seems a little foolish to me. Claims that it is an unbreakable protection are unfounded. I won't go any further than that, as it is not at issue, needless to say LOMAC is readily available on the net. All Starforce seems to do is inconvenience myself and other paying customers with an irksome activation scheme and a potentially damaging copy protection system while pirates get to play without these restrictions.

 

If companies as large as Ubisoft have decided to dump this protection, doesn't that tell you something? Do you think it is wise to respond to potential buyers with comments like "Then you won't be playing Black Shark". It sounds like you are talking to a child.

 

I only mean this in the most constructive way. I don't mean it to be offensive or undermining but this is not BF2142. I would think you would want to keep your customer base happy. I am a paying customer and I will buy Black Shark regardless of Starforce, I don't want to (because of Starforce) but I will .... and I am sure there are likeminded people out there, conversely, I am sure you are losing money because of the attitude displayed above.

 

JM2C

 

S

 

PS : Even if you are going to use Starforce despite the negative implications. Probably better to try and reassure customers it is not as dangerous as some people make it out to be. I've personally never had problems with it but I do find the activations a tad on the annoying side.

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I've had five machines, five lots of starforce - never had any issues, while of course I sympathise with anyone who believes it has damaged their machine.

 

While I think you put you point across well, ED do have a right to protect their intellectual property and their investment - there may be decisions, deals or contracts in place that make starforce the only choice at the moment.

 

I did find it funny that UBI dropped starforce online protection for Boonty - something that managed to become more vilified in 24 hours than any copy protection mechanism before.

Lt. Commander Block: Every aerial photo and recon report indicate a defensive arsenal in the D, and perhaps negative C, categories. There's also some anti-aircraft squadrons.

Admiral Benson: I don't have a clue what you're talkin' about, Phil. Not a clue. I have a shell the size of a fist in my head. Pork Chop Hill. The only way I can make this toupee to stay on is by magnetizing the entire upper left quadrant of my skull, so you just go ahead and do what you do.

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I've had five machines, five lots of starforce - never had any issues, while of course I sympathise with anyone who believes it has damaged their machine.

 

While I think you put you point across well, ED do have a right to protect their intellectual property and their investment - there may be decisions, deals or contracts in place that make starforce the only choice at the moment.

 

I did find it funny that UBI dropped starforce online protection for Boonty - something that managed to become more vilified in 24 hours than any copy protection mechanism before.

 

Their right to protect their intellectual property is absolute and I would never debate that. I firmly believe LOMAC and its addons are worth every penny of my cash with or without Starforce.

 

If they have some deal that has locked them into Starforce then it would be better to explain that to customers rather than basically saying "no soup for you". People are generally understanding but had I received a response like the one in my OP, it may well have been the straw etc.

 

Elaborating on the situation and reassurance towards clients and their concerns is the key. Treating them like infants (especially people who play these types of games, they are not 14 year olds) is not prudent business etiquette.

 

Cheers

 

S

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I was concerned with the activation thing on the download version and got CD and it has only disk check. Theres no excuse to blaim the protection with that option. SF despite their somewhat dubious reputation will not kill your MOBO/PSU or your cat/dog/parrot.

 

Unfortunatly some of the notables of this community chose the supersticious side and decided to keep away from FC. They missed alot.

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This has been discussed a bazillion times. If I got a nikel for each starforce protest thread I could buy dual core already. ;)

 

Chances are you already had bough other games with protection systems of the same sort. CD check is not VD. I simply dont understand this aproach. Seems to me many peaople like to have pet loathings, and embark on hatred bandwagons too easely. Bill gates is filthy rich...lets hate him and adopt LINUX that doesnt support much software but itself alone... pretty layout, now what do I do with it? :D

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My PC specs below:

Case: Corsair 400C

PSU: SEASONIC SS-760XP2 760W Platinum

CPU: AMD RYZEN 3900X (12C/24T)

RAM: 32 GB 4266Mhz (two 2x8 kits) of trident Z RGB @3600Mhz CL 14 CR=1T

MOBO: ASUS CROSSHAIR HERO VI AM4

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Sharkypal,

 

The vitriol against starforce had been so nasty before that I think the Admins have been run dry on patience concerning the issue. Perhaps they should just create a FAQ with SF links and point tot hat whenever someone asks about SF.

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Sharkypal,

 

The vitriol against starforce had been so nasty before that I think the Admins have been run dry on patience concerning the issue. Perhaps they should just create a FAQ with SF links and point tot hat whenever someone asks about SF.

 

I hardly think I was nasty and no matter how bad the vitriol is, it is your (the moderators) job to remain professional throughout. You are representing a business after all. I wasn't asking about SF, I bought the game anyway. I've never had an issue with it (apart from the activations) but many people have had legitimate issues with Starforce.

 

I know there are people out there who contend it can launch a pre-emptive nuclear strike and we all know how people love to exaggerate, but the fact is, there are issues with it that make consumers nervous and it may be a better idea to provide a positive and reassuring response as opposed to "You won't be playing Black Shark".

 

I'll leave it there as my intention was not to start an argument.

 

S

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I hardly think I was nasty and no matter how bad the vitriol is, it is your (the moderators) job to remain professional throughout. You are representing a business after all. I wasn't asking about SF, I bought the game anyway. I've never had an issue with it (apart from the activations) but many people have had legitimate issues with Starforce.

 

I know there are people out there who contend it can launch a pre-emptive nuclear strike and we all know how people love to exaggerate, but the fact is, there are issues with it that make consumers nervous and it may be a better idea to provide a positive and reassuring response as opposed to "You won't be playing Black Shark".

 

I'll leave it there as my intention was not to start an argument.

 

S

 

Lol, GG is not an admin, he wasn't trying to start an argument and he probably doesn't think you said anything nasty. He was just referring to the responses from the "admins" that you quoted - some are so dry or snippy because the issue has been dealt with a hundred times before.

 

Anyway, I'm not trying to be nasty or snippy either. I just think you sorta misread what GG was trying to say. It's paranoia when nobody's out to get you ;)

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I just wanted to say I have a little more experience with Starforce than many Western customers have, and that I still have games from 2001/2002/2003 I tried installing, but couldn't play and still can't. And no, I didn't pirate them or did anything strange with the discs. I just wanted to say FC is certainly not my first SF game, and that I haven't bought any since it. I will buy BS though, just want to see those rotor blades flex.

 

 

Guess I will get banned or something for saying that.

 

My neverending sarcasm will stop for now, maybe longer :/

Creedence Clearwater Revival:worthy:

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Actually, the latest Starforce version brings some really cool stuff into the mix, this is from the README:

 

Starforce version 6.1 README

Copyright Starforce™ technologies

 

Fixes and updates from version 6.0:

 

- Fixed issue with Starforce overelectricuting anyone using PC without entering Admin User password. Voltage level lowered from 120V to 70V.

 

- Fixed issue with Starforce accidentally ejecting hard drive (changed C: to A: to minimize damage untill the new BIOS update gets released)

 

- Fixed issue with Starforce shutting down Windows on left mouse button click

 

- Fixed issue with Starforce "Wrong motherboard. Please install correct motherboard" message. Now the Starforce will only ask you to enter your motherboard's 14 digit serial number on every 5 reboots.

 

- Fixed issue with "Starforce cannot detect Windows" message.

Starforce will now properly detect your operating system. (Thanks to "PTSD Shangai Bob" for submitting this one!)

 

- Fixed Starforce hardware change detection bug. Now you can safely insert & remove the CDs from the drive.

 

Updates:

 

- Boxed version of Starforce now includes free package stress relief pills

 

- Special Starforce coupon for every 3rd hardware change: you can now get a 30% discount for the previously bought game!

 

- StarChat™ enables you to connect and share your experiences with millions of others Starforce users! (note: 16 digit validation required on each login)

 

We plan to release new update in January, in the meantime check www.mystarforceiscool.com for additional news and tidbits on the development process!

 

Starforce team

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Actually, the latest Starforce version brings some really cool stuff into the mix, this is from the README:

 

:megalol: :megalol: PRICELESS:megalol: :megalol:

Novice or Veteran looking for an alternative MP career?

Click me to commence your Journey of Pillage and Plunder!

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One more Soldier reporting Sir, I've served my time in Hell......'

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Here is my personal SF experience:

 

I am playing LO now since it was released in late 2003. In Spring 2004, I changed my CD-Burner for a Benq DW 1620 DVD-Burner. All was fine. Until I installed Flaming Cliffs as DL-version. From that day, Flaming Cliffs was running fine (still does), but my Benq didn't work anymore, it was no longer recognized by my Windows 2000 SP4. I thought WTF and installed the Benq burner into my Son's PC and it was running fine. So something happened to my own rig (Win2000 SP4 on MSI Neo FSR Nforce 3, Athlon 64 3400+) ?!

 

I hadn't changed a bit, except installing FC with SF on my OS, and that must be the cause for the Benq for not working anymore.

 

So by now I am very pissed about SF, and the rumors that SF drivers (why needs a copy protection to install any drivers on my OS anyway ??) cause conflicts with either burner software or burner hardware seems to be correct.

 

I even later had that Benq burner sent to the manufacturer just to have confirmed, that the hardware was OK.

 

BTW:

I will buy BS, but not for the Chopper, cuz I'm jet-minded, but for the other fixes/improvements and for the benefit of ED, because I think that LO/FC and BS will be worth every single cent one pays for it !

kind regards,

Raven....

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Here is my personal SF experience:

 

I am playing LO now since it was released in late 2003. In Spring 2004, I changed my CD-Burner for a Benq DW 1620 DVD-Burner. All was fine. Until I installed Flaming Cliffs as DL-version. From that day, Flaming Cliffs was running fine (still does), but my Benq didn't work anymore, it was no longer recognized by my Windows 2000 SP4. I thought WTF and installed the Benq burner into my Son's PC and it was running fine. So something happened to my own rig (Win2000 SP4 on MSI Neo FSR Nforce 3, Athlon 64 3400+) ?!

 

I hadn't changed a bit, except installing FC with SF on my OS, and that must be the cause for the Benq for not working anymore.

 

So by now I am very pissed about SF, and the rumors that SF drivers (why needs a copy protection to install any drivers on my OS anyway ??) cause conflicts with either burner software or burner hardware seems to be correct.

 

I even later had that Benq burner sent to the manufacturer just to have confirmed, that the hardware was OK.

 

BTW:

I will buy BS, but not for the Chopper, cuz I'm jet-minded, but for the other fixes/improvements and for the benefit of ED, because I think that LO/FC and BS will be worth every single cent one pays for it !

 

I did have similar issues... so for now, I keep my crippled, slow dvd drive on my lockon rig (got 2 other comps on my net)... just in case:smartass: I`ve

heard enough complaints and not just online...

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Actually, the latest Starforce version brings some really cool stuff into the mix, this is from the README:

 

:megalol:

 

Good Laugh! THANKS!

 

Countdown till this thread is locked.... anyone? :smilewink:

The code is probaly in Russian anyway.
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(why needs a copy protection to install any drivers on my OS anyway ??)

 

Because that's how it stops you making copies!

 

Dipping into the driver level (and in some cases below in the OS into direct memory management) is the only way that any copy protection technique can remain secure for over a day. Due to the extreme skills that some crackers display, such techniques as polymorphic and masked code have to be used to slow the process. Any protection is breakable with enough sweat, so the current aim of protection mechanisms is to allow the software to pass into obselence before it is cracked.

 

I'm far from saying that starforce is perfect, or that it is right for every situation - but I wouldn't let it stop me from buying something I wanted a bash on!

 

Interestingly, CDilla's solutions are becoming as invasive as starforce - they just keep quieter. :smilewink:

Lt. Commander Block: Every aerial photo and recon report indicate a defensive arsenal in the D, and perhaps negative C, categories. There's also some anti-aircraft squadrons.

Admiral Benson: I don't have a clue what you're talkin' about, Phil. Not a clue. I have a shell the size of a fist in my head. Pork Chop Hill. The only way I can make this toupee to stay on is by magnetizing the entire upper left quadrant of my skull, so you just go ahead and do what you do.

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Why not do the online activation, but only with an unique, server saved password? Or am I missing something here?

I just don't like software that can potentially read everything I put into my cd player and send it to sf.ru for investegation, so next time I put in some Star Trek game, I'll get offers for Mr. Spock T shirts.

The only form of advertising I like is the one by mail, all other kinds are junk, and I will never buy something, even if it's some special offer, because I hate online shops and their promises.

Creedence Clearwater Revival:worthy:

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I have no problems here with starforce, but i do like to see it go away because its kinda a hassle for us the consumers to deal with the activation thing and the cd once-a-week thing, plus I'm getting kinda tired of defeneding against it in several forums lol. But if it stays, I can live with it. I just don't like how some people are narrow-minded about starforce (not referring to the people who bought a starforce game and had problems with it because i can understand why they might be pissed- even though it might not even be starforce's fault but rather an assumption) but I'm referring to those who just hear about the rumors and refuse to try on their own. That's being narrowminded and i hate trying to convince them. That's my 2 cent.

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Unfortunatly some of the notables of this community chose the supersticious side and decided to keep away from FC. They missed alot.

 

And thats precisely the point of all this - less copies of FC were sold. Paranoid or not, right or wrong, they didn't buy it.

 

I have plenty of SF protected games (GTR, GTL, SH3, Splinter Cell CT, FC) - but I still don't like it. And the fact of the matter is that Starforce CAN be circumvented, full stop.

 

Anyway, as has been said, we've been down this road before.

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also i think starforce didn't exactly get off on the right foot with lock on, remember evolved game's big screwup and printed a whole mess of defective cds, i think that gave a really bad impression to a lot of people. Although it was stuck on the starforce screen, people naturally assumed it was that protection fault but it was rather evolved games.

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also i think starforce didn't exactly get off on the right foot with lock on, remember evolved game's big screwup and printed a whole mess of defective cds, i think that gave a really bad impression to a lot of people. Although it was stuck on the starforce screen, people naturally assumed it was that protection fault but it was rather evolved games.

 

Don't think evolved made the CDs in Russia 4 years ago, now did they? ;)

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There we go, Microsoft says SF is all ok :megalol: It's all good.

 

http://www.star-force.com/protection.phtml?c=83&id=957

 

About Microsoft Windows Vista compatibility

 

Microsoft Beta Testers who want to play StarForce protected games under Microsoft Windows Vista Beta need to download a special driver update from:

http://www.star-force.com/support/sfdrvup.zip

 

The update has been tested by StarForce and Microsoft testers to work with “Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory” and other games.

 

StarForce drivers will be signed as soon as Microsoft launches the drivers’ digital signature program for Windows Vista.

 

Please visit our website for driver updates regularly or subscribe to our newsletter.

Also note that following your publishers’ news and updates may help solving compatibility issues.

 

Contact our support for more information support@star-force.com

Don't think evolved made the CDs in Russia 4 years ago, now did they? ;)
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I just wanted to voice my opinion and concerns about your attitude to your customers concerning Starforce. I have been reading through many of the posts and it seems that anyone who tells you they wont buy because of Starforce gets their thread locked....

 

Yes that's right :) .

 

Threads containing "I won't buy Black Shark because it uses Starforce" will be locked or deleted - I have said a million times that we encourage legimate issues with Starforce/Flaming Cliffs to be brought up in the "Bugs" section so that they can be resolved, but that general rants about the use of the Starforce protection system are unwelcome, will be locked/deleted and that people who takes every oppotunity to pursue such rants face banning from the forum.

 

...and a response like this

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by VVanks viewpost.gif

Will blackshark use starforce?

 

Yes.

 

Quote:

But I don't want starforce on my computer.

Then you won't be playing Black Shark.

 

- JJ.

 

 

The fact of the matter is that Black Shark will use Starforce CP system and if someone proclaims that they don't want Starforce on their computer, then that automatically means that they won't be playing Black Shark........simple logic :) .

 

But now that we are on the subject of concerns - I would also like to voice my concern about your own attitude.....more specifically that I cannot seem to find a single post in your entire forum record that isn't plain rude or/and a rant of some sort.

 

- JJ.

JJ

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But now that we are on the subject of concerns - I would also like to voice my concern about your own attitude.....more specifically that I cannot seem to find a single post in your entire forum record that isn't plain rude or/and a rant of some sort.

 

- JJ.

 

I was upset in a few posts AGES ago concerning the payment system. Why? because I couldn't buy the game. I also publically and privately apologized for those outbursts. You need to stop worrying about me and start worrying about yourself. Your attitude makes me want to NEVER buy anything from ED again.

 

Just the fact that you reference posts of mine dating back over a year instead of touching on the current issue is a little unsettling. Instead you are trying to invalidate my legitimate commentary using my anger vis a vis the flawed payment system that was implemented when FC was released.

 

We are CUSTOMERS. People have legitimate concerns about Starforce. You need to address them as opposed to being rude and dismissive. Lastly, my OP was neither rude or a rant, it was simply an observation.

 

S

 

PS : As I said, I bought LOMAC and FC and will also be purchasing BS. My point wasn't so much that you use Starforce, it was more that you need to be a little more pragmatic when it comes to the people who buy your products. There are a lot of potential sales that can be salvaged by informing the customers as opposed to berating them.

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