Decibel dB Posted December 17, 2016 Share Posted December 17, 2016 Hi anyone know what is the gun default gun convergence on the Spit IX and how to modify it? thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kozmyk Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 Inquiring minds want to know... OS:Win10 Home CPU:i7 3770K 3.5(@4.3GHz) COOLER:ZalmanCNPS10X-PERFORMA MOBO:GigabyteGA-Z77X-UD5H SSD#1:SamsungEVO850Pro 500GB SSD#2:SanDisk240GB HDD:2x Seagate2TB GFX:GigabyteGTX670 WF3 2GB OC1058MHz RAM:16GB 16000MHz DDR3 KEYB'Ds:Corsair K95/MS SidewinderX4 MOUSE:LogitechG700s MON:2x ASUS 24” ROUTER:ASUS RT-N66U DarkKnight INTERWEBS:Fibre152Mbps/12Mbps JOYSTICK:TM T16000m Modded THROTTLE:TM TWCS HEADTRACK:TrackIR5Pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Legman Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 There was already a thread on this https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=178037&page=1 DCS Discord community - https://discord.gg/U8aqzVT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kozmyk Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 300 yards ? OS:Win10 Home CPU:i7 3770K 3.5(@4.3GHz) COOLER:ZalmanCNPS10X-PERFORMA MOBO:GigabyteGA-Z77X-UD5H SSD#1:SamsungEVO850Pro 500GB SSD#2:SanDisk240GB HDD:2x Seagate2TB GFX:GigabyteGTX670 WF3 2GB OC1058MHz RAM:16GB 16000MHz DDR3 KEYB'Ds:Corsair K95/MS SidewinderX4 MOUSE:LogitechG700s MON:2x ASUS 24” ROUTER:ASUS RT-N66U DarkKnight INTERWEBS:Fibre152Mbps/12Mbps JOYSTICK:TM T16000m Modded THROTTLE:TM TWCS HEADTRACK:TrackIR5Pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decibel dB Posted December 19, 2016 Author Share Posted December 19, 2016 There was already a thread on this https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=178037&page=1 Thanks:thumbup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arglmauf Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 It's definitely closer than 300 yards, more like 150 to 180. Makes it very hard to shoot things that are turning because your tracers quickly disappear below your nose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decibel dB Posted December 19, 2016 Author Share Posted December 19, 2016 They are definitely further then 180. Do a test, make a mission place a 190 in front that fly in the same heading then you and set your gunfight base at 40 and the range at close range 2 (200 yards). Get close to your 190 until it completely fit's in the gunsight " that mean you are in range or 200 yard from him" Shoot and you will see your bullet barely touch it's wing tip. If the convergence would be 200 the bullets would impact the the middle of the gunsight or the middle of the aircraft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team Yo-Yo Posted December 19, 2016 ED Team Share Posted December 19, 2016 The convergence is for real WWII Spitfires. As far as I remeber, single point, 300 yds. Ніщо так сильно не ранить мозок, як уламки скла від розбитих рожевих окулярів There is nothing so hurtful for the brain as splinters of broken rose-coloured spectacles. Ничто так сильно не ранит мозг, как осколки стекла от разбитых розовых очков (С) Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decibel dB Posted December 19, 2016 Author Share Posted December 19, 2016 (edited) Thank you YO-YO for the reply and that wonderful module, further down the line will we be able to adjust the convergence to a closer range like it was done those days? Edited December 19, 2016 by Decibel dB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davee Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 The convergence is for real WWII Spitfires. As far as I remeber, single point, 300 yds. Originally 400 then reduced to 250 with some senior pilots getting their mechanics to change to 100 yds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team Yo-Yo Posted December 19, 2016 ED Team Share Posted December 19, 2016 Originally 400 then reduced to 250 with some senior pilots getting their mechanics to change to 100 yds. And how did they manage to hit the target at 200-300 yds if they had to? Ніщо так сильно не ранить мозок, як уламки скла від розбитих рожевих окулярів There is nothing so hurtful for the brain as splinters of broken rose-coloured spectacles. Ничто так сильно не ранит мозг, как осколки стекла от разбитых розовых очков (С) Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talisman_VR Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 The convergence is for real WWII Spitfires. As far as I remeber, single point, 300 yds. The in-game gunnery tutorial says set range for 150 yards, so I had presumed that the convergence was set to 150 yards; if not, then perhaps the gunnery tutorial should be changed to reflect a range of 300 yards, not 150 yards (big difference, LOL). It would be good if you could confirm gun single point convergence range for certain Yo-Yo. It is very important, crucial in fact, if we are to use the gun sight to best effect. Thank you in anticipation. Happy landings, 56RAF_Talisman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Decibel dB Posted December 19, 2016 Author Share Posted December 19, 2016 And how did they manage to hit the target at 200-300 yds if they had to? The question is how they manage to hit at 300 to 400? They didn't it was highly inefficient. That is why they end up with closer convergence. I personalty like to shot when the aircraft fill the complete gunfight that is around 150. No waste :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kozmyk Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 And how did they manage to hit the target at 200-300 yds if they had to? The convergence range is just where the concentration of fire is focused. You can still hit and do damage some distance nearer and further than that range. btw The 300 yard figure came from a chat with a dev. ;) OS:Win10 Home CPU:i7 3770K 3.5(@4.3GHz) COOLER:ZalmanCNPS10X-PERFORMA MOBO:GigabyteGA-Z77X-UD5H SSD#1:SamsungEVO850Pro 500GB SSD#2:SanDisk240GB HDD:2x Seagate2TB GFX:GigabyteGTX670 WF3 2GB OC1058MHz RAM:16GB 16000MHz DDR3 KEYB'Ds:Corsair K95/MS SidewinderX4 MOUSE:LogitechG700s MON:2x ASUS 24” ROUTER:ASUS RT-N66U DarkKnight INTERWEBS:Fibre152Mbps/12Mbps JOYSTICK:TM T16000m Modded THROTTLE:TM TWCS HEADTRACK:TrackIR5Pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foul Ole Ron Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 I thought it was 250 yards in the RAF? I can't see it in any official docs though. Air Chief Marshal Dowding stated: "A great deal of discussion took place before and in the early stages of the war as to the best method of harmonisation of the guns of an 8-gun fighter: that is to say the direction, in relation to the longitudinal axis of the aircraft, in which each gun should be pointed in order to get the best results. There were three schools of thought. One maintained that the lines of fire should be dispersed so that the largest possible “beaten zone” might be formed and one gun (but not more than one) would always be on the target. The second held that the guns should be left parallel and so would always cover an elongated zone corresponding with the vulnerable parts of a bomber (engines, tanks and fuselage). The third demanded concentration of the fire of all guns at a point. Arguments were produced in favour of all three methods of harmonisation, but in practice it was found that concentration of fire gave the best results. Guns were harmonised so that their lines of fire converged on a point 250 yards distant: fire was therefore effective up to about 500 yards, where the lines of fire had opened out again to their original intervals after crossing at the point of concentration." Also mentioned here and various other places: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_harmonisation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team Yo-Yo Posted December 19, 2016 ED Team Share Posted December 19, 2016 (edited) The in-game gunnery tutorial says set range for 150 yards, so I had presumed that the convergence was set to 150 yards; if not, then perhaps the gunnery tutorial should be changed to reflect a range of 300 yards, not 150 yards (big difference, LOL). It would be good if you could confirm gun single point convergence range for certain Yo-Yo. It is very important, crucial in fact, if we are to use the gun sight to best effect. Thank you in anticipation. Happy landings, 56RAF_Talisman If the convergence is at 300 yds, at 150 yds all projectiles will be in line that has length about 1/2 of the machine guns base, i.e. not so dispersed. Thus, you have the effective range from 150 to 450 m. If you place the point at 150 you will have the same patterns at 75-225 yds, 150 yds vs 300 yds of effective patterns. Edited December 19, 2016 by Yo-Yo Ніщо так сильно не ранить мозок, як уламки скла від розбитих рожевих окулярів There is nothing so hurtful for the brain as splinters of broken rose-coloured spectacles. Ничто так сильно не ранит мозг, как осколки стекла от разбитых розовых очков (С) Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sokol1_br Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 (edited) That matter is confuse, find this in "history" forum: Sep 1938 - harmonised to a point 350 yards ahead --- 'concentrated pattern' c.Sep 1939 - harmonised to a large box pattern 400 yards ahead --- 'horizontal harmonization' (British Forces in France continued to harmonise to a point 350 to 150 yards ahead, depending on Squadron) c.Dec 1939 - two squadrons switch to a large circular pattern 200 and 400 yards ahead --- 'circular harmonization' Jan 1940 - ten squadrons switch to concentrated pattern Feb 1940 - full RAF switch to concentrated pattern "Dowding Spread" is 400 yards. And books saying that latter (1942?) was changed for 300 yards. Edited December 19, 2016 by Sokol1_br Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art-J Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 Allright, I'm personally not really crazy about ability of changing convergence distance, or investigating which one is correct for 1944, but I'm just curious what the one set in DCS Spit is, so that I could adjust the gunsight better. Seems to be somewhat shorter than in P-51, but maybe it's only my impression from strafing ground targets. Yo-Yo, I thought You would know for sure :D. Could You please take a look into relevant files and confirm if it's 300? i7 9700K @ stock speed, single GTX1070, 32 gigs of RAM, TH Warthog, MFG Crosswind, Win10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilWillis Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 Amazing it only took a couple of days for this old chestnut to rear it's ugly head! I think this was by far the most emotive issue in certain other communities. In reality, if anyone can judge the range to a target to within a hundred yards when pulling G, and trying to get your sight onto a moving manoeuvring target, you're a better man than me Gungadin! Machine guns are deliberately designed to be inaccurate - in that projectiles all have slightly different tracks, and have a beaten zone for the fall of shot which is anything up to 100 yards long and at least a couple of yards wide at the upper end of their effective range. Add to that the effects of G and the variable of aircraft speed, having them converge on a barn door at 25 paces would be some going! Best advice is to forget about convergence ranges, and fly the plane instead of talking about it. You'll get far better results that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BSS_Sniper Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 Amazing it only took a couple of days for this old chestnut to rear it's ugly head! I think this was by far the most emotive issue in certain other communities. In reality, if anyone can judge the range to a target to within a hundred yards when pulling G, and trying to get your sight onto a moving manoeuvring target, you're a better man than me Gungadin! Machine guns are deliberately designed to be inaccurate - in that projectiles all have slightly different tracks, and have a beaten zone for the fall of shot which is anything up to 100 yards long and at least a couple of yards wide at the upper end of their effective range. Add to that the effects of G and the variable of aircraft speed, having them converge on a barn door at 25 paces would be some going! Best advice is to forget about convergence ranges, and fly the plane instead of talking about it. You'll get far better results that way. Within 100 yards is nothing, maybe if you're talking withing 1-5 yards. Anyway, it shouldn't be hard to do with naked eye, but you have a gun sight that can give you that information. I9 9900k @ 5ghz water cooled, 32gb ram, GTX 2080ti, 1tb M.2, 2tb hdd, 1000 watt psu TrackIR 5, TM Warthog Stick and Throttle, CH Pedals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buzzles Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 Amazing it only took a couple of days for this old chestnut to rear it's ugly head! I think this was by far the most emotive issue in certain other communities. It's as if people are thinking something other than their flying skills must be a fault when they can't score kills ;) Fancy trying Star Citizen? Click here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art-J Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 Neil, that's what dots, dashes adjustable rings and whatnot on the reflector glass were invented for - to estimate range down to low tens of yard distances. True, not much use of them when frantically engaging targets pulling some high Gs, but very useful against targets doing shallow turns, or when sneaking up on bombers. Only when we know what convergence is, though, and that's what I'd like to find out in this thread, when talking about DCS Spit. i7 9700K @ stock speed, single GTX1070, 32 gigs of RAM, TH Warthog, MFG Crosswind, Win10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeilWillis Posted December 19, 2016 Share Posted December 19, 2016 (edited) I defy anyone to use those sights to determine the distance to a target within a bracket of 100 yards. Besides which, any turning target will require you to lead them, so what use is the reticule then? In addition, the closing speed of targets in combat means you really get them to fly through your beaten zone. Nice to know, maybe, but to quibble over 50 yards in this context is a little crazy. The whole point of that number of guns, and that rate of fire is to get just a small percentage of them to hit and do critical damage. Snipers we are not! Edited December 19, 2016 by NeilWillis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kozmyk Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 Spiffing Wheeze Here's a spiffing wheeze what I did ... Made a mission with a Spit on every airfield. Hangars are too close to get the angle. Found one with a tall building nearby - Krasnodar Centre Taxied till building was in my sights, then fired. As luck would have it I was putting them all through a window first go. Measured the distance. Near as dammit 250yds. (1.2nm) OS:Win10 Home CPU:i7 3770K 3.5(@4.3GHz) COOLER:ZalmanCNPS10X-PERFORMA MOBO:GigabyteGA-Z77X-UD5H SSD#1:SamsungEVO850Pro 500GB SSD#2:SanDisk240GB HDD:2x Seagate2TB GFX:GigabyteGTX670 WF3 2GB OC1058MHz RAM:16GB 16000MHz DDR3 KEYB'Ds:Corsair K95/MS SidewinderX4 MOUSE:LogitechG700s MON:2x ASUS 24” ROUTER:ASUS RT-N66U DarkKnight INTERWEBS:Fibre152Mbps/12Mbps JOYSTICK:TM T16000m Modded THROTTLE:TM TWCS HEADTRACK:TrackIR5Pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davee Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 Here's a spiffing wheeze what I did ... Made a mission with a Spit on every airfield. Hangars are too close to get the angle. Found one with a tall building nearby - Krasnodar Centre Taxied till building was in my sights, then fired. As luck would have it I was putting them all through a window first go. Measured the distance. Near as dammit 250yds. (1.2nm) That's what I get in my tests also. 250 yds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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