Leatherneck Q1 Development Update - Part I

[Cobra847]

So not this week either? Bad. :)

 

Absolutely terrible

 

Does anyone have to eat a sock this time around?

 

There will be no sock eating promises until the first sock eater follows through. :P

[StandingCow]

Absolutely terrible

 

 

 

There will be no sock eating promises until the first sock eater follows through. :P

 

Oh man... withhold the update until he follows through with the sock eating promise! :megalol:

[Raven68]

Absolutely terrible

 

 

 

There will be no sock eating promises until the first sock eater follows through. :P

 

Cobra are you resembling the same facial expression as your avatar is showing as you make these remarks? :D

[Toten]

What is really happening here is that the beloved Tomcat is actually close to full release, no beta period and rather than bother with an update they are diligently working to translate the manual into Iranian (with hopes that the Iranian Air Force will buy the module as a trainer for their front line pilots). Once the translation is complete (2 weeks to be sure) expect the announcement from ED and LNS.

 

In other news the lottery tickets are 4-6-14-16-21-28 with a bonus for 105...

[didilman]

Yes i have faith in LN after that MiG-21 i will buy viggen and tomcat day one!!

MiG-21 is so old tech i need better ( who said bvr tomcat) as tomcat is multirole.

[probad]

fishbed is multirole too

 

and the f-14 is so old tech it takes a second person to work the radar! literally ww2 operation :P

[Tirak]

Yes i have faith in LN after that MiG-21 i will buy viggen and tomcat day one!!

MiG-21 is so old tech i need better ( who said bvr tomcat) as tomcat is multirole.

 

At this point, we still don't know if LANTIRN will be included, so as of right now, the Tomcat is slated to be less multirole than that MiG-21, as the Tomcat can't carry air to ground missiles like the Kh-66, and can't use rockets.

[BlackLion213]

At this point, we still don't know if LANTIRN will be included, so as of right now, the Tomcat is slated to be less multirole than that MiG-21, as the Tomcat can't carry air to ground missiles like the Kh-66, and can't use rockets.

 

Yeah, sort of.

 

But by that metric (weapon variety), the Tomcat with LANTIRN will also be "less multi-role" than the MiG-21. LANTIRN equipped Tomcats still couldn't use rockets or any A-G missiles - just GBUs that could be self-directed.

 

That said, even a Tomcat without LANTIRN is a better multi-role fighter in my eyes (yes, biased eyes, but hear me out :)).

 

The real advantage of the Tomcat as a strike aircraft is it's payload, range, and self-defense capability.

 

When you put bombs on the MiG-21, you significantly compromise it's ability to perform A-A. Most of the MiG's weapons are rear-aspect and all are meant to be employed at close range. Plus, there are only 4 weapon pylons, that must be shared among any combination of A-A and A-G weapons.

 

The Tomcat can carry 8,000 lbs of bombs (about 4x the load of the MiG) and still carry 2 AIM-54Cs and 2 AIM-9Ms, giving it true A-A ability at long, medium, and short range. That sounds like a much more effective and rounded weapon than the MiG carrying a pair of 250 kg bombs and 2 R-3Rs/R-3S/R-13M1. Plus, after dropping it's bombs, the Tomcat could provide real CAP duties with capable and fearsome A-A missiles.

 

RADM Paul Gilchrist wrote in an article (hearsay - but moderately reliable hearsay) that a GE powered F-14 could carry four Mk84s, two AIM-54Cs, and two AIM-9Ms and still fly at over 600 knots at low altitude with military power alone - retaining a combat radius of 500 nm with that load. To me, that is real power projection!

 

It can fly a long way into enemy territory and deliver a heavy load of bombs with less demands upon the support system (CAP fighters, refueling assets) than most other fighters. It can also fly fast at low altitude over a long distance like a B-1B.

 

Adding LANTIRN would certainly widen the scope of operations by adding roles like FAC(A) and dramatically improving accuracy against a wide range of targets. Plus it would allow the F-14 to fly with fewer bombs and still have a better chance of destroying a target.

 

But even with a CCIP delivery, the Tomcat does offer something significant in the A-G role.

 

I expect that the F-14 will be configurable across a wide variety of load-outs (like in real life).

 

All 3D renders have the Phoenix pallets with BRU-32 bomb racks (and no sparrow recesses on the fuselage - likely a pending 3D fix ;)), but I expect that pallets will be removable on the module to allow the 4x4 (sparrow and sidewinder) load-out and a nice mix of A-A and A-G ordnance (Am I correct??).

 

I would still really enjoy strike missions in the F-14B without LANTIRN, but I would enjoy if even more with it.

 

My 2 cents,

 

Nick

[Jowen G. Bruère-Dawson]

fishbed is multirole too

 

and the f-14 is so old tech it takes a second person to work the radar! literally ww2 operation :P

 

 

Muh !? i don't agree with that xD

F-15E : twin seat

Mirage 2000D : twin seat

Su-24 : twin seat..

 

Not WWII operations. Just need another man to control all the radar and weapons systems.. F-15E is old tech to you ? ^^ Ok its not a 5gen but still..

[westr]

I'm praying for the LANTIRN to be incorporated, even if it's not upon initial release and further down the line. I just think it would be such a shame not to have it knowing how good a developer LN is. This is without doubt the module I've been hoping for the most. I would love it to be fully multirole, I can handle no JDAM but I'd like at least to be able to designate targets and drop LBG's.

[Darkbrotherhood7]

I'm praying for the LANTIRN to be incorporated, even if it's not upon initial release and further down the line. I just think it would be such a shame not to have it knowing how good a developer LN is. This is without doubt the module I've been hoping for the most. I would love it to be fully multirole, I can handle no JDAM but I'd like at least to be able to designate targets and drop LBG's.

Same!

[Tirak]

Yeah, sort of.

 

But by that metric (weapon variety), the Tomcat with LANTIRN will also be "less multi-role" than the MiG-21. LANTIRN equipped Tomcats still couldn't use rockets or any A-G missiles - just GBUs that could be self-directed.

 

That said, even a Tomcat without LANTIRN is a better multi-role fighter in my eyes (yes, biased eyes, but hear me out :)).

 

The real advantage of the Tomcat as a strike aircraft is it's payload, range, and self-defense capability.

 

When you put bombs on the MiG-21, you significantly compromise it's ability to perform A-A. Most of the MiG's weapons are rear-aspect and all are meant to be employed at close range. Plus, there are only 4 weapon pylons, that must be shared among any combination of A-A and A-G weapons.

 

The Tomcat can carry 8,000 lbs of bombs (about 4x the load of the MiG) and still carry 2 AIM-54Cs and 2 AIM-9Ms, giving it true A-A ability at long, medium, and short range. That sounds like a much more effective and rounded weapon than the MiG carrying a pair of 250 kg bombs and 2 R-3Rs/R-3S/R-13M1. Plus, after dropping it's bombs, the Tomcat could provide real CAP duties with capable and fearsome A-A missiles.

 

RADM Paul Gilchrist wrote in an article (hearsay - but moderately reliable hearsay) that a GE powered F-14 could carry four Mk84s, two AIM-54Cs, and two AIM-9Ms and still fly at over 600 knots at low altitude with military power alone - retaining a combat radius of 500 nm with that load. To me, that is real power projection!

 

It can fly a long way into enemy territory and deliver a heavy load of bombs with less demands upon the support system (CAP fighters, refueling assets) than most other fighters. It can also fly fast at low altitude over a long distance like a B-1B.

 

Adding LANTIRN would certainly widen the scope of operations by adding roles like FAC(A) and dramatically improving accuracy against a wide range of targets. Plus it would allow the F-14 to fly with fewer bombs and still have a better chance of destroying a target.

 

But even with a CCIP delivery, the Tomcat does offer something significant in the A-G role.

 

I expect that the F-14 will be configurable across a wide variety of load-outs (like in real life).

 

All 3D renders have the Phoenix pallets with BRU-32 bomb racks (and no sparrow recesses on the fuselage - likely a pending 3D fix ;)), but I expect that pallets will be removable on the module to allow the 4x4 (sparrow and sidewinder) load-out and a nice mix of A-A and A-G ordnance (Am I correct??).

 

I would still really enjoy strike missions in the F-14B without LANTIRN, but I would enjoy if even more with it.

 

My 2 cents,

 

Nick

 

I have to disagree with you concerning the Tomcat without LANTIRN and the MiG-21. The MiG can roll in and engage an entire column by bringing along with it rocket pods. It can go after enemy shipping with its Kh-66s, and has cluster munitions to boot. The Tomcat can only bring dumb bombs, and I don't believe I've ever seen it carry clusters. Without LANTIRN, and given the size of the map on which we play, anything the Tomcat can do in the strike role, the MiG can actually do better because it can pick the better weapon for the job.

 

With LANTIRN, the Tomcat becomes more flexible as it opens up high altitude precision strike, and LGBs are better at hitting moving targets than anything the MiG can muster. However the Tomcat as far as I'm aware, could only carry 4 GBUs, as I have never seen the Tomcat in a configuration hauling a greater number of GBU-12s or 54s, which really restricts how much damage a Tomcat can do during a strike. I'm not even really certain if we'll see a Tomcat configuration in which it hauls as many Mk. 82s as it can, given that I don't believe that was ever actually used, and there is a vocal minority of rivet counters here who are adverse to... i'll be nice and say extrapolation.

Edited April 14, 2016 by Tirak

[BlackLion213]

The Tomcat can only bring dumb bombs, and I don't believe I've ever seen it carry clusters.

 

Here ya go ;):

 

 

With LANTIRN, the Tomcat becomes more flexible as it opens up high altitude precision strike, and LGBs are better at hitting moving targets than anything the MiG can muster. However the Tomcat as far as I'm aware, could only carry 4 GBUs, as I have never seen the Tomcat in a configuration hauling a greater number of GBU-12s or 54s, which really restricts how much damage a Tomcat can do during a strike. I'm not even really certain if we'll see a Tomcat configuration in which it hauls as many Mk. 82s as it can, given that I don't believe that was ever actually used, and there is a vocal minority of rivet counters here who are adverse to... i'll be nice and say extrapolation.

 

MERs were under development when the Marine Corp was interested as a Phantom replacement.

 

 

Once the Marine Corp backed out citing cost, the development ceased.

 

I still don't think that the MiG-21 is a better multi-role aircraft. Maybe a MiG-21 with rockets is better at taking out a column of vehicles with rockets...maybe...

 

But in terms of the mission set of a multi-role "strike-fighter" - fight your way into enemy territory unescorted, destroy target, and return - the Tomcat is much more capable of that task. It would be better to have more than just iron or cluster bombs, but the advantages in speed (especially when loaded), range, sensors, and self-defense far outweigh the benefit of carrying a rocket pod for attacking one target type. Maybe call a rocket-armed MiG-21 a better ground-attack platform for attacking a vehicle column...I give that maybe...a weak/quiet maybe...

 

The Iraqis demonstrated that iron bombs are better anti-ship weapons against large ships than the Exocet (let alone the Kh-66).

 

Neither iron bombs or the Kh-66 are really good options for attacking a modern US/NATO warship - their SAM capability really demands a long-range fire-forget weapon like a Harpoon. For sinking a merchant vessel, either will do with odds favoring a large iron bomb. Yes, harder to hit with iron bombs, which is why you drop 4.

 

Lets test it out next year...you haven't sold me yet. :)

 

-Nick

[Tirak]

Lets test it out next year...you haven't sold me yet. :)

 

-Nick

 

We'll have to find a MiG-21 pilot to test it against since once the Tomcat goes live, i expect that'll be the only plane I fly :lol:

 

I'm a little worried though as to LN's approach to weapons capabilities. All the test squadron weapons are out, but I wonder if the MER loadouts are out as well, and furthermore, if they're not, will we be able to roll in with more than just 4 GBUs? I'm afraid I've become a bit spoiled by BMS Israel's Sufa, so bringing only 4 GBUs or 2 GBUs and 2 CBUs feels a bit anemic for mud moving.

[Beamscanner]

fishbed is multirole too

 

and the f-14 is so old tech it takes a second person to work the radar! literally ww2 operation :P

 

You clearly have no idea what your talking about..

 

The AWG-9 was by far the most advanced fighter radar system of it's day, and one of the largest fighter radars ever. Even the F-15's APG-63 couldn't match it. The AWG-9 held it's title up to the release of the APG-70 (digital upgrade to the APG-63), but after that the APG-71 (digital upgrade to the AWG-9, on the F-14D) took that title again..

 

The APG-71(enhanced AWG-9) is still considered one of the best slotted planar array fighter radars ever built. Only out performed by the modern PESA/AESA designs. (even then, a lot of PESA radars don't match the detection range of the APG-71)

Edited April 15, 2016 by Beamscanner

[probad]

my post was meant to chide didilman's implication that the 14, by virtue of simply being a more modern design than the 21, was going to improve his groundpounding success.

 

maybe i should put some nice big disclaimers and then make you sign an eula to read my post next time so you can more clearly have an idea what i'm talking about??????

Edited April 15, 2016 by probad

[Reflected]

Isn't Friday usually "update-day"? :)

[tkid]

okay its friday.....where is the update...or are they going to wait until its 11.59pm going into Saturday :(

[BlackLion213]

okay its friday.....where is the update...or are they going to wait until its 11.59pm going into Saturday :(

 

Leatherneck did not give an updated timeline, except to say that their planned video and update are delayed. I wouldn't focus on the end of this week. It could drop at any time, but hard to know when.

 

-Nick

[probad]

this time cobra has learned his lesson and gave no eta

 

there is no eta so don't try to put an eta into his mouth

[Whiplash]

Perhaps an update with in a pending update :dunno:

 

Hey we already know he's a fan of inception!

[Beamscanner]

my post was meant to chide didilman's implication that the 14, by virtue of simply being a more modern design than the 21, was going to improve his groundpounding success.

 

maybe i should put some nice big disclaimers

 

Maybe you should use "/s" or "j/k" like the rest internet and not assume people can interpret your text any other way then what it spells out.

 

and then make you sign an eula to read my post next time so you can more clearly have an idea what i'm talking about??????

 

Ah yes, the 'you can't/didn't read' response. Apparently you are upset and don't know how to control your emotions.

 

Obviously, I couldn't have responded the way I did without having read your post in the first place.

[Muppetlord]

Internet rules are important people. Don't assume that everyone understands your sarcasm.

[Custard]

Maybe you should use "/s" or "j/k" like the rest internet

Defeats the whole point of sarcasm imho.

[Muppetlord]

Defeats the whole point of sarcasm imho.

 

Well it's either that or risking pissing someone off.

 

Sarcasm doesn't work as well in text as it does in real life.