Rig upgraded but no fps gain

[Mustang]

I notice that the GTX 650 is 128 bit bandwidth, that alone is enough to ruin FPS.

[Dusty Rhodes]

What Mustang said. ;)

[Mrgud]

tobyeez - I didn't sped too much.

 

OK guys, we are going in wrong direction right now. I NOW that this card is not high-end card, but it should be better that my old 9600gt and it seems that it isn't working like it should right now. Can anyone please help me with that instead of convicing me that this card can't do better? I see that except the core (which works at 100% but at lower clock), other components works on some 40% so there must be to make it in a balance. And as C84 said, he has 35-60fps on medium settings with this card (if I remember correctly).

[shagrat]

You don't happen to have vsync on? Either in DCS or enforced in Nvidia driver settings?

[Mrgud]

No, I don't think it would help me getting more fps. It can get only worse in my opinion but I can try.

 

Any sugestions how to force my card to work faster (as it should by default)?

 

Can it be BIOS, or something with the drivers went wrong? How is it possible that CPU-Z doesn't see anything about my card except the name and RAM quantity?

[shagrat]

Correct. Vsync can degrade fps like hell... asked if you might accidentally have it on.

[Mrgud]

OK, I had to do something, so I gradually increased GPU core clock and monitor the temperature. I eventually ended at 910mhz (max) but that still isn't even default speed (1058mhz). But finally I got improvement in fps by 10+. The temperature and the voltage are the same, and the fan is working at 60% so I think it's not dangerous. As I though, new GPU must be at least 30% faster than old one, and if I could make it run at 1058mhz it would be. I finally could set some of the options at medium and still have around 25 fps which is minimum for smooth playing.

 

Obviously something is wrong with the firmware or software so PLEASE take a moment and try to think what could be the answer because this segment is out of my league!

 

Thanks in advance!

 

:helpsmilie:

 

 

@C84 - what is your GPU's clock speed?

Edited October 1, 2014 by Mrgud

[neuwb]

Your BIOS might not recognize the CPU properly and tries to run it with the wrong presets. Check the retailers website for BIOS update instructions (and follow them carefully!).

[Mrgud]

You mean CPU or GPU? I was thinking about BIOS update but my mother board is Intel DP43TF and I heard that it has been some problems with this particular M/B BIOS update (very risky) so that would be my last option if even than I decide to do that.

[Archer7]

The fact that you gain about 50% performance when you turn the resolution down (I understood that correctly, right?) suggests to me that you are GPU-limited. Does anyone agree?

 

Generally, but:

"Such a significant graphics card update without fps increase points towards the graphics card not being the issue at all."

A 650 isn't extremely far behind 700-cards and 700 cards with a more modern i5/i7 will run the game max all settings at 40-60 fps.

Edited October 3, 2014 by Archer7

[shagrat]

Just did some research on that GTX650.

Unfortunately the 650 is a pretty bad designed Kepler based card! If you compare the 650 to a 660 ti on the nvidia homepage(!), it has about half the GPU performance, a third of the shaders, and if it happens to be the 1GB variant a lag of memory as well.

In the usual magazine tests its overall performance was very disappointing! Just double the GPU performance does not guarantee double FPS.

Even compared to a GT9800 the pixel rate is even slightly worse(!)

Texture rate is the same and Texture Mapping Units 32 compared 56(?) on a GT9800... bottomline, depending on what is needed to render a scene (high amount of textures, large resolution, lots of objects, etc.) it may even perform worse than the GT9800... unfortunately. :(

Edited October 4, 2014 by shagrat

[Mrgud]

Hi guys,

 

I took some time and tested the card and it turns out that this card is either damaged or some kind of weaker version of GTX 650.

 

The card has 96 CUDA cores instead of 384, Texture fillrate is 5.6 GTexel/s instead of 33.9, Memory Bandwidth is 51.2GB/s instead of 80.0, Core is working at 700mhz instead of 1058 and Memory is working at 800mhz instead of 1250!

 

Anyway, I managed to sell it before I stuck with it. So I guess that I have learned my lesson on buying on ebay:

 

-everything about the product HAS to be written. There is no room for assumptions of any kind.

[Kuky]

er... so you sold a faulty card? I hope you were honest about it when you sold it and whoever bought it knows about it, otherwise you just shifted your bad experience with it on someone else ;)

[Corrigan]

For what it's worth, it seems more likely to me that it's your BIOS or motherboard that couldn't run the card correctly.

[Mrgud]

er... so you sold a faulty card? I hope you were honest about it when you sold it and whoever bought it knows about it, otherwise you just shifted your bad experience with it on someone else ;)

 

I was honest and I gave it for the good price. The guy who bought it plays Counter Strike and the card will be sufficient for that. I contacted him later and he says that the card works like on my PC so it's the card that has issues but he is very satisfied with it. :)

[shagrat]

Hi guys,

 

I took some time and tested the card and it turns out that this card is either damaged or some kind of weaker version of GTX 650.

 

The card has 96 CUDA cores instead of 384, Texture fillrate is 5.6 GTexel/s instead of 33.9, Memory Bandwidth is 51.2GB/s instead of 80.0, Core is working at 700mhz instead of 1058 and Memory is working at 800mhz instead of 1250!

 

Anyway, I managed to sell it before I stuck with it. So I guess that I have learned my lesson on buying on ebay:

 

-everything about the product HAS to be written. There is no room for assumptions of any kind.

It seems to be a GeForce GT630 ! That matches all specs you listed, somebody sold you a different card than a GTX650... well, ebay as usual. As long as they earn some profit from the auctions, they tolerate a lot of frauds and cheaters. Most private buyers can't afford to sue cheaters, so virtually no risk, other than a bad reputation :(

[Corrigan]

It seems to be a GeForce GT630 ! That matches all specs you listed, somebody sold you a different card than a GTX650... well, ebay as usual. As long as they earn some profit from the auctions, they tolerate a lot of frauds and cheaters. Most private buyers can't afford to sue cheaters, so virtually no risk, other than a bad reputation :(

 

Good find!

[cichlidfan]

That certainly explains a lot.

[Soulres]

What clock speed are your RAM sticks, Couldnt help but notice that your "Upgrade" has DDR2 RAM aswell.it could explain why you are not getting much gain or it could be your Motherboard having issues as DDR2 is pretty dated and im wondering if your upgrade parts are having compatibility issues.

[Mrgud]

My RAM works at 400mhz x2 (800mhz). The sticks are even the same brand as old ones. I don't think that is it, because the card work exactly the same in new owner's PC. I have bad fps because the GPU is bottleneck at the moment. As I said, when I overclocked "GTX 650" to 900mhz, I gained some 10fps right away, so everything is clear now.

 

shagrat, very good find, thanks a lot! Because I'm still in touch with ebay seller, and I will tell him your discovery!

 

But, that particular card is obviously some mix of GTX 650 snd 630.

 

I use my old 9600GT now, but I reduced resolution to 1024x768 and I have 30-35 fps on some medium settings (view distance at high) so I can fly the MiG until I get new card (but not from ebay).

 

EDIT: Since I mentioned new GPU, I was thinking about 750 TI (in that case I don't have to change the power supply) or 660 TI but it needs 150W and I have SL-500 power supply so I don't know would my PSU be able to manage it.

 

I used http://www.extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp to calculate my current power consumption and I get some 280W (330W recommended) and when I changed to GTX 660 TI, the result was 400W (480W recommended). But that result is a little bit strange because my 9600GT needs 95W so 660 TI should be some 55W more (not 120W). I know that for 660 TI you need 450W PSU (and I have 500W), but I think that my PSU is some no-name and I'm not sure if it'ss smart to test it with that card.

 

What is your opinion on those two cards (750 TI vs. 660 TI)? I only play DCS.

Edited October 7, 2014 by Mrgud

[shagrat]

Honestly, I would live with the 9600 until DCS World introduced EDGE and wait on performance results here before investing in a GPU right now!

I know it is hard to wait, but it does make sense.

If you need a GPU now, consider the 660ti and think about a new PSU in the mid term... The current one should be ok, though. If you have multiple HDD, consider reducing to a single one. Don't connect unused USB devices etc. All helps reduce unnecessary load on the PSU.

As yours is 500w peak performance, it should be capable of handling 400w regular load...

[shagrat]

...and about "regular" load. Neither CPU nor GPU should require 100% power at all times. I ran a GTX 660 2GB RAM with a 480 W (80+ Bronze) and had no problems at all...

[Mrgud]

I didn't think to buy new GPU right now because I'm out of money. That step would come in a few months (december/january) and I hope that EDGE will be released till then. But I was just curious about those two cards I mentioned.

 

As I said before, I'm still in contact with the ebay seller and, if I understood them right, they want to make up for my loss and offering to send a new card. Only thing I have to pay is 25 dollars shipping + taxes which are high in Croatia (25%), but only if items worth exceeds 20 euros. So, maybe I could get new card which will work as it should (GTX 650) or some degenerated card like one I bought earlier for just 25 dollars. But even that degenerated card, when OC-ed at 900mhz was better than my 9600GT.

 

Regards the PSU, I have some devices connected to my USB (Track IR5, Wireless LAN and phantom powered external sound card (because I'm a musician) but all of this shouldn't be significant load to the PSU. I have only one HDD and the rest is standard PC.

[Soulres]

My RAM works at 400mhz x2 (800mhz)

Thats your problem right there...This game NEEDS RAM like we need Oxygen and Just becuase you have 8GB of it, doesnt mean itll run faster,Im guessing you got the cheap Low-End cost RAM to save money but your getting pooped on by the clock speeds,Get higher speed stick of RAM. Even just a 4gb stick will be faster than what you got now.

 

And just a warning , EDGE is comming out SOON. and if you barely pull 30fps Now,When EDGE is released your going to be having a issue.

Im getting a New MB that has DDR3 Ramslots,AMD Fx6300,spending 43$ on 4gb stick of Corsair Ram that clocks at 1600mhz along with a MSI Radeon R9 270X

,Powersupply,1Tb harddrive and a extra blue fan for 447$. Im sure if you post a budget on here,People will help you build a PC thatll be perfect for the next 10 years for under 400$

[Corrigan]

 

And just a warning , EDGE is comming out SOON. and if you barely pull 30fps Now,When EDGE is released your going to be having a issue.

 

Can you say "conjecture"?