Solving Ghosting/Stuttering in WMR - Not all 45fps are created equal - ED Forums
 


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Old 09-23-2018, 06:06 PM   #1
Wazoo
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Default Solving Ghosting/Stuttering in WMR - Not all 45fps are created equal

I'm starting this thread for those, like me, who are relatively new to VR, own a Windows Mixed Reality headset (I use the Samsung Odyssey) and are unaware or not entirely fluent in this whole arena of Asynchronous Space Warp (for the Oculus) or its "equivalent" in the WMR world: Motion Reprojection.

As a side note, I am well aware that this has been discussed in some threads, but I only recently discovered this solution after watching a YouTube video. Hopefully a dedicated thread will help others easily find it with a search here.

So... on to the problem I was having....

I have, I think by most current standards. a pretty beefy rig: as of this writing, an OC'd i-7700k, 32gig of fast RAM, a NMVe drive, and a 1080ti GPU. Without a drop in framerate as measured by the internal DCS FPS meter, I was showing a pretty steady 45fps even when running with the default "High" settings.

However, I was noticing an annoying graphics anomaly that happened during "fast" movement across by field of vision: what I would describe as ghosting of images (although I use "stuttering" in the subject field for searchability reasons, I'm not sure if this is best described that way as while this anomaly is occuring, my fps stays at a steady 45). This was most easily replicated by doing a low-level, high-g turn whilst looking at the ground below the wing. Vehicles, buildings, or trees, which moved fluidly while off my nose, suddenly looked terrible. I also got this during dogfighting when an enemy aircraft zoomed right past me. I tried messing with all the graphics options (everything from Pixel Density, to shadows, to AA and Anisotropic filtering), but nothing solved this particular problem.

Here is where I hope someone else learns from my admitted stupidity and misunderstanding of what is called Motion Reprojection. My *basic* understanding is that if your computer can't render for your headset at its native Hz rating (90 hz on the Samsung) with a matching fps (90 fps for the Samsung), the system drops your fps to half your Hz rating (thus 45 for the Odyssey) and software and/or hardware interpolates frames to get you to the equivalent of 90fps thus matching the headset refresh rate and making for a butter-smooth VR experience.

My major mistake was thinking that because I was almost always showing 45fps, Motion Reprojection was activated so I never gave it another thought as I figured it was an automatic kick-in kinda thing. I was wrong.

I discovered how to turn it on while watching a video on YouTube made by SweViver. I never heard of him, but after surfing for Pimax reviews, I ran across his channel. Anyway, he has a video on this particular subject which has changed my DCS life. In a nutshell, and you can see it for yourself in the link below, you need to turn on Motion Reprojection by doing a simple text edit of a config file. After learning this, I did a more targeted search here in the forums and found mention of this buried deep in a few threads; thus the reason for making this thread.

This *completely* solved my issue and now has me re-evaluating whether to pull the trigger on a 2080ti as, without a Pimax headset running 5k or 8k, I'm not sure if I'll see a substantial improvement over what I am now seeing with my 1080ti.... although I'll wait to see if others can hit 90fps without Motion Reprojection before I make a final decision.

Anyway... I know this is not an entirely original fix, but I'm hoping this helps those with WMR sets who are not entirely comfortable with this new frontier.

-Paul

Link to Video: https://youtu.be/F9n2tyHCoDw
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Old 09-25-2018, 02:28 PM   #2
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I downloaded the steam VR Beta client and edited the file following instructions from this link:
https://steamcommunity.com/games/719...33167137673234

I'm sad to say that it did NOT resolve the issue as you describe above for me. I too noticed the ghosting/stuttering - especially when moving my head back and forth rapidly in the cockpit.

I was "upgrading' from a rift to the Samsung and although the visuals were WAY Better in the Odyssey, for me that ghosting issue was a show stopper.
Additionally the "sweet spot" in the Odyssey was so small that I had a hard time keeping the headset positioned in the exact correct spot. After a few moments (especially when looking down at the cockpit) i noticed the headset would shift slightly and everything would be out of focus again.

I really wanted to keep the Odyssey, but these two issues were enough to warrant the return to amazon.
After putting the rift back on the colors are now desaturated and not as crisp, but the smoothness with ASW and the bigger sweet spot were a welcome return.

only my .02 cents.
I think if I spent enough time messing with the strap I could have overcome the sweet spot issue and i'm sure in time they will fix the ASW, but for now I'm back in the rift.
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Old 09-25-2018, 04:37 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epolta View Post
I downloaded the steam VR Beta client and edited the file following instructions from this link:
https://steamcommunity.com/games/719...33167137673234

I'm sad to say that it did NOT resolve the issue as you describe above for me. I too noticed the ghosting/stuttering - especially when moving my head back and forth rapidly in the cockpit.

I was "upgrading' from a rift to the Samsung and although the visuals were WAY Better in the Odyssey, for me that ghosting issue was a show stopper.
Additionally the "sweet spot" in the Odyssey was so small that I had a hard time keeping the headset positioned in the exact correct spot. After a few moments (especially when looking down at the cockpit) i noticed the headset would shift slightly and everything would be out of focus again.

I really wanted to keep the Odyssey, but these two issues were enough to warrant the return to amazon.
After putting the rift back on the colors are now desaturated and not as crisp, but the smoothness with ASW and the bigger sweet spot were a welcome return.

only my .02 cents.
I think if I spent enough time messing with the strap I could have overcome the sweet spot issue and i'm sure in time they will fix the ASW, but for now I'm back in the rift.
Two things I'm curious about: first... you mention the SteamVR beta. Did you activate the Windows Mixed Reality for SteamVR Beta? I'm sure you did, but for clarity sakes, they are two different things. Took me awhile to figure that one out.

Second, how long ago did you do this as I see you returned your Odyssey? I know there have been multiple, recent updates to WMR for SteamVR and I can only speak to the most recent version.

One thing is for sure, VR has a long way to go to make it "plug and play" for the masses....
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Old 09-25-2018, 05:45 PM   #4
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hey Wazoo,

The Odyssey is in the box headed to Amazon today. I did the setup and testing over the weekend. It really kills me because the vis was so MUCH better in the Odyssey. Pretty sure I did Steam VR for mixed reality beta - as I had the file on my hard drive to edit with notepad ++.

Man oh man what pain to get that windows mixed reality setup too? Over 3 hours of updating windows and then rebooting computer only to have the setup process seemingly fail or stuck on "hang tight".

After all that the visuals were worth the pain, but I couldn't get over the sweet spot or ASW.
I'm so tempted to give it another shot, but my time is limited and the Rift just WORKS out of the box....

thanks for posting this for others to see.
Maybe you could take it one step further with a step by step guide.
so many moving pieces. Steam VR beta, windows MR beta... yada yada...

cheers!
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Old 09-25-2018, 10:58 PM   #5
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I had issues with the Odyssey when I first got it. Then I redid the face mask which brought the unit closer to my head. Much bigger sweet spot, wider FOV, and I was able to take off my glasses. Made all the difference in the world. Try taking off the foam ring. If that works for You I have a thread here that shows what I did. Cheap and easily.
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Old 10-06-2018, 11:21 AM   #6
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I find i need to force it on for it to work but the result is just amazing, 45 fps that feels like 90 with 0 ghosting
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Old 10-08-2018, 11:51 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trigen View Post
I find i need to force it on for it to work but the result is just amazing, 45 fps that feels like 90 with 0 ghosting
Force it on? Please explain.
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Old 10-10-2018, 09:57 PM   #8
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Edit steam\steamapps\common\MixedRealityVRDriver\resources\settings\default.vrsettings

Make sure this line is set to motionvector and not auto and ofcourse remove the // infront of it.

"motionReprojectionMode" : "motionvector",

uncomment this one too"motionReprojectionTemporalEnabled" : true, I havent really done any testing with it but performance is fine so

Feels just like 90 fps to me. I got it on in X plane too, amazing there as well.

Can copy/paste

Code:
{
    "driver_Holographic" : {
        "renderTargetScale" : 1.0
    },
    "driver_Holographic_Experimental" : {
        // Motion reprojection doubles framerate through motion vector extrapolation 
        //     motionvector = force application to always run at half framerate with motion vector reprojection
        //     auto         = automatically use motion reprojection when the application can not maintain native framerate
         "motionReprojectionMode" : "motionvector",

        // Automatic motion reprojection indicator to display the mode currently selected
        //     green      = off because application can render at full framerate
        //     light blue = on because application is cpu bound
        //     dark blue  = on because application is gpu bound
        //     red        = off because application running at less than half framerate
         "motionReprojectionIndicatorEnabled" : true,
        
        // Use temporal history to get higher quality motion vectors.  motionReprojectionMode must be set to 'auto' or 
        // 'motionvector' for this setting to have an affect.
        "motionReprojectionTemporalEnabled" : true,
        
        // Some people may experience increased discomfort such as nausea, motion sickness, dizziness,
        // disorientation, headache, fatigue, or eye strain when using thumbstick controls in Windows Mixed Reality.
        "thumbstickControlsEnabled" : false, // true = use thumbsticks for artificial turn/move, false = default application thumbstick behavior
        "thumbstickControlsReversed" : false,
        "thumbstickTurnSmooth" : false,
        "thumbstickDeadzone" : 0.25
    },
    "NoInterEyeRotation" : {
        "DOOMVFRx64.exe" : true
    }
}
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Last edited by trigen; 10-10-2018 at 10:06 PM.
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Old 10-13-2018, 05:15 PM   #9
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I just gave it a try.

At high altitudes it worked and the cockpit felt amazing/absolutly smooth(locked 45fps), but I still have double vision on the ground. (~25fps)
And when zooming in/out on the map, the whole image is garbage for me. :/

But I also had shadows on low and not on flat, so maybe that's the difference.
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Old 10-14-2018, 04:48 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [de].Impact View Post
I just gave it a try.

At high altitudes it worked and the cockpit felt amazing/absolutly smooth(locked 45fps), but I still have double vision on the ground. (~25fps)
And when zooming in/out on the map, the whole image is garbage for me. :/

But I also had shadows on low and not on flat, so maybe that's the difference.
Thats your computer not being up to the task im afraid. Going to have to lower your settings
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