Mouse Cursor + Head Cursor + reticle

Hey ED,

Since the 2.0.2 update with VR content (VR tab and VR settings), i've been toying around with all the options a lot.

I first got used to the "LookAt" cursor, which was fine for me, except for side panels (Startup + Some radio tweakings were a pain).

Than, with the Mouse as Cursor option, i got used to moving it in "3D" space, so mixing the Mouse cursor and the LookAt. Which works great!

Recently, I've been flying the Northdrop F5E-3 a lot (almost exclusively, actually) and have quite enjoyed it. nearing the 50hours of flight time, i'm used to all the systems and procedures by now, and since this is a very manual plane, i use the Mouse Cursor to click things around in the cockpit, a lot.

Now, i'm right handed, so my mouse resides near my Joystick (between my legs). I tried the Mouse to the left (near throttle), but it's just not viable. In a real situation, the left hand will quite easily move from throttle to weapon's management or HUD in a matter of seconds. In VR tho... not so much.

Long story short:

A Suggestion to make the system work even better (imo):

On mouse movement; move the mouse cursor around the cockpit how it is (I like the headset view boundaries options btw).

After a brief delay, the mouse cursor disappears right now. Instead, have it reappear at the center screen (Look At), with a very low opacity factor (Perhaps offer the option in the VR menu tab).

This allows the user to do all the checks and manual startup procedures, set the radio and so on, with the Mouse.

But while in flight, when it's time to FenceOut; Switch MasterArmOn, activate bomb release setting, unlock fuses, and select pilones... while maintaining formation flight. It gets a little tedious to work the throttle, adjust flight with the stick, hold the mouse and look down the cockpit.

The "reset to center view" reticle (with very low opacity, as desired) would rectify this somewhat. Mapping a Left and Right Mouse button on the Throttle or Joystick (I have mine set to CoolieHat Switch up/down). Although i cannot "see" the reticle right now (which is the reason for this loooong post), i can look around the cockpit rapidly, and somewhat select the right instruments and right/left click as desired. This is a lot better than the Mouse Selection option in these circumstances.

I would also suggest using the same cursor as the Menu (white circle) instead of the big cross. Although quite subjective of course. Perhaps allow the option int he menu to choose between multiple cursor types for personal preferences?

So, in simpler terms:

• Keep Mouse Cursor Operational
  
• Keep LookAt Cursor Operation
  
• On Mouse Movement: reticle becomes bright and engaging.
  
• On Mouse Movement halt (same timing as currently), Cursor disappears and Reappears, fadein, at centerscreen/lookat at very low opacity. So that LookAt is always available.
  
• Offer option for Opacity in VR Menu (including 0%, as it is now).
  
• Offer option for Cursor type (cross or dot) in VR menu (or elsewhere).
  

Cheers,

I like this... I'll add a couple things though.

Once the cursor has "re-centered" after a period of no mouse movement it should disappear as it does now BUT...

First press of the mapped "left click" button should not act as left button but as "show cursor". Second and subsequent presses would act as normal left click/right click.

I would LOVE a way to have a "head down" button. Even a "Head down/left" and "head down/right". I sit in a proper cockpit and I have a bit of trouble looking down far enough to get to switches that are far back on the right and left panels. Like the panel illumination dials and INS switches in the Mirage. Also the lower right switches in the BlackShark as well as the engine RPM lever on the bottom left.

I feel it should work something like a snap view but be a "temporary re-center" instead. So when you press down/right on the view hat it just temporarily re-assign's the center to a "snap view like" VR setting.

Procedurally...

You would get your center aimed where you want it via looking there then press a "assign VR Snap View" just like you currently do with regular snap views. I would imagine one would only need two. They could even be statically assigned as +/- 80-100 degrees horizontally and -45 vertically so they can't be abused for check 6 functionality.

I like this... I'll add a couple things though.

 

I would LOVE a way to have a "head down" button. Even a "Head down/left" and "head down/right". I sit in a proper cockpit and I have a bit of trouble looking down far enough to get to switches that are far back on the right and left panels. Like the panel illumination dials and INS switches in the Mirage. Also the lower right switches in the BlackShark as well as the engine RPM lever on the bottom left.

Since I have steel rods and screws in my neck I have limited head movement. So what I do is if I have to look beyond my head movement is this:

Down: look up as far as I can then recenter view button, look down again.

Left Down: Look up right then recenter view button, look left down again.

Essentially look the opposite way you want to look then recenter view button, and then look the way you want to again.

When done look forward and recenter view button

Miles

For sure... I do that now as well but having a definable "Snap re-center" would be a huge help.

How about a "Head motion amplification" button? Would amplify the real world head movement by a small factor so that the game head would move to those extreme ares with the same effort as to looking down and right/left.

I see this mimicking how TrakIR currently works.

How about a "Head motion amplification" button? Would amplify the real world head movement by a small factor so that the game head would move to those extreme ares with the same effort as to looking down and right/left.

 

I see this mimicking how TrakIR currently works.

It works in TrackIR because your brain knows it's fake movement. In VR, I imagine it'll make you sicker than a dog.

New to DCS but have used VR for a while and agree the mouse cursor is a problem in VR. I have the mouse movement bound to my controller and can move it independently of "look at", but it still moves with the HMD as well, so it can be tricky. My comments are based on the Harrier cockpit.

My observations:

- Its a little hit and miss because the mouse cursor can wobble off the button hit box with slight head movement. Can be frustrating for the hard to reach buttons e.g. DECS switch.

- The cursor disappears after a few seconds. Good for immersion, but frustrating when trying to keep the head still to click a button. Have to then realign the cursor. I ideally needs the option to keep the cursor on screen until expressly dismissed.

- Despite selecting "keep mouse cursor in window" option, still find it is possible to hit the Win 10 taskbar and loose game focus. The Alt + enter (full screen mirror) option helps, but then the cursor will centre outside the cockpit (next point).

- Can center the mouse cursor in the cockpit using Voice Attack. Works reasonably well with the default mirror, just say "center crosshair" and it moves to the cursor to the centre of active window. However, it does not work well when using a full screen mirror as the centre of the screen is then outside the cockpit.

As for suggestions (and I accept I only have a few hours in the Harrier cockpit in VR), mine would be:

- consider making the "use mouse" option in VR 100% independent of the HMD head tracking. ATM its a hybrid (i.e. partially independent). This would solve the head wobble problem and the hit box issue mentioned below. If the hybrid is kept then those issues remain.

- increase the time before the mouse cursor disappears or allow it to remain until actively dismissed.

- increase the size of the hit box around the switches (dials are ok). For switches, I like to see a small square or circle painted around the switch when it has mouse focus. Anywhere within the square or circle is clickable. ATM there is a narrow two way green arrow which is really hard to keep still in VR because of head wobble.

- default centre mouse cursor when recalled after fading, so its always in the centre of my HMD (where I'm looking) when needed. This may not work if the mouse cursor is 100% independent of head tracking, but I could live with that because at least the mouse cursor would be where I left it, so my problem.

Cheers.

Move the taskbar to the right side vertical and most of your issues are solved. Also consider having a trackball on your knee. Don’t forget you can use VoiceAttack to make the cursor appear anywhere you like by setting pixel coordinates.

Thanks BigDuke6ixx. Did consider both solutions.

I didn't want to move the task bar because it means changing other stuff on my set up, but I agree this could work. Just reluctant to change my set up for one game.

As for using VA to move the cursor to specified pixel co-ordinates, couldn't get this to work in VR because the pixel co-ordinates returned by VA were for the mirror which uses different coordinates depending on the screen, resolution, etc. Was only able to get accurate readings for generic locations like center of active window, etc. Did you have success setting the pixel co-ordinates for the HMD (screens)? Maybe I need to fiddle with it some more.

Noticed that a few players favour a track ball, so may be worth a look, although I'm not having problems moving the mouse with my controller. Main problem IMO is that it disappears after a few seconds and is susceptible to head wobble because its still tied to head tracking in the HMD (even though the mouse option is selected in the VR game settings).

You can put the taskbar back after you finish with DCS. The pixel coordinates seems to work fine for me as long as the mirror is windowed.

It works in TrackIR because your brain knows it's fake movement. In VR, I imagine it'll make you sicker than a dog.

Make it an option then sickly types can opt out. VR zoom makes some people sick but that’s still in there.

Thanks BigDuke, will give it try.

Also update - since my first post have mapped the left and right mouse clicks onto my controller so can click cockpit buttons quickly and don't have to rely on VA. Much better. So shaping up - losing the mouse cursor is really the main problem ATM.

Touchpad mounted in front of the throttle. If you keep your finger on the pad the cursor doesn’t move with your head. I’ve flown with this thing for about 20 hours now and it works great. I usually use my trackball for startup but once in flight it’s all touchpad.

For reference. https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=207386