Regarding the Iranian Tomcat and some points

Since it was stated that there would be a special variant of the Iranian F-14, would that be the F-14AM?

If so would it contain any of these possible upgrades? http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread1065315/pg1

The link states that not only does it have an all new digital upgrade for the AWG-9 Radar, but also an Iranian built version of the Pheonix missile which is supposedly better than the original one (I'm sure this missile can't be made for DCS for obvious classification reasons)

But I'm curious, what can be incorporated that is different or possibly better than the standard F-14A (except for the lack of a TV camera)?

There's no proof the AM even exists, let alone concrete data on it.

More than likely they mean the downgraded F-14A's Iran got in the late 70's.

Abovetopsecret.com? Immediately false.

Abovetopsecret.com? Immediately false.

That is exactly like saying "His name is foreigner, everything he say is a lie!"

Ok but I'm just curious to know what the Iranian F-14 might have since it would be notable different from the standard F-14A

Ok but I'm just curious to know what the Iranian F-14 might have since it would be notable different from the standard F-14A

Detuned radar that is missing certain modes, degraded ECM equipment, more fussy engines, no Aim-9L/M capability

To name a few

1. The AM "Exists", in Reporting.

2. There are no Concrete specs on the AM

3. Their F-14 Fleet is about as bad as the USMC Legacy Hornet Fleet.

The media is skeptical, as no concrete information is available anywhere, there's no work orders, parts orders, anything,

The Engines were supposedly Upgraded, yet they retained the old flawed TF-30 Exhausts?, Sorry, no.

The troops deployed to that area that have seen the Asian Minor AMs flying even said the engines still sound like the TF30s.

The AIM-54A+ Missile is a hoax, the batteries supplied to Iran for the AIM54s have since been depleted, and replacement parts for both the Tomcat and the AIM-54 were blocked from being sold to Iran.

 

3. Their F-14 Fleet is about as bad as the USMC Legacy Hornet Fleet.

 

That's not half bad honestly, I was expecting much worse for them.

Also how about no covers for the mid air refueling probes, almost all Iranian Tomcats appear to be missing those. Take a look here.....

I think it would also add to the details of how weathered and beaten these planes are

They will probably have a Skin for them though

There is also a case of Iranian F-14s carrying Russian and probably Chinese missiles too.

Here's a few shots of what looks like an R-27 on the F-14....

And in this one I'm not sure but it appears to be a SAM HAWK missile on the F-14..

There is also a case of Iranian F-14s carrying Russian and probably Chinese missiles too.

 

Here's a few shots of what looks like an R-27 on the F-14....

 

 

And in this one I'm not sure but it appears to be a SAM HAWK missile on the F-14..

 

Mounting them to the Pylon and actually able to fire them are 2 different things.

That's not half bad honestly, I was expecting much worse for them.

 

Also how about no covers for the mid air refueling probes, almost all Iranian Tomcats appear to be missing those. Take a look here.....

 

 

I think it would also add to the details of how weathered and beaten these planes are

They started taking them and leaving them off USN Birds

Detuned radar that is missing certain modes, degraded ECM equipment, more fussy engines, no Aim-9L/M capability

 

To name a few

The IIAF F-14As were nearly identical to the USN F-14As of the time (as manufactured). The differences you described are correct, but reflect the mid-1970s configuration of the F-14A. The ECM was downgraded slightly and I believe the AWG-9 lacked some ACM auto-acquisition modes, but things were otherwise the same. The engine was the 414 variety (latest model available) and included mid-compression bypass iirc. The engines lacked the protective shroud and there may have been some mild tuning differences, but pretty similar to the definitive engines of the USN F-14A.

Iran was one of our closest allies of the time and the aircraft weren't downgraded in any meaningful way. The AIM-54A was one of the most classified weapons of the time and we sold them hundreds. The IIAF F-14s should be regarded as fully operational Tomcats, but not upgraded in any meaningful way since ~1976. That is the real limitation and a significant one.

1. The AM "Exists", in Reporting.

 

2. There are no Concrete specs on the AM

 

3. Their F-14 Fleet is about as bad as the USMC Legacy Hornet Fleet.

 

The media is skeptical, as no concrete information is available anywhere, there's no work orders, parts orders, anything,

 

The Engines were supposedly Upgraded, yet they retained the old flawed TF-30 Exhausts?, Sorry, no.

Well the engines were reported to be "upgraded TF30s" so they would look and fundamentally function the same. The USN was planning to add FADEC to the TF30 in the early 1980s since it would markedly improve engine stability during throttle transients and also help a bit with high AOA. Luckily they chose the F110 engine instead since it solved more issues (better thrust and spool up times).

Also, not aware of any "exhaust" problems. The exhaust petals were not a source of problems for the F-14. The USN didn't retain them for the F110 since engines are tuned around the burner cans to some extent. You wouldn't change the engine without also changing the afterburners and petals.

Still, it would no be a surprise if Iran integrated something like AFTC or FADEC as an upgrade. It would help with both maintainability and reliability, but unclear if anything was actually done.

The engines would be the easy part.....the AWG-9 stuff would be a whole other can of worms. I remain pretty skeptical of real upgrades to the IRIAF F-14As since replacing old analog components with digital is no small feat. Convincing these old avionics, sensors, INS, etc to speak to a new computer system would be a really complicated task. New databuses (like the USN) is less of an issue, but really upgrading the avionics and having them work would be really hard.

I personally think the "F-14AM" is a "paper" airplane with publicity photos, but no real improvements to its capability.

To be honest, just treading water on the F-14 fleet in the absence of parts and ancient technology could keep a lot of people really busy. Actually making significant improvements seems a bit too much imho.

-Nick

The IIAF F-14As were nearly identical to the USN F-14As of the time (as manufactured). The differences you described are correct, but reflect the mid-1970s configuration of the F-14A. The ECM was downgraded slightly and I believe the AWG-9 lacked some ACM auto-acquisition modes, but things were otherwise the same. The engine was the 414 variety (latest model available) and included mid-compression bypass iirc. The engines lacked the protective shroud and there may have been some mild tuning differences, but pretty similar to the definitive engines of the USN F-14A.

 

Iran was one of our closest allies of the time and the aircraft weren't downgraded in any meaningful way. The AIM-54A was one of the most classified weapons of the time and we sold them hundreds. The IIAF F-14s should be regarded as fully operational Tomcats, but not upgraded in any meaningful way since ~1976. That is the real limitation and a significant one.

 

 

 

 

Well the engines were reported to be "upgraded TF30s" so they would look and fundamentally function the same. The USN was planning to add FADEC to the TF30 in the early 1980s since it would markedly improve engine stability during throttle transients and also help a bit with high AOA. Luckily they chose the F110 engine instead since it solved more issues (better thrust and spool up times).

 

Also, not aware of any "exhaust" problems. The exhaust petals were not a source of problems for the F-14. The USN didn't retain them for the F110 since engines are tuned around the burner cans to some extent. You wouldn't change the engine without also changing the afterburners and petals.

 

Still, it would no be a surprise if Iran integrated something like AFTC or FADEC as an upgrade. It would help with both maintainability and reliability, but unclear if anything was actually done.

 

The engines would be the easy part.....the AWG-9 stuff would be a whole other can of worms. I remain pretty skeptical of real upgrades to the IRIAF F-14As since replacing old analog components with digital is no small feat. Convincing these old avionics, sensors, INS, etc to speak to a new computer system would be a really complicated task. New databuses (like the USN) is less of an issue, but really upgrading the avionics and having them work would be really hard.

 

I personally think the "F-14AM" is a "paper" airplane with publicity photos, but no real improvements to its capability.

 

To be honest, just treading water on the F-14 fleet in the absence of parts and ancient technology could keep a lot of people really busy. Actually making significant improvements seems a bit too much imho.

 

-Nick

More so i was meaning in comparison to the F-14A we're going to be getting (mid 80's, which by that time some improvements to the TF30's had made them easier to fly)

More so i was meaning in comparison to the F-14A we're going to be getting (mid 80's, which by that time some improvements to the TF30's had made them easier to fly)

Yes, that makes sense. :)

I certainly agree with you on that.

-Nick

That's not half bad honestly, I was expecting much worse for them.

 

Also how about no covers for the mid air refueling probes, almost all Iranian Tomcats appear to be missing those. Take a look here.....

 

 

I think it would also add to the details of how weathered and beaten these planes are

Iranian Tomcats were delivered without the refueling probe doors from the start.

I would imagine we are going to be getting a standard F-14A for the Iranian Cat. But I could be wrong. In any event I can't wait to fly missions in the SOH/Persian Gulf Map agains enemy Cats:)

I would imagine we are going to be getting a standard F-14A for the Iranian Cat. But I could be wrong. In any event I can't wait to fly missions in the SOH/Persian Gulf Map agains enemy Cats:)

It was stated by Nick that the Iranian F-14 would be a separate version, and on of the notable differences would be the removal of the TV camera as seen above in the picture

There is also a case of Iranian F-14s carrying Russian and probably Chinese missiles too.

 

Here's a few shots of what looks like an R-27 on the F-14....

 

 

And in this one I'm not sure but it appears to be a SAM HAWK missile on the F-14..

 

As I mentioned a couple of times before, usage of Russian missiles on Persian cats was just a test and never became operational, although I've seen some videos of scramble tomcats equipped with enhanced hawk missiles. besides, none of the engines on tomcats are changed, the only jet engine Iran is capable of producing is j-85 which is the one installed on f-5.

and after all, don't believe whatever you read on the internet about Iranian army, it's mostly propaganda, there's nothing called f-14AM !!!!! at best it's just an overhauled tomcat, not to mention that they can do nothing about structure fatigue!!!!

As I mentioned a couple of times before, usage of Russian missiles on Persian cats was just a test and never became operational, although I've seen some videos of scramble tomcats equipped with enhanced hawk missiles. besides, none of the engines on tomcats are changed, the only jet engine Iran is capable of producing is j-85 which is the one installed on f-5.

and after all, don't believe whatever you read on the internet about Iranian army, it's mostly propaganda, there's nothing called f-14AM !!!!! at best it's just an overhauled tomcat, not to mention that they can do nothing about structure fatigue!!!!

Thanks Atooyi, you're a real asset when it comes to the AliCats :)

One high G turn and the wings’ll fall off lol

Iranian Tomcats were delivered without the refueling probe doors from the start.

Nope. They had them installed. They did not refuel from soft basket carrier jets bad had to use the Iron maiden off their -707s and 747 tankers. They removed them just like the USN did for a time to remove the possibility of fodding an engine during A-A refueling. There is nothing special about it. Iran could manufacture thousands of those probe doors without any issue, it just isn't important as the jet is a publicity stunt and status symbol rather than a real threat to an adversary.

The USN routinely kept the doors off during combat ops when there were numerous and frequent AAR's.

Babak Taghvee who formerly worked in the Iranian defense industry on the F-5E/F projects recently did a report on a Oct 2017 Iranian exercise ( for Combat Aircraft) in Ishafan to test new weapons and tactics he says.

Doesn't mention anything new on the F-14s but does state (with photo of 3-6036) that the Tomcat not part of the exercise was sitting on QRA with live AIM-7E and AIM-9Js.

The project failed on both launching HAWK missile and R-27