Comms menu rework

A rework of the comms menu to make it look more like the wheel selector seen with Jester, would be very convenient.

The biggest issue I personally have with the AI comms is having to fumble for my keyboard to press the relevant F keys. If we could instead just look at the option we want and press a HOTAS button then using the comms menu would be much easier in both VR and 2D.

A wheel projected over the screen could be separated into 12 'slices' to represent the F1-12 keys.

As an additional wishlist item, this wheel menu could have a submenu for various head and hand signals. Allowing the pilot to quickly and easily use non verbal communication with their wingman, especially online.

Requested a thousand times already on this sub-forum

Nevertheless: +1 to overhauling the current comms menu and make it more VR friendly in use (many other good ideas have past here in all the "radio menu improvement wish" threads)

Not sure if anyone official from ED ever said anything on this matter. Very curious about their opinion

Just a quick mock up to help visualise, if needed.

I think the wheel is too visually obtrusive. I would prefer the F keys. They’re easy to use or click on and don’t clutter up the screen.

I think the wheel is too visually obtrusive. I would prefer the F keys. They’re easy to use or click on and don’t clutter up the screen.

Cluttering up the screen isnt a concern with the F keys, because you arent looking at the screen. You are instead looking around your sim kit to find your keyboard.

Just use your mouse?

If this is implemented please, please, please, make it optional. The Wheel is far too visually intrusive. The current design gives a "there if you need to look at it" effect. Especially so in VR.

At least, if one could iterate through the highlighted item in the comms menu with a hotas hat (or keyboard), that would be something nice. UP and DOWN iterate for selection, RIGHT to select, LEFT for prev menu. LEFT again to close the menu.

I should think in practice it would be far, far more translucent than Swift's example.

Indeed, if I were charged with designing this wheel properly I would have explored various colours and opacities. This was just a sketch model to explain the concept.

I wonder, do all the 'too obstructive' crowd also complain about the jester wheel? And also the point of this wheel is to speed up the use of the comms menu, so in practice you wouldnt have it open for more than a second or two, whereas the F menu requires you to keep it open whilst you fumble around. Much more intuitive to just 'point and click' so to say.

Just a quick mock up to help visualise, if needed.

God no terrible concept, how to really break immersion in VR

so for the radio menu, and i never use casual comms, use Voice Attack and also run the modifer to reduce the size of the F menu font. That ideally is the only modification it requires where the customer can choose the location of the menu on the screen and also the font size in the specials tab.

But a Jester wheel, yuck no thanks, super painful least currently its above your view line up in the top right. Bad enough we have to suffer the carrier ball pop up coming into the carrier.

I prefer the square minimum size look/formfactor of the current one, but it would be better if it was "windowed" and moveable (TBH this would be nice for kneeboards as well which dont even seem to be adjustable via viewports atm)

Bonus if you could adjust the translucency with a slider.

Honestly the thing I want most is the ability to contextually reuse controls. I use the comms hat on the Warthog to manage radio selection in the hornet, per the actual layout so it would be nice if once the radio window was open I could reuse the same hat to navigate the menu.

Theres a mod called DCSNav or there abouts that lets you do this but A) it needs its own hat switch and B) its an external app so the onscreen pointer doesnt consider the position of the text or the available options. If I could use the hat to browse the menu it would be great. I know I could drop some cash on voice attack, but it seems a very expensive solution to fix what is a pretty basic "quality of life" improvement to the system.

Cluttering up the screen isnt a concern with the F keys, because you arent looking at the screen. You are instead looking around your sim kit to find your keyboard.

A keyboard within easy reach is kinda essential. I don’t need to look for the keyboard, it’s in the same place it’s been all along. Plus you can memorize the quickly needed combos. It’s just not a big deal. VR players use Voice Attack.

Surprised that so many of you hate this idea so vehemently.

How does this look then, less opaque, smaller, offset. But retains the same basic premise of directional look control that the jester wheel does. Allowing the same hands free operation without having it so 'in your face'

Still looks too obtrusive. If it’s used only with the mouse, then it requires your right hand which is on the stick. I like it that the F key menu is usable with your right mouse hand or left hand on the F keys. Works fine for me.

What’s the difference between clicking on that circle with a mouse instead of clicking on the current menu? If you assign HOTAS buttons to comms then you can’t assign them to the commands they’re supposed to be assigned to.

I fly exclusively in VR and use VIACOM PRO. The only reason i want to see the comms menu is for when VIACOM can't handle my Australian accent and I have to resort to "take x" commands. Hence I want it as subtle as possible.

I get non viacom users might like the wheel, hence I suggested making it optional.

As someone who can't use Voiceattack (or whatsitcalled) and pretty much NEVER uses the keyboard (PointCTRL:music_whistling:), I like Swiftwin9s Jester wheel more than what we have now..

Although, as Terzi also mentioned, an "UP" "DOWN" "LEFT" "RIGHT" menu would have my preference.

Think of it, there's only advantages and all would be happy:

• I'm no software developer, but I'd assume the changes and effort ED would have to put into it, are very minimal
  
• No visual change to the current radio menu. So people who don't want change (and looking at some of the strong words used in this thread, there are a few of those as well) will be happy
  
• The menu could be easily/blindly controlled by a HOTAS 4-way hat
  
• No visual obstruction by a Jester wheel (also the Jester wheel can't be easily controlled blindly) and ED wouldn't have to ask Heatblur to use their concept :P
  

Marking menu has been around for ages in 3D modeling programs like Alias and Maya. Idea is for you to memorize the menu items after a while and just flick the mouse to the direction without even reading the menu content for very quick selection.

This wheel concept can work better if it was a ring with empty center rather than a ball like Jester wheel. Maybe a large wheel just at the edge of the FOV. I don't think it'd be any more immersion breaking than target destroyed message box or current comm menu.

And I don't use VA with VR either and I agree Function keys are difficult to use in VR. 12 sections is too many and I agree with others above that 4 way wheel is best. And even if you don't map the 4-way wheel to HOTAS HAT, you can map them to the keyboard arrow keys which are much easier to reach without looking than F-keys. No one really uses them to fly I don't think.

A rework of the comms menu to make it look more like the wheel selector seen with Jester, would be very convenient.

 

The biggest issue I personally have with the AI comms is having to fumble for my keyboard to press the relevant F keys. If we could instead just look at the option we want and press a HOTAS button then using the comms menu would be much easier in both VR and 2D.

 

A wheel projected over the screen could be separated into 12 'slices' to represent the F1-12 keys.

 

As an additional wishlist item, this wheel menu could have a submenu for various head and hand signals. Allowing the pilot to quickly and easily use non verbal communication with their wingman, especially online.

I agree.

I really wonder what ED's thoughts/plans are on this matter

Despite some people seem content with what we have now, a large portion of the community desires improvement for a long time (just do a quick search in this sub-forum and you'll see it has been requested into infinity)

Still looks too obtrusive. If it’s used only with the mouse, then it requires your right hand which is on the stick. I like it that the F key menu is usable with your right mouse hand or left hand on the F keys. Works fine for me.

What’s the difference between clicking on that circle with a mouse instead of clicking on the current menu? If you assign HOTAS buttons to comms then you can’t assign them to the commands they’re supposed to be assigned to.

I wasn't suggesting using the mouse to use it. I described the use of a look action, as facilitated by trackir, vr, etc.

-1 for the ring but some more freedom in navigating the menu tree would be welcome

To all those against the ring. How do you suggest ED implement a hands free comms menu?

The ring was just my suggestion to the problem of keyboard fumbling, whats yours?

I wasn't suggesting using the mouse to use it. I described the use of a look action, as facilitated by trackir, vr, etc.

You’d have to bind a HOTAS button to it and all those are used by real commands so there’s no extra ones to use. Your radio key brings up the comms menu now but you’d need an extra button for the wheel. The F keys are actually easier. Or mic switch with the throttle hand and pick menu with the right hand on the mouse. Other than VR users I can’t see why the current menu is a problem. For hands free function there’s still VA

To all those against the ring. How do you suggest ED implement a hands free comms menu?

 

The ring was just my suggestion to the problem of keyboard fumbling, whats yours?

Of course it cannot be hands free unless voice activated. My suggestion is to make it at least bindable (keys, buttons) and customizable (size and place).