How big is the difference between Block 40 and Block 50 CCIP F-16s?

With the upcoming release of the F-16C Block 50 CCIP I can't help but feel that it would be a wasted opportunity not to model the F-16C Block 40 CCIP as well. That incentivized me to do some research (see Google) to find out how big the difference actually is. What I've found so far is:

• Block 40 has the wide FOV 'WAR' HUD and the LANTIRN TGP and FLIR/TFR pod.
  

• Some CCIP Block 40's don't have the Bird Cutter AIFF Antennas on the nose due to budgetary constraints
  

These are the only real differences I can find. From what I can tell the Block 50 at it's inception retained all the structural changes that had been made to the Block 40. Then when the CCIP upgrades started happening the Block 40 got the same internal upgrades as the Block 50 (Color MFDs, new avionics, AIM-9X, JHMCS, etc.). Also, the CCIP upgrade for the Block 40 is said to have taken 144 days per aircraft, and it started in 2005 so there should've been plenty of CCIP Block 40's by 2007. Just wanted to put that out there. :D

Does anyone know of any other differences between these two blocks?

CCIP means ? Common Configuration Implementation Program ?

And what does this do?

Just curious………..

CCIP means ? Common Configuration Implementation Program ?

 

And what does this do?

 

Just curious………..

It added new capabilities (avionics, weapons, etc.) and gave the Block 40/42/50/52 Vipers a high degree of commonality with both each other and the MLU upgraded NATO F-16s of Belgium, Denmark, Norway and the Netherlands.

Right ; useful info...…….thx!

Does anyone know of any other differences between these two blocks?

One stand out would be the different engine on the 40 with lower rating.

One stand out would be the different engine on the 40 with lower rating.

Correct, however the Block 40 was also a bit lighter (by around 400lbs IIRC) so the thrust difference more or less was a wash

Not really that simple - what was representative originally doesn't necessary remain representative if looking at data 17 or so years later - even if you ignore the fact that weights can vary by airframe! Also there is more than just weight to consider here if requiring a detailed engine model.

so post CCIP upgrades what is the advantage or point of of having a USAF block 40 with its weaker engine if a USAF/ANG F16CM block 50 is already in development? clearly WAR HUD was only really advantageous for low altitude nap of the earth flying with old LANTIRN?

Besides at this point LAntirn is antiquated and inconveniently requires a second point for navigation pod, considering by 2007, TGP options would be Lightening 2 AT or Sniper XR, both of whch are 2 in 1 pods so to speak, and offer much better capabilities. Also worth mentioning the HTS pod which I still i think a block 50 unique feature.

So I’m guessing no Terrain Following autopilot in the Block-50 then? Shame.

PACIFIC AIR FORCES Senior officers , back in 1993-1995 , prefered Block 40/42 F-16C/D for Korea and all of PACAF. Block 40/42 had wide angle HUD (shared with F-22) that was compatible with LANTIRN system from F-15E. It could project FLIR onto HUD. Ability that was lost with Block 50. So PACAF wanted USAF squadrons in Korea and slated for Korea deployment in case of conflict, and ROKAF to be all Block 40/42. They envisoned 24/7 continuous operations against DPRK. This was mid 1990's, before China, Taiwan, and DPRK IRBMs became an issue.

Block 50 got more powerfull engine and simpler maintenance and standardization across the fleet. Although Active UASAF and USAFRES/ANG F-16C Block 50 fleet is supposed to be same, the upcoming F-16C Viper Blk 50 is likely based on Air National Guard and NATO (Dutch, Denmark) airframes. The differences are mainly in classified communications and avionics. Don't expect those in any consumer sim.

CCIP means ? Common Configuration Implementation Program ?

 

And what does this do?

 

Just curious………..

Time Compliance Technical Order (TCTO) 1F-16-2221 was the installation of the Common Configuration Implementation Program, AKA CCIP ( or modification ECP 3016). This incorporated the Modular Mission Computer (MMC), Color MFDS, Electronic Horizontal Situation Indicator (HSI), Link 16 with TACAN, and Joint Helmet Mounted Cueing System (HMCS) to the USAF Block 40/42/50/52.

So after the CCIP, USAF block 50/52 could carry TGP and do strike mission and block 40/42 could do DEAD/SEAD mission.

Does anyone know of any other differences between these two blocks?

Not much to add, but we would not get many advantages if they model the USAF block 40/42 after CCIP besides the Wide Angle Raster (WAR) HUD and different performance numbers.

The AN/AAQ-14 TGP and the AN/AAQ-13 FLIR/TFR have not been used for years on the

USAF F-16 block 40/42. Last time I saw a AAQ-13 being used was 2001 in Osan AB. Not sure if the addition of the HTS pod completely remove the connection to the AN/AAQ-13 on the left cheek station.

- The Engine is different

- Structurally, some block 40/42 had several hundred or thousands hours more that some block 50/52, so the structure was strengthen.

- The radar had some differences, but I do not have a lot of info on the specifics.

- Some of the symbols on the CMFD where different

PACIFIC AIR FORCES Senior officers , back in 1993-1995 , prefered Block 40/42 F-16C/D for Korea and all of PACAF. Block 40/42 had wide angle HUD (shared with F-22) that was compatible with LANTIRN system from F-15E. It could project FLIR onto HUD. Ability that was lost with Block 50. So PACAF wanted USAF squadrons in Korea and slated for Korea deployment in case of conflict, and ROKAF to be all Block 40/42.

Well, you're partly right. Actually ROKAF doesn't have any Block 40/42s in it's inventory and it never has. It only has Block 32 and Block 52s. The Block 52s were however ordered with the 'WAR' HUD and the LANTIRN system. The ability to project FLIR on the HUD was never lost in the Block 50/52, the US just decided to have the narrow angle HUD and to stop using LANTIRN on their own Block 50/52. Export customers could still order whatever they wanted.

so post CCIP upgrades what is the advantage or point of of having a USAF block 40 with its weaker engine if a USAF/ANG F16CM block 50 is already in development? clearly WAR HUD was only really advantageous for low altitude nap of the earth flying with old LANTIRN?

Yes, and who doesn't want that? :D It's got FLIR rather than Night Vision thats displayed on the HUD and it has terrain following radar which allows you to fly at low altitudes at both day and night without risking your life every single second. :thumbup:

Not much to add, but we would not get many advantages if they model the USAF block 40/42 after CCIP besides the Wide Angle Raster (WAR) HUD and different performance numbers.

The AN/AAQ-14 TGP and the AN/AAQ-13 FLIR/TFR have not been used for years on the

USAF F-16 block 40/42. Last time I saw a AAQ-13 being used was 2001 in Osan AB. Not sure if the addition of the HTS pod completely remove the connection to the AN/AAQ-13 on the left cheek station.

- The Engine is different

- Structurally, some block 40/42 had several hundred or thousands hours more that some block 50/52, so the structure was strengthen.

- The radar had some differences, but I do not have a lot of info on the specifics.

- Some of the symbols on the CMFD where different

Gotcha! Thanks for the info.

I'm just hoping for an updated AI F-16C model to cover the other blocks. Although, I do think flyable versions of the F-16 should be released as 50/52 covering both engine variants but that is just my opinion.

Try these two links

https://www.usaf-sig.org/index.php/reference/41-research-material/82-f-16-viper-faq-stuff-you-wanted-to-know-about-the-f-16cd?fbclid=IwAR2KmDkm3o6DWc1kdh9RBXqfzhnOhrfY5Vz4p9lnoBsZLVLGCxxb8iHybMc

https://www.cybermodeler.com/aircraft/f-16/viperversions.shtml

I thought the BLK-40 can't use the HTS? Block 50/52s more dedicated CJ role?

I thought the BLK-40 can't use the HTS? Block 50/52s more dedicated CJ role?

Before CCIP you would be correct. After CCIP they closed the gap differences in the blocks.

See the post:

https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=4014333&postcount=11