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What new plane?


CBStu

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Newbie here trying to figure out what new plane I should buy. I fly the stock TF51 fine but found it has no guns. I bought an A10C and found I can fly it fine but the electronics are way beyond me, at least at this stage. I watched a tutorial and 50% of that was way over my head. So I thought a WW2 plane might be the way to go since they are much simpler. Bought the Spitfire and can't fly it. I have about a 10% chance of getting off the runway and those few flights I usually crash on landing. What can you recommend? Also is there somewhere I can read reviews of various planes?

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I would recommend the F-5E Tiger II. It's a very simple 70s fighter jet with additional air to ground capabilities. Its avionics are very simple (unlike the A-10) and it is great fun and easy to fly (unlike the Spitfire). It's the best beginner airplane IMHO, besides the dedicated trainer aircraft which are boring if you ask me.


Edited by QuiGon

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DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing!

 

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Agree with QuiGon on the F-5E.

Similar era airframes would be the MiG-21Bis, and the AJS 37 Viggen, of which Id also recommend the Viggen. Its quite simple out of the box, and it can be as complex as you want it - but its still quite simple imo, just requires to wrap your head around its logic. But for simple CCIP quick release of bombs and rockets, its really straight forward. Plus Heatblur (the developers behind the module) continue to support it big time, with new features and also just going back and improving stuff they have learned from their development on their next module.

 

Crash Laobi has made a short 'Which Plane' video for each of the above, describing what type of platform it is.

- Jack of many DCS modules, master of none.

- Personal wishlist: F-15A, F-4S Phantom II, JAS 39A Gripen, SAAB 35 Draken, F-104 Starfighter, Panavia Tornado IDS.

 

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And here are some first look / reviews of the above 3 mentioned modules, by Ralfidude.

 

 

 

 

Bare in mind, all these were made in DCS 1.5, and they were all Early Access at that point.

 

And the above order, F-5E, Viggen, MiG-21 is what I think is the order of simplicity / ease of use.

- Jack of many DCS modules, master of none.

- Personal wishlist: F-15A, F-4S Phantom II, JAS 39A Gripen, SAAB 35 Draken, F-104 Starfighter, Panavia Tornado IDS.

 

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... Bought the Spitfire and can't fly it. I have about a 10% chance of getting off the runway and those few flights I usually crash on landing.

 

When I purchase a new plane for DCS, I've found it is best to not attempt the startup/takeoff & landing until later .. instead I try to get a feel for the aircraft and how it behaves by initially going on a free flight, with the plane already on the air.

 

Once there, I concentrate on binding the basic controls to my joystick: The X&Y axis, the throttle ... and then add the trim controls into a hat, the view keys in case you dont have headtracking yet and the rpm or propeller pitch control (for a WW2 plane).

 

Then just fly around, learning how the aircraft responds into turns, how quickly ascends/descends, try to learn how to turn without losing altitude, or how to ascend/descend at a constant rate.

 

Put the Manual (or Chucks Guide) into a tablet and fly around checking what each control does .. make liberal use of the pause key .. its no cheating while you learn the aircraft's systems :D

 

After a while, I feel confident enough to attempt the straight-in landing ... dont worry if you bounce at first, keep trying and experiment with different speeds and sink rates.

 

If you want to read, rather than a review, I suggest you read Chuck's Guide .. they make fun work of learning the cockpit ... here is the one for the spitfire:

 

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B-uSpZROuEd3RmVCamxfZDNaOVk

 

Finally, after learning how to land, then and only then learn the startup and the take off :)

 

What can you recommend? Also is there somewhere I can read reviews of various planes?

 

As I said, a written review cant really convey how the aircraft feels ... instead look for videos, like this for example for the F-5:

 

QuSkZVZEUtU

 

But rather than purchase a third aircraft, I'd go back to the Spitfire :)

Cheers!


Edited by Rudel_chw

 

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Maybe you would be best getting the FC3 era aircraft -such as the Su-25 (A or T), Su-27/33, MiG-29 etc.

 

 

Mainy of us here have 'grown-up' and learned with these now better represented flight charachteristics, but simple systems and thus you'd get used to handling the aircraft without being overwhelmed with pushing buttons.

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Maybe you would be best getting the FC3 era aircraft -such as the Su-25 (A or T), Su-27/33, MiG-29 etc.

 

 

Mainy of us here have 'grown-up' and learned with these now better represented flight charachteristics, but simple systems and thus you'd get used to handling the aircraft without being overwhelmed with pushing buttons.

 

Good point indeed, and if that is a route you'd like to try, then maybe hold out for the MAC (Modern Air Combat) release, which cant be that far away anymore? MAC being FC3 level, so simplified avionics but with professional flight models, and a complete module/game, that links in to the DCS platform.

- Jack of many DCS modules, master of none.

- Personal wishlist: F-15A, F-4S Phantom II, JAS 39A Gripen, SAAB 35 Draken, F-104 Starfighter, Panavia Tornado IDS.

 

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Hi mate

 

My favourite is the A10C, however I have studied this since it’s release many years ago! I find it the most involved one!!! But it is super rewarding when you know the systems well! It has the option of taking out several ground targets before having to rearm! It is also quite easy and gentle to land! It helps with the warthog controllers as each button is specifically for the module!!

 

 

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Sounds like you're new to sims. I've never flew WW2 sims since I think Secret Weapons of the Luftwaffe and the Spit was no issue to take in the air. Reading a good guide will help if there is difficulty!

 

How about helicopters? A very different world.

 

Mig-15 and L-39. Do you want air to air or air to ground?

 

Mig-21 can be a quite challenging experience. The Viggen is godly but going beyond the basics it may feel like you have to put your brain backwards and warp back in time.

 

A complex modern plane like A-10C (and Viggen too) you have to learn in very small portions. Learn one function at a time and add to a slowly expanding base of knowledge. There isn't that much fun in DCS if you can't learn into this kind of a process.


Edited by Varis

SA-342 Ka-50 Mi-8 AJS-37 F-18 M2000C AV-8B-N/A Mig-15bis CA --- How to learn DCS

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I had all sorts of issues too, and what really helped was breaking things up in it small pieces no matter what aircraft, and lots of tutorials and taking notes... Making little checklists that I could consult when learning a new task. Having said that, the A-10C is a huge pain to learn. I would suggest the Hornet instead. Similar systems to many other planes, very easy to fly, much easier systems to learn than the Hog, and there are a ton of tutorials out for it. Bonus points for it being incomplete, so there is less to overwhelm you.

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I normally recommend the M-2000C as a good full-clickable starter jet. It's fairly easy to fly with FBW controls (though the delta wing has its own challenges), the autopilot is awesome (and lets you do whatever you want while you're fiddling with avionics), and the avionics are simple enough that most switches are "set and forget" while still proving capable enough to fight with 4th gen fighters in WVR and BVR. The air to ground capability is a lot of fun as well...simple (and limited), but very straightforward and capable.

 

On the other hand, if you want to learn good airmanship, the F-5 is a great plane that forces you to learn good habits.


Edited by Home Fries
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Maybe you would be best getting the FC3 era aircraft -such as the Su-25 (A or T), Su-27/33, MiG-29 etc.

 

 

Mainy of us here have 'grown-up' and learned with these now better represented flight charachteristics, but simple systems and thus you'd get used to handling the aircraft without being overwhelmed with pushing buttons.

 

Thats what Im trying to do

I cant find it now but there are training mission for the previous FC2, which i down loaded and seem to work with the F15 C and a10-A

Ive now started to plan my own very simple navigation and landing missions

I want to become proficient at all aspect of flying in all conditions first then mid air refueling before i even consider tackling the weapons systems :)

But im itching to get a clickable pit bird

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Newbie here trying to figure out what new plane I should buy. I fly the stock TF51 fine but found it has no guns. I bought an A10C and found I can fly it fine but the electronics are way beyond me, at least at this stage. I watched a tutorial and 50% of that was way over my head. So I thought a WW2 plane might be the way to go since they are much simpler. Bought the Spitfire and can't fly it. I have about a 10% chance of getting off the runway and those few flights I usually crash on landing. What can you recommend? Also is there somewhere I can read reviews of various planes?

 

Get the plane you are most passionate about . That's the one that will motivate you to master .

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Get the plane you are most passionate about . That's the one that will motivate you to master .

Well said!

Intel i7-12700K @ 8x5GHz+4x3.8GHz + 32 GB DDR5 RAM + Nvidia Geforce RTX 2080 (8 GB VRAM) + M.2 SSD + Windows 10 64Bit

 

DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing!

 

Tornado3 small.jpg

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I think you've figured it out yourself, but anyway, here's my take:

 

- WWII aircraft: hard to fly, easy to operate. Except mustang, that one is quite easy to land and take-off, the other three are much less forgiving. Generally WWII is poorly represented in DCS (abysmal AI, poor DM, lacking assets).

- FC3 aircraft: relatively easy but hindered by the lack of clickable pits and very simplified systems. Can't navigate properly, need to remember dozens of keyboard shortcuts, but you can at least learn the basics of flying and combat.

- F-86, MiG-15, F-5, L-39: easy to fly and easy to learn, you can quite quickly run out of things to do as they are not very capable planes by modern standards. Just guns, dumb bombs and limited A2A.

- Mirage, Hornet, A-10C: complex modern aicraft that are easy to fly and very capable in the right hands, but require some learning. After you learn the basics, they are much easier to employ efficiently, as they have many modern amenities like moving maps, full blown HUD that shows weapons impact point, FBW etc.

- MiG-21, Viggen: complex older aircraft, generally not for beginners.

- C-101, Hawk, Harrier - too unfinished, stuff to avoid, especially if you are a beginner.

- Helicopers are in their own world.

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I think you've figured it out yourself, but anyway, here's my take:

 

- WWII aircraft: hard to fly, easy to operate. Except mustang, that one is quite easy to land and take-off, the other three are much less forgiving. Generally WWII is poorly represented in DCS (abysmal AI, poor DM, lacking assets).

- FC3 aircraft: relatively easy but hindered by the lack of clickable pits and very simplified systems. Can't navigate properly, need to remember dozens of keyboard shortcuts, but you can at least learn the basics of flying and combat.

- F-86, MiG-15, F-5, L-39: easy to fly and easy to learn, you can quite quickly run out of things to do as they are not very capable planes by modern standards. Just guns, dumb bombs and limited A2A.

- Mirage, Hornet, A-10C: complex modern aicraft that are easy to fly and very capable in the right hands, but require some learning. After you learn the basics, they are much easier to employ efficiently, as they have many modern amenities like moving maps, full blown HUD that shows weapons impact point, FBW etc.

- MiG-21, Viggen: complex older aircraft, generally not for beginners.

- C-101, Hawk, Harrier - too unfinished, stuff to avoid, especially if you are a beginner.

- Helicopers are in their own world.

You say helicopters are in their own world, which is true for obvious reasons, but they can still fit in your categories:

- I would put the UH-1H Huey into the WWII category, as it is hard to fly but easy to operate.

- The KA-50 Black Shark would fit into the same category as the Mirage, Hornet and A-10C as it also is a modern aircraft that is easy to fly and very capable in the right hands, but requires some learning and provides the same kind of modern avionics (HUD, moving map, ...).

I don't fly the Mi-8 hip or the Gazelle, so I can't comment on them.

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DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing!

 

Tornado3 small.jpg

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I went for the P51D. It is a quick transition since it is nearly identical to the TF51 that comes w/ DCS. The landing is a tough one though. Seems it is almost impossible to land softly enough to keep from breaking one landing gear. So far it seems best to land at a somewhat high speed (120) and fly it to the concrete and don't drop the throttle until on the ground. I want to be competent enough to get it right 90% of the time. Then I will move to the F5. Thanks for all the recommendations for planes and also the YT tutorials.

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I went for the P51D. It is a quick transition since it is nearly identical to the TF51 that comes w/ DCS. The landing is a tough one though. Seems it is almost impossible to land softly enough to keep from breaking one landing gear. So far it seems best to land at a somewhat high speed (120) and fly it to the concrete and don't drop the throttle until on the ground. I want to be competent enough to get it right 90% of the time. Then I will move to the F5. Thanks for all the recommendations for planes and also the YT tutorials.

 

Hey man, I was basically you a few months ago so I can actually put myself back in your shoes and hopefully add some anecdote or new information (I wish I would have known) to what already has been said. I think I now own 70-75% of the modules and have really enjoyed the game.

 

YouTube is terrific, almost essential when it comes to DCS. Aside from the reviews there are a few channels that are really digestible for some of the complex things.

 

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqH078Ef0HENo01LF3xwIvA has great "1 minute DCS" series where he goes through many aircraft/systems in a very concise manner. Find some channels you like and you will likely be referencing them a good bit. I personally enjoy Growling Sidewinder as well for tactic breakdowns and some others.

 

I'd agree w/ everyone on the F-5 being a good plane but maybe give some perspective from where I think you're coming from. Like the one guy said, buy the plane you are passionate about which is excellent advice, but I had no idea how 'passionate' I'd be about the F-5 until I flew it.

 

The most important reason is that it represents a great foundation of commonality with systems you will find in other blue aircraft like the F-18 and A-10. To me, a lot of the systems and weapon deployment knowledge is cross-functional. If you master the A-10 for example, moving to the F-18 will have a much lower learning curve. So starting from WWII is good, but like folks are saying I'd almost put that in a box.

 

Going from your Mustang to an F-5 isn't going to be like going from an F-5 to the A-10, harrier, F-18 etc. The only thing that is 'harder' than it needs to be with the F-5 is navigation, which is really minor considering the benefits. Try not to look at complexity as a linear thing starting from the era.

 

I too was a bit overwhelmed by the A-10 and learned the F-18 in depth. After learning the Harrier and F-5 I went back to the A-10. Not only was it super easy to get the hang of now that I knew how to work many of the systems and what a lot of the acronyms meant - I found it is actually one of the most intuitive aircraft to operate from a design (IRL) standpoint. It took a certain "base skill level" to even appreciate that though. I say that hoping that the A-10 didn't like scare you back to WWII like it's the minor leagues.

 

If you want to spend time learning things that will transfer well from YouTube or whatnot. Radar is a good general thing to know as the knowledge is fairly universal, learn how TACAN works and maybe some landing patterns/procedure.

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I'll echo Stal2K on most of what he said . Youtube is great, with the caveat it depends on how "finished" the airplane is. I'd advise against early access planes since not everything is working right or will be changed. I ran into this with the harrier, where I was doing everything right as the video said, and was not getting the right result, video was from the really early harrier release and things had changed.

 

Also I totally agree with switchology on planes (western ones), Now that I know how to use the harrier I'm finding the F18 pretty easy since the systems work similarly. Haven't tried the A10 yet (3 planes at once is one too many).

 

I'll also point out that even the clicky planes have "autostart" cheats and so on, if you want to skip learning certain aspects or defer learning them until later (lets face it, startup is boring for some people).

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Good point, that is worth mentioning that the Harrier is the most 'janky' of the early access experiences I've been a part of. But I owed it to my 10 year-old self that watched True Lies to give it a go.

 

Another good point Harlikwin made is that the startup sequences should almost be in their own bucket. It's either going to be boring/tedious or an integral part of the fun. The harrier in particular for me while one of the 'easier' ones gave me the most headache. The A-10 which is one of the more complex I could do in my sleep, however, I attribute that to failing the startup mission in the excellent Maple Leaf Qualification campaigns 45 times or so.

 

Slight change of subject but are you flying in VR? If so for SURE devote some time to getting VR performance mod unless you have like 1080ti's in SLI or something. If you use the Warthog or Cougar HOTAS I also highly recommend Home Fries's excellent CTS software for centralized and most importantly consistent mapping solutions. It even has on the fly profile switching so you can switch aircraft without a lot of hassle.

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