Any concern over Harrier development?

I've only just started on the Harrier, and am a little concerned about comments I have read on these forums regarding the stalling of development on it.

Is there any cause for concern on this, and what is the background to these comments? Is there a likelihood that it will be finished and a manual published?

I sincerely hope so!

Cant see why. They are already dedicated on it since the 19 release, and they have stated that they wont begin work on the new projects, until the Harrier and Mirage are complete, starting with the Harrier. So there is a dedicated push to finish the Harrier now.

OK, good to hear!

You should give a look at the recent patch notes. Progress is slow but undeniably regular, they're doing a good job.

The good news is that there have been updates lately.

The less than good news is that we have no idea what razbam considers a finished model.

Will the various bombing mode problems and missing features get fixed?

Will the FM issues get looked at?

Will the various sensors get fixed/added?

Will we get a realistic INS?

Will get missing MPCD pages like the WRD page?

No one knows other than razbam and they aren't talking. So that's the concerning bit.

This seems like one of these situations that happens at times in DCS development. I can’t understand why ED can’t insist on devs making a statement regarding their future plans for their modules to ease users concerns.

I think they are doing a good job considering that I've read that this is a side-job for them..

It's just very frustrating when you are waiting almost a year for something you want fixed (TDC Axis). I think it was first reported last June 2018.. And it's been in a status of 'IN TEST' for 3-4 months!?

Well, side job or not, there should be a commitment to the consumers who have paid up to $70 to make them aware if their product will be finished.

Out of interest, what is the TDC axis issue?

Ot took about a year to get the ASL line sort-of working as well. It still doeant compensate for wind or movers as it should.

RAZBAM makes a beautiful external model. They really struggle when it comes to replicating avionics that actually have some fidelity to them. Hopefully they'll figure that part out before moving on to even more complicated modules, becuase there is no way they'd be able to recreate something as complicated as a Strike Eagle given their existing products. I think we have all tuned into which 3rd Parties are struggling since the Veao Hawk debacle. I for one refuse to throw anymore money at a 3rd party that could fold up, taking what I've paid for with them.

Seems they have hired another coder so sounds like they mean to keep pushing towards finishing what they started.

(It was on their Discord site)

RAZBAM makes a beautiful external model. They really struggle when it comes to replicating avionics that actually have some fidelity to them. Hopefully they'll figure that part out before moving on to even more complicated modules, becuase there is no way they'd be able to recreate something as complicated as a Strike Eagle given their existing products. I think we have all tuned into which 3rd Parties are struggling since the Veao Hawk debacle. I for one refuse to throw anymore money at a 3rd party that could fold up, taking what I've paid for with them.

sadly have to agree with you

RAZBAM makes a beautiful external model. They really struggle when it comes to replicating avionics that actually have some fidelity to them. Hopefully they'll figure that part out before moving on to even more complicated modules, becuase there is no way they'd be able to recreate something as complicated as a Strike Eagle given their existing products. I think we have all tuned into which 3rd Parties are struggling since the Veao Hawk debacle. I for one refuse to throw anymore money at a 3rd party that could fold up, taking what I've paid for with them.

Yup. Sad but true. The state of harrier avionics is a bit dismal at the moment.

My advice is don't buy anything from them early access. Based on past interactions and performance I think the only reason they've said they will focus on av-8/m2000 is because the mig-19 didn't quite help their wallets as much as they'd hoped.

Hopefully this will change, although I kind of doubt it since they said the 19 was good to go and ED had to step in and say..."yeah, naw."

I like a TON about the harrier and mirage, but get equally frustrated every time my mission gets screwed because of another bug. Or I have to try to work around something that's been broken for a year and quite central to the proper employment of the jet.

Don't buy hopes or promises...that's the only way quality levels will rise.

I've only just started on the Harrier, and am a little concerned about comments I have read on these forums regarding the stalling of development on it.

Is there any cause for concern on this, and what is the background to these comments? Is there a likelihood that it will be finished and a manual published?

I sincerely hope so!

No need to be concerned at all!

The Harrier for sure has some issues - just like any other module as well.

Development will at times be slow - just like any other module as well.

New bugs will show up - just like any other module as well.

Things that once worked will break - just like any other module as well.

You get the drift.

The Harrier is a great module and worth every penny you paid for and I´m sure it will be completed eventually - as much as it can be given the eternal Alpha state of DCS anyway.

Naturally the people that are happy with the Harrier don´t post as much here because they are busy enjoying it.

No need to be concerned at all!

 

The Harrier for sure has some issues - just like any other module as well.

Development will at times be slow - just like any other module as well.

New bugs will show up - just like any other module as well.

Things that once worked will break - just like any other module as well.

 

You get the drift.

The Harrier is a great module and worth every penny you paid for and I´m sure it will be completed eventually - as much as it can be given the eternal Alpha state of DCS anyway.

 

Naturally the people that are happy with the Harrier don´t post as much here because they are busy enjoying it.

Hmm, I’d like to believe you, but your opinion seems to be swimming against the tide here.

Given all that I’ve read, and a whole bunch of issues I’ve encountered in the last few days, I think I’ll leave the Harrier and go back to the Hornet and Tomcat.

Still, I’ll monitor the situation and come back to it if there is progress with development in the future.

No need to be concerned at all!

 

The Harrier for sure has some issues - just like any other module as well.

Development will at times be slow - just like any other module as well.

New bugs will show up - just like any other module as well.

Things that once worked will break - just like any other module as well.

 

You get the drift.

The Harrier is a great module and worth every penny you paid for and I´m sure it will be completed eventually - as much as it can be given the eternal Alpha state of DCS anyway.

 

Naturally the people that are happy with the Harrier don´t post as much here because they are busy enjoying it.

Well said. It does what I want it to do, which is aeros and ground attack. Good fun module, I manage to enjoy it how it is, despite being constantly reminded by the glass is half empty brigade that I shouldn't be enjoying it because 'X' isn't working properly.

As I:

a) Don't use 'X', so it doesn't bother me.

b) Don't know what 'X' is for so it doesn't bother me.

c) Just don't care about 'X' if it isn't useful for nap of the earth low level bombing or 6 ship formation Aeros.

Well said. It does what I want it to do, which is aeros and ground attack. Good fun module, I manage to enjoy it how it is, despite being constantly reminded by the glass is half empty brigade that I shouldn't be enjoying it because 'X' isn't working properly.

The issue is not that ‘X’ isn’t working, it’s whether ‘X’ will EVER work, as development grinds to a halt once the EA cash has rolled in.

Hmm, I’d like to believe you, but your opinion seems to be swimming against the tide here.

Given all that I’ve read, and a whole bunch of issues I’ve encountered in the last few days, I think I’ll leave the Harrier and go back to the Hornet and Tomcat.

Still, I’ll monitor the situation and come back to it if there is progress with development in the future.

You will miss a lot by that especially since the Hornet is far away from finished.

Regarding the tide, this is (a)social media. The people complaining most are the loud minority.

You will miss a lot by that especially since the Hornet is far away from finished.

 

Regarding the tide, this is sicial media. The people complaining most are the loud minority.

Been with the Hornet since day 1 and I have every confidence in ED and their commitment to finishing it. The Hornet sees major updates on a regular basis and ED are very vocal about their commitment. A lot more than can be said about RAZBAM from what I can read in these forums.

I have found these forums to be very measured, in general, and not in any way typical of what you refer to as ‘social media’.

I have no personal opinion on the state of the Harrier development progress. That is why I asked the question here in the first place! I had heard from various sources that serious commitment from the devs to finish the Harrier was in question, and that there were fears that it would turn into another ‘EA forever’ module. Now, that may be wrong. Only time will tell. In the meantime, I will go back to the Hornet and Tomcat and monitor progress on the Harrier. Here’s hoping for a successful outcome!

Been with the Hornet since day 1 and I have every confidence in ED and their commitment to finishing it. The Hornet sees major updates on a regular basis and ED are very vocal about their commitment. A lot more than can be said about RAZBAM from what I can read in these forums.

I have found these forums to be very measured, in general, and not in any way typical of what you refer to as ‘social media’.

I have no personal opinion on the state of the Harrier development progress. That is why I asked the question here in the first place! I had heard from various sources that serious commitment from the devs to finish the Harrier was in question, and that there were fears that it would turn into another ‘EA forever’ module. Now, that may be wrong. Only time will tell. In the meantime, I will go back to the Hornet and Tomcat and monitor progress on the Harrier. Here’s hoping for a successful outcome!

Fair enough. Just a reminder when building your opinion on a module: If you search through 2 or 3 subthreads and see almost the same 10 people bitching around I won't give a cent on their opinion. You will also find those groups in the Tomcat and Hornet forums so you will likely get an idea what I mean...

[…]Most of the people who question or doubt have no idea what it takes to develop aircraft, they are just happy to sit back and criticise.

And some have the expertise and experience to evaluate the situation and are not less concerned than regular joes who have made a leap of faith in supporting a 3rd party developer.

Fair enough. Just a reminder when building your opinion on a module: If you search through 2 or 3 subthreads and see almost the same 10 people bitching around I won't give a cent on their opinion. You will also find those groups in the Tomcat and Hornet forums so you will likely get an idea what I mean...

This, it’s the same for every aircraft in the game. A few people that have pre-conceptions about what the experience should be like, and when it’s not they expected, they hound the developers over and over again. Check people’s profiles and look up their posts, if you see nothing but negativity and criticism, probably time to stop listening.

If you notice too it’s never people that actually fly the aircraft, or work on it. The few actual pilots and maintainers posting have nothing but praises for the developers work. (Bug and cat)

Fair enough. Just a reminder when building your opinion on a module: If you search through 2 or 3 subthreads and see almost the same 10 people bitching around I won't give a cent on their opinion. You will also find those groups in the Tomcat and Hornet forums so you will likely get an idea what I mean...

Thanks, I know these forums well, which is why I asked the question in the first place. As I have said already, personally, I have faith in ED to finish a module. The same cannot be said of all 3rd party devs. But again, I have had no experience of RAZBAM, but I have been interested in the responses in this thread, and I will monitor progress here with interest.