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Ground power startup may lead to unclearable "Aileron off" message


prof_laser

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General information

  • latest OpenBeta (Steam) as of today: 2.5.4.26552
  • DCS + F-18 + FC3 + Persian Gulf
  • bug may happen on cold and dark startup of F-18

 

When doing a (simplified) ground power startup in this order, everything is ok (see Aileron_ok.trk):

  1. BATT on
  2. Intercom: Ground power on
  3. EXT PWR reset
  4. GND PWR 1, 2, 3, 4 ON
  5. [L/R]DDI set to DAY
  6. LDDI set to BIT page
  7. RDDI set to FCS page
  8. APU set to ON
  9. ENG CRANK set to R
  10. RIGHT THROTTLE to IDLE when RPM around 20%
  11. FCS RESET press
  12. Result: FCS page shows no Xs.

 

 

When doing it in this order, the result is not ok (see Aileron_failure.trk):

  1. BATT on
  2. Intercom: Ground power on
  3. EXT PWR reset
  4. GND PWR 1, 2, 3, 4 ON
  5. [L/R]DDI set to DAY
  6. LDDI set to BIT page
  7. RDDI set to FCS page
  8. FCS RESET press (note that AIL cannot be cleared)
  9. APU set to ON
  10. ENG CRANK set to R
  11. RIGHT THROTTLE to IDLE when RPM around 20%
  12. Result: FCS page shows X for AIL on all FCS channels. This cannot be cleared by pressing FCS RESET, or even after complete power cycle. List of cautions shows "AIL OFF".

Aileron_failure.trk

Aileron_ok.trk

Logs.zip

DxDiag.txt


Edited by prof_laser
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Hi Prof.

Just came across your post, so thought I would give it a try to see what issues you are getting. Sure enough following what you've done you get fault reporting, so I continued further, started Left engine now got pressures on both hydraulic systems, the next thing I did was press and hold the FCS bit switch on the right side of the cockpit and whilst still holding pressed, the FCS reset button then release them both, this should start what I call the "Funky Chicken" on the flight controls, look outside and watch all your flight controls, this is cycling them all when its finished, all being well faults should clear, start-up routine can continue, I usually just hit the auto start so cant remember whats next on the checklist, hope this helps.

Chilliblast, ASUS P8-Z77-V Pro, I7 3770K@3-5GHz, 16GB Corsair PC-3 12800 DDR3 @1600MHz, MSi GTX 1080 8GB, Creative SBZ, Logitech LT Z906 5.1, ASUS 24"Monitor 1080 60Hz,120GB SSD, 1TB SSD, 2TB HDD, 4TB HDD, Corsair CX 750W PSu, Win 10 Home Prem 64bit, TM Warthog, TM T Flight Pedals. Track IR, Occulus Rift S, Black Shark SA, DCS A-10C SA, All DCS Current Aircraft Modules, DCS 2.5 Stable and Beta.

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Hey Crowman, thanks for trying to help! I also tried this. First of all: When I hold FCS BIT and push FCS RESET for a short time, nothing happens. When instead of pushing FCS RESET I hold it for a few seconds, I can activate the "Actuator Exerciser Mode" (NATOPS Flight Manual A1-F18AC-NFM-000, section2.8.2.4). The control surfaces then start moving for some time as intended, but the Xs are not cleared. Also when I again push FCS RESET, nothing is cleared. Also, during the BIT test, the ailerons are properly actuated, still the Xs won't clear.

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Hi Prof

Back on again, quick question are your generators switched on.

Chilliblast, ASUS P8-Z77-V Pro, I7 3770K@3-5GHz, 16GB Corsair PC-3 12800 DDR3 @1600MHz, MSi GTX 1080 8GB, Creative SBZ, Logitech LT Z906 5.1, ASUS 24"Monitor 1080 60Hz,120GB SSD, 1TB SSD, 2TB HDD, 4TB HDD, Corsair CX 750W PSu, Win 10 Home Prem 64bit, TM Warthog, TM T Flight Pedals. Track IR, Occulus Rift S, Black Shark SA, DCS A-10C SA, All DCS Current Aircraft Modules, DCS 2.5 Stable and Beta.

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Hi Prof

After going through your post and noting refs to NATOPS I can confirm pressing the FCS reset button at the wrong stage really cocks the system up, don't know its a bug or not, but doesn't seem to be a way of clearing it besides mission restart, even aircraft repair doesn't work, hopefully someone with more knowledge will see your post and be able to help, sorry I couldn't help.

Chilliblast, ASUS P8-Z77-V Pro, I7 3770K@3-5GHz, 16GB Corsair PC-3 12800 DDR3 @1600MHz, MSi GTX 1080 8GB, Creative SBZ, Logitech LT Z906 5.1, ASUS 24"Monitor 1080 60Hz,120GB SSD, 1TB SSD, 2TB HDD, 4TB HDD, Corsair CX 750W PSu, Win 10 Home Prem 64bit, TM Warthog, TM T Flight Pedals. Track IR, Occulus Rift S, Black Shark SA, DCS A-10C SA, All DCS Current Aircraft Modules, DCS 2.5 Stable and Beta.

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I do t have a NATOPS handy. How does the “simplified” procedure you’re using compare to he actual NATOPS?

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You don’t want to reset FCS before engines are started since there’s no hydraulic pressure for the system. By hitting reset your telling the fcs that everything is fine when there’s no pressure. Then when the engines come on line and they start supplying pressure the fcs sees a value change and assumes something’s wrong since you reset it before there was pressure.

 

The control surfaces tend to droop when they’ve been sitting for a while as the pressure bleeds away while the jet is parked and off. DCS actually models that. So when you apply power the control surfaces are slightly out of commanded position. Triggering all the cautions before engine start. But once’s there’s pressure they should go back to their original position, however you need to tell FCS that everything is ok by hitting reset. And that’s why NATOPS has you hit reset (and the paddle switch) AFTER engine start.


Edited by Wizard_03

DCS F/A-18C :sorcerer:

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Wizard, thanks for the explanation. This makes sense so far. What it doesn't explain though, is that once the engines are started up and I press FCS RESET again, the error is not cleared (forgot to mention in my original post). It also doesn't explain why this only affects the ailerons, and not the other control surfaces.

 

Sierra, I'm basically omitting some checks that should not have an influence on the startup (warning lights test, fire test and cycling bleed air, ...)


Edited by prof_laser
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Yeah I’m not sure if pressing fcs reset again would fix the problem you would probably need to remove power to reset the MCs...idk just a guess but in RL either way you’d need to abort and shut down.

 

But what I’m saying is that the errors your getting should be expected since you did things out of order. But if its realistic for it to stay hung up like that or give you that particular caution I can’t say since I try to only ever follow NATOPS

DCS F/A-18C :sorcerer:

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  • 2 months later...

FCS BIT FAILS(SOLUTION?)

 

Good morning fellas,

I was also experiencing issues with the, after-shutdown, restart FCS-Bit fail. ( FCS-BIT stuck in test and flight controls do not cycle).

I tried the fixes that i read but could not get it to pass.

I have been able to restart with no issues after i did this:

after full shut down: Engines, APU, BATT to off.

 

BATT- ON

APU- ON

ENG CRANK ®

ENG 2 IDLE

Aural Annunciations

Make sure NSW is not engaged

DDI (L) - MENU, FCS

Double stack Master Caution

FCS- RESET

DDI ®- STOP

FCS-MC/GO

Hold "Y" Press FCS OSB

"IN TEST"

Flight Controls cycle (ACTUATOR EXERCISER MODE)

FCSA/B go from "IN TEST" to GO

 

I don't yet understand how exactly...FCC's A/B, CAS,DEL, redundancies compromised?

"Redundancy to the flight control actuators is achieved either by simultaneously pressurizing the actuator from both systems or by supplying pressure to the actuator from 1 system while the other system is in a back-up mode. "

 

My guess would be forcing system 1 into backup mode while pressurizing actuators with system 2 only.

I do not know if this is already a fix by someone else, i just thought i would post it..just in case.

Have a good one!

PS- i am having issues posting a video. i will try and post it

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  • 4 years later...
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