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Old 05-06-2018, 10:27 PM   #11
Hiromachi
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Yes. Weight.
P-51B was quite a bit lighter without that radar, two more brownings and couple other things while operating at same engine ratings.

But if we speak of P-51B then I think best visual differences are in the cockpit and tailfin area. Personally I wish for a P-51 with Malcolm hood.
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Old 05-06-2018, 11:08 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xvii-Dietrich View Post
I've been doing some searching to try to figure out the differences between the B/C and D variants (or the Mk III and Mk IV, as the RAF seem to refer to them). One site I found was: http://www.mustangsmustangs.com/p-51/variants There is also a comparison chart here: http://www.mustangsmustangs.com/p-51/specifications

From what I can tell, the primary difference is in the reconfiguration of the canopy. There also seem to be some technical modifications to improve reliability. And the armament has been upgraded from 4x.50cal to 6x.50cal. The engine and basic aircraft configuration is the same though

There seems to be a lot of enthusiasm for the B/C over the D variants, but the differences to me seem minimal. Have I missed something?
Well, it's pretty much the same as stated before, same wings, mostly same engine operating @same manifold IIRC. But, central tank was an option (at least from Mustang III manual) and not mandatory, so less maximum range meaning also a different weight and balance hence I guess something similar to actual TF-51D we already have which is clearly a lighter and more agile aircraft (a bit, not that much). AFAIK B/C model was also a bit faster than D, I guess due to lighter weight. And tail fin was added after centre tank appeared to enhance poor lateral stability, later retrofitted also to B/C models from D. So a fin-less B would be and interesting and probably more challenging ride with full fuel weight but even more agile and a bit faster than D with a same low fuel load. My guess but maybe the lower the fuel load the closer B and D performs.


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Last edited by Ala13_ManOWar; 05-06-2018 at 11:12 PM.
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Old 05-07-2018, 12:08 AM   #13
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Wings were not the same actually - the D has a deeper leading edge root extension, which, whilst apparent on the B/C in plan form, is not so obvious as that on the D.

B - https://aerofred.com/details.php?image_id=88469

D - https://www.the-blueprints.com/bluep...tang-18563.jpg

Last edited by DD_Fenrir; 05-07-2018 at 12:12 AM.
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Old 05-07-2018, 03:15 AM   #14
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dont get me wrong i would love a B/C , but personally i would prefer that they polish the ww2 modules we already have. work out how to fix the MW50 on the Dora because i believe you dont know how to at the moment.... ED that is at you, because how can the 109 use mw50 for hours on end?

Last edited by 9./JG26_Brigg; 05-07-2018 at 04:19 AM.
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Old 05-07-2018, 12:24 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DD_Fenrir View Post
Wings were not the same actually - the D has a deeper leading edge root extension, which, whilst apparent on the B/C in plan form, is not so obvious as that on the D.

B - https://aerofred.com/details.php?image_id=88469

D - https://www.the-blueprints.com/bluep...tang-18563.jpg
Quite true .


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Old 05-07-2018, 01:06 PM   #16
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Well...........

I want to point out that the early variants of the Mustang are NOT the same plane. Less power, more problems.

There were four .40's instead of six, and they had feeding problems, suffering lams quite a bit under moderate to high G load - the guns were turned on their side to fit the wing and the links would break, rendering the guns worthless.

With the fuselage having a taller profile going back into the empenage the B/C was a lot more stable in a dive than the D model. The early D didn't have a fillet and was quite unstable in a dive/high speeds, and that was of course corrected very quickly, but it was never as good as the B/C in a dive.

Let's not get started on the gunsight and general cockpit layout.....

It isn't a simple matter of just putting a different tail on the D model and calling it a wrap, there are many differences in FM and little quirks specific to early Mustangs that would be absent if it were treated as a later D model.
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Old 05-07-2018, 10:41 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ercoupe View Post
I know we already have a Mustang. But the earlier models have always been my favorites. Is there any love out there for the B and C? Same airplanes, of course. Only difference was that the B models were built in Los Angelos and the C's in Dallas. Not sure why that warranted a designation change.
I would think you could get that out with your eyes closed. You've already done most of the work. Would love to see it.

I'm still waiting for my 262 and my P-47.


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Old 05-08-2018, 03:11 AM   #18
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Like many other aircraft, there were quite a few variants. There is no single "P-51B/C" or "P-51D". With a little study, you will find that there was a bit of a "blur" between the P-51B/C models and the P-51D. While there are no bubble canopy B/C models and no razorback D models, that is about the only feature that truly distinguishes the two.
The most important aspect of the B/C series is which engine it has. Some had the same setup as the P-51D, but others had engines optimized for different altitudes and many would claim to be a better setup that the D.
One myth is that the loss of the razorback necessitated the fin extension on the D's vertical stabilizer. But the fact is that the P-51 always had yaw stability problems. The early Ds didn't have the extension while some B/Cs had it retrofitted.
The B/C gun jam problem due to guns being angled rather than vertical was a significant problem. The vertical installation of the D was retrofitted to some B/Cs in the field.


From one of the best online sources for US aircraft history:
http://www.joebaugher.com/usaf_fighters/p51_8.html
"However, many pilots regarded the Malcolm-hooded P-51B/C as the best Mustang of the entire series. It was lighter, faster, and had crisper handling than the later bubble-hooded P-51D and actually had a better all-round view. Its primary weakness, however, was in its armament--only four rather than six guns, which often proved prone to jamming. Some of the modifications applied to the P-51D to improve the ammunition feed were later retrofitted into P-51B/Cs, which made their guns less prone to jamming. With modified guns and a Malcolm hood, the P-51B/C was arguably a better fighter than the P-51D, with better visibility, lower weight, and without the structural problems which afflicted the D. Its departure characteristics were also more benign. "
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Old 05-08-2018, 03:14 AM   #19
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Make no mistake, I love the P-51D. If there were only one variant available to fly I would want it to be the P-51D with a K-14 gyro sight as we have in DCS World. But, I would like to see the P-51B/C as well. I would prefer the option to have the normal canopy or malcom hood rather than having to choose between the two.
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Old 05-08-2018, 03:58 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by streakeagle View Post
Like many other aircraft, there were quite a few variants. There is no single "P-51B/C" or "P-51D". With a little study, you will find that there was a bit of a "blur" between the P-51B/C models and the P-51D. While there are no bubble canopy B/C models and no razorback D models, that is about the only feature that truly distinguishes the two.
The most important aspect of the B/C series is which engine it has. Some had the same setup as the P-51D, but others had engines optimized for different altitudes and many would claim to be a better setup that the D.
One myth is that the loss of the razorback necessitated the fin extension on the D's vertical stabilizer. But the fact is that the P-51 always had yaw stability problems. The early Ds didn't have the extension while some B/Cs had it retrofitted.
The B/C gun jam problem due to guns being angled rather than vertical was a significant problem. The vertical installation of the D was retrofitted to some B/Cs in the field.


From one of the best online sources for US aircraft history:
http://www.joebaugher.com/usaf_fighters/p51_8.html
"However, many pilots regarded the Malcolm-hooded P-51B/C as the best Mustang of the entire series. It was lighter, faster, and had crisper handling than the later bubble-hooded P-51D and actually had a better all-round view. Its primary weakness, however, was in its armament--only four rather than six guns, which often proved prone to jamming. Some of the modifications applied to the P-51D to improve the ammunition feed were later retrofitted into P-51B/Cs, which made their guns less prone to jamming. With modified guns and a Malcolm hood, the P-51B/C was arguably a better fighter than the P-51D, with better visibility, lower weight, and without the structural problems which afflicted the D. Its departure characteristics were also more benign. "
Take a look here, maybe you change your mind a bit.

http://vintageaviationecho.com/xp51a/


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