[FIXED] HUD: A picture is worth a thousand words?

Both said in the air all the data is visible on the HUD that only on the ground do you have to lower your head to see items at the top.

Wow, this is the exact experience I have currently in DCS w/ TrackIR!! :pilotfly:

I attribute the discrepancy to the positive pitch in flight vs no pitch on the ground.

I’m flying the real world sim our pilots train on here at Moody tomorrow morning so more to follow.

Could you take that opportunity and ask about this one here? Got my standard viewpoint set like this right now and when employing weapons in a 20/30/45 it really makes sense. But when flying level and sitting in a relaxed position i can't even see the flight path marker.

Would love to learn if this is nonsense or just not working correctly in DCS/not set up properly by me.

Cheers and have fun in the sim :pilotfly:

Sure, but why when you can set and save your own custom default viewpoint?

But I'll grant you this: something has changed in the vertical display of the HUD. As I haven't been able to reproduce the same exact view as before. But you can absolutely get a nice convenient view where all of the HUD is visible.

 

Here I Saved this as the default view, it's not exactly as the old default viewpoint, but I think it's close enough on the new geometry, and you can read all of the HUD at once:

 

That's actually pretty good! Do you have the view file saved and if so, would you mind sharing it? TIA!

Just got done talking to two different 76th pilots on the spot after jets landed down here at Moody AFB. Both said in the air all the data is visible on the HUD that only on the ground do you have to lower your head to see items at the top.

 

I’m flying the real world sim our pilots train on here at Moody tomorrow morning so more to follow.

Spent almost two hours flying the simulator at Moody AFB yesterday with three pilots giving me tips on various weapon delivery methods. To validate what I was told the previous day I also asked all of them if the view of the HUD in the sim is accurate to the actual jet and they said it is. I had no issue viewing all the displayed data.

So take it how you want but based on the five 76 Fighter Squadron pilots I asked over my drill weekend what we have in DCS (2d primarily but VR to an extent) is not correct.

I am not sure what that means, obviously, it will look better in VR, and does for me, so not sure how you tested it.

He talked to pilots and they said that in their resting position, they do not have to move the head to see the whole HUD. We have to do that in the sim right now in 2D.

I am not sure what that means, obviously, it will look better in VR, and does for me, so not sure how you tested it.

Meaning in VR it is better but I still have to move my head around or continuously adjust the seat up/down to see the TVV. You should see ALL HUD data while airborne (and only have a small amount at the tip cut off while on the ground) without having to move your head to see certain information. Not sure what isn't clear about that. Anyways this'll be my last post on the subject.

I don't expect ED to do anything about how the HUD in the A-10C is now wrong. I am sharing with the forum community what pilots I deal with and trust said is their experience with the HUD and it validated what I remembered from my days of accomplishing maintenance/ops checks since as the Lead Pro Super I'm managing maintenance not accomplishing it.

Could you take that opportunity and ask about this one here? Got my standard viewpoint set like this right now and when employing weapons in a 20/30/45 it really makes sense. But when flying level and sitting in a relaxed position i can't even see the flight path marker.

Would love to learn if this is nonsense or just not working correctly in DCS/not set up properly by me.

 

Cheers and have fun in the sim :pilotfly:

That's not correct

I am not sure what that means, obviously, it will look better in VR, and does for me, so not sure how you tested it.

Not following this logic. We have reports of real world pilots that the HUD is fully visible. It was fully visible before the update and now it's not.

It is apparent that for you this is not an issue. It would be nice to be treated as customers with an issue on a product we bought, instead of straight ignoring the problem by saying "it works for me".

A straight answer would be much appreciated, again, as paying customers.

That's actually pretty good! Do you have the view file saved and if so, would you mind sharing it? TIA!

I didn't edit by file, I used the view comands to move the view point (RCTL+RSHIFT+numpad key) and then used the Save Cockpit Angles command (Right ALT+num0 I think).

But I'll check my saved games folder to see what got saved there. Can only do it tomorow though.

Snoopy, what references were you told to use to ensure that your seat height was adjusted correctly?

Snoopy, what references were you told to use to ensure that your seat height was adjusted correctly?

Metal on the top of the HUD is as thin as possible (red arrow). The below image isn't the proper view though.

That's not correct

Metal on the top of the HUD is as thin as possible (red arrow). The below image isn't the proper view though.

Thanks a lot for taking the time and ask this question Snoopy. I think its very important.

Maybe you misread in a hurry, the post i linked is pretty much what you have been told to be correct: the top bar of the HUD as thin as possible (linked thread says "so you can barely see the top surface, the nuts on the right should be level").

Edit: reference here in the right picture.

Attached pic should be the correct seat height but then you cant see the TVV at all when sitting back. Thats why i brought up my question.

Several RL A-10C pilots now told the same about the correct view height but, if i got this right, also said the whole HUD could be seen when being in a relaxed position. In DCS this currently is not possible meaning theres something wrong with the cockpit/camera position/whatever.

On the current OpenBeta (not an internal build you may have access to), with the default head position, center and pause TIR: the HUD overscans left and right.

This is what's wrong.

On the current OpenBeta (not an internal build you may have access to), with the default head position, center and pause TIR: the HUD overscans left and right.

 

This is what's wrong.

Atually that's the limitation of the 2D view that was discussed previously. If it doesn't happen in VR it's not wrong. What Snoopy is bringuing up and may need investigating is the vertical alignment,

There is no need for an attitude, I need to see how it should be adjusted and by how much, when I use TrackIR or VR, basically any head tracking, I can see all the HUD information., with part of the TVV cut off. Without head tracking, I can move the camera forward slightly and maybe adjust the seat down slightly to get the same thing.

 

I only questioned Snoopy on how he was viewing it, I have no information on the simulation he was using in the military if that is what he was referencing. I understand what he is saying, but when some people say its fine, not just me, and others say its wrong, I need to figure out what I need to report.

 

Saying "it's wrong" doesn't help a lot taking into account all the different setups out there.

I mentioned the simulator because when I was in it yesterday I asked "so this accuracy reflects the view in the real jet when airborne", aka you can see everything without moving their head. They said yes. Otherwise the simulation I was using has nothing to do with actual first hand knowledge from pilots with over 6000 combined hours flying the A-10A and A-10C.

They all said they did not have to move their head around to see anything. The only time they said they had to do that was on the ground and just to view things at the top of the HUD. They all said in the air all HUD data is visible looking at the HUD, it shouldn't matter weather I'm running 4k, 1080, 720, etc. All the HUD data should be visible.

@Paul, give me a screenshot in the A-10C of where you think the proper position of the pilot head should be, so if you have already, but give me one if you dont mind. so height and distance.

1920 x 1080

Resolution shouldn't matter, no, but 2D vs 3D seems to be the issue. What I am looking at after talking to Matt is possible a different view option for users not using VR, this might be the best option.

I think that would help. It's curious that the Hornet and Viper don't have similar issues.

Tried it out that seat position. Love it. If only we could lower the projection of the HUD in the game and make it a touch narrower.

Thanks Snoopy,

In a post titled "picture is worth a thousand words" your single sentence is probably worth 10-20 pictures. Incredibly helpful information!!

Yeah I didn't realize that metal piece on the top of the glass was actually a flat plate.. makes sense then that it would be oriented to be edge-on at the pilots eyes (little obstruction as possible) and the cockpit does feel better from this higher eyepoint.

BTW, here's the IFFCC TEST page from the "correct" eyepoint:megalol:

I think you're missing the point. Snoopy is saying in 2D, the HUD should not be overscaned, unlike what we have now with the default head position.

 

He talked to pilots and they said that in their resting position, they do not have to move the head to see the whole HUD. We have to do that in the sim right now in 2D.

Nobody's arguing you shouldn't be able to see it all with both eyes open, but I can't see anywhere where he said he closed one eye & could still see all the HUD.

I mentioned the simulator because when I was in it yesterday I asked "so this accuracy reflects the view in the real jet when airborne", aka you can see everything without moving their head. They said yes. Otherwise the simulation I was using has nothing to do with actual first hand knowledge from pilots with over 6000 combined hours flying the A-10A and A-10C.

 

They all said they did not have to move their head around to see anything. The only time they said they had to do that was on the ground and just to view things at the top of the HUD. They all said in the air all HUD data is visible looking at the HUD, it shouldn't matter weather I'm running 4k, 1080, 720, etc. All the HUD data should be visible.

 

It should be - in VR, not necessarily in 2D

Nobody's arguing you shouldn't be able to see it all with both eyes open, but I can't see anywhere where he said he closed one eye & could still see all the HUD.

 

 

 

It should be - in VR, not necessarily in 2D

Uhm that’s because I didn’t ask that, pilots don’t fly with one eye closed. They would have laughed and walked away if I did.

I was told though that the top MFD buttons should be 100% visible, but this is why I am asking, maybe even for pilots their perfect view is different, I don't know.

You can in the picture I posted.