uboats Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 (edited) Earlier version of J-11A although has upgrade to shoot R-77, it has no datalink (DL) support (Russian DL has its own support system). Since earlier version of J-11A has almost same avionics as Su-27SK, we directly use Su-27 SSM which brings J-11A DL. Here, I want your feedback: realistic (remove DL) or balance (keep DL)? Edited May 10, 2018 by uboats [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] My DCS Mods, Skins, Utilities and Scripts | Windows 10 | i7-4790K | GTX 980Ti Hybrid | 32GB RAM | 3TB SSD | | TM Warthog Stick | CH Pro Throttle + Pro Pedal | TIR5 Pro | TM MFD Cougar | Gun Camera: PrtScn | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyHo Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 Realistic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Translators Foka1 Posted May 10, 2018 ED Translators Share Posted May 10, 2018 Uhm.. So was this system there physically or not? AKA LazzySeal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkwolf Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 If it wasn't there physically, it should be removed - although it would require to check if Chinese did not implement their own datalink. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] PC simulator news site. Also....Join the largest DCS community on Facebook :pilotfly: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uboats Posted May 10, 2018 Author Share Posted May 10, 2018 If it wasn't there physically, it should be removed - although it would require to check if Chinese did not implement their own datalink. Chinese developed its own DL for j-11a (late version), but it requires completely different cockpit etc, and DL/RWR is too sensitive and we don't have info (even if we had, do it correctly, trouble; incorrectly, trouble too ;)). [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] My DCS Mods, Skins, Utilities and Scripts | Windows 10 | i7-4790K | GTX 980Ti Hybrid | 32GB RAM | 3TB SSD | | TM Warthog Stick | CH Pro Throttle + Pro Pedal | TIR5 Pro | TM MFD Cougar | Gun Camera: PrtScn | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northstar98 Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 I'd say keep it realistic. However it is FC3, I guess the better alternative would to be optional, like the MiG-21Bis' ASP reticle Modules I own: F-14A/B, Mi-24P, AV-8B N/A, AJS 37, F-5E-3, MiG-21bis, F-16CM, F/A-18C, Supercarrier, Mi-8MTV2, UH-1H, Mirage 2000C, FC3, MiG-15bis, Ka-50, A-10C (+ A-10C II), P-47D, P-51D, C-101, Yak-52, WWII Assets, CA, NS430, Hawk. Terrains I own: South Atlantic, Syria, The Channel, SoH/PG, Marianas. System: GIGABYTE B650 AORUS ELITE AX, AMD Ryzen 5 7600, Corsair Vengeance DDR5-5200 32 GB, Western Digital Black SN850X 1 TB (DCS dedicated) & 2 TB NVMe SSDs, Corsair RM850X 850 W, NZXT H7 Flow, MSI G274CV. Peripherals: VKB Gunfighter Mk.II w. MCG Pro, MFG Crosswind V3 Graphite, Logitech Extreme 3D Pro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stratos Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 Please keep, as we cannot have the late J-11 cockpit, this will be great to have. Or If possible give the player to activate/deactivate. I don't understand anything in russian except Davai Davai! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Translators Foka1 Posted May 10, 2018 ED Translators Share Posted May 10, 2018 Chinese developed its own DL for j-11a (late version), but it requires completely different cockpit etc, and DL/RWR is too sensitive and we don't have info (even if we had, do it correctly, trouble; incorrectly, trouble too ;)). It is all simple. Which one you represent in DCS? J-11A (late version) with Chinese datalink inside? OR J-11A earlier version? (Earlier version just had this piece of hardware didn't build? They didn't have license for it?) If you represent earlier version in DCS and if real earlier version didn't have such hardware, then it should be removed in DCS there could be no questions here about that :) If you represent late version you would need to implement Chinese datalink with all other details, or just stop calling it later version :) AKA LazzySeal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glimmer Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 Realistic! But what's do you mean in Datalink System? Only avionic comms with AWACS or with other J-11A in group too? We have early version of Su-27, why J-11 have to be more modern? Су-27 Flanker | Су-30 Flanker-C | Су-33 Flanker-D | Су-34 Fullback | Су-24 Fencer | МиГ-29 Fulcrum | F-14A/B/D Tomcat | F/A-18C/D Hornet | F/A-18E/F Super Hornet | F-16C Fighting Falcon | F-15C Eagle | Eurofighter Typhoon | Tornado IDS | JAS-39 Gripen | AJ/JA(S)-37 Viggen | Rafale | M-2000 Mirage | Mirage F1 Ka-52 Hokum | Mi-28N Havoc | Mi-35M Hind | Mi-24P Hind | AH-64D Apache | AH-1W SuperCobra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
launchedsquid Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 I voted for keep, The real J11 has data link so it isn't like we're adding capability, I know it isn't strictly correct but other compromises exist in dcs world, especially in FC3 aircraft with various systems being automated or omitted. Removing the data link would have the aircraft stray further from the real J11 than keeping the data link on board, if the data were available I'm sure the correct data link would have been modeled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uboats Posted May 10, 2018 Author Share Posted May 10, 2018 It is all simple. Which one you represent in DCS? J-11A (late version) with Chinese datalink inside? OR J-11A earlier version? (Earlier version just had this piece of hardware didn't build? They didn't have license for it?) If you represent earlier version in DCS and if real earlier version didn't have such hardware, then it should be removed in DCS there could be no questions here about that :) If you represent late version you would need to implement Chinese datalink with all other details, or just stop calling it later version :) unfortunately, earlier one. it's safe not to touch the rwr/dl developed by China. you know, those are sensitive in all countries. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] My DCS Mods, Skins, Utilities and Scripts | Windows 10 | i7-4790K | GTX 980Ti Hybrid | 32GB RAM | 3TB SSD | | TM Warthog Stick | CH Pro Throttle + Pro Pedal | TIR5 Pro | TM MFD Cougar | Gun Camera: PrtScn | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uboats Posted May 10, 2018 Author Share Posted May 10, 2018 Realistic! But what's do you mean in Datalink System? Only avionic comms with AWACS or with other J-11A in group too? We have early version of Su-27, why J-11 have to be more modern? i mean with wingman in same group or awacs, you can have tactical situation without turning on radar. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] My DCS Mods, Skins, Utilities and Scripts | Windows 10 | i7-4790K | GTX 980Ti Hybrid | 32GB RAM | 3TB SSD | | TM Warthog Stick | CH Pro Throttle + Pro Pedal | TIR5 Pro | TM MFD Cougar | Gun Camera: PrtScn | Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glimmer Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 i mean with wingman in same group or awacs, you can have tactical situation without turning on radar. Copy... however I still vote for realistic :) Су-27 Flanker | Су-30 Flanker-C | Су-33 Flanker-D | Су-34 Fullback | Су-24 Fencer | МиГ-29 Fulcrum | F-14A/B/D Tomcat | F/A-18C/D Hornet | F/A-18E/F Super Hornet | F-16C Fighting Falcon | F-15C Eagle | Eurofighter Typhoon | Tornado IDS | JAS-39 Gripen | AJ/JA(S)-37 Viggen | Rafale | M-2000 Mirage | Mirage F1 Ka-52 Hokum | Mi-28N Havoc | Mi-35M Hind | Mi-24P Hind | AH-64D Apache | AH-1W SuperCobra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stratos Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 uboats, os not possible to have it as an option? Like IR filters or armor in the Mi-8. I don't understand anything in russian except Davai Davai! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TLTeo Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 I'd much prefer realistic, DCS isn't War Thunder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Dragon-DK Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 In the absence of modern red planes it's a keeper. My reasoning. Nor is it realistic that we do not have access to modern Russian aircraft. In a real war we would see modern Russian / Chinese with this capacity. To me it is still realistic to keep. Intel I7 4770K, Evga 1080 FE, win10 64Pro, 32GB ram, TracIR 5, Hotas Warthog, MFD Cougar x2, MFG Crosswind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dudikoff Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 (edited) I think some additional clarifications might be helpful here by the OP before making the vote. IIRC, the Su-27SK manual mentioned the datalink, so I presume the equipment was still there on the J-11A (given that even the labels in Russian were kept)? Is the problem then perhaps that the Chinese Air Force didn't have the required ground stations and/or AWACS aircraft? If so, I'd presume the datalink could still function between the flight members? Edited May 10, 2018 by Dudikoff i386DX40@42 MHz w/i387 CP, 4 MB RAM (8*512 kB), Trident 8900C 1 MB w/16-bit RAMDAC ISA, Quantum 340 MB UDMA33, SB 16, DOS 6.22 w/QEMM + Win3.11CE, Quickshot 1btn 2axis, Numpad as hat. 2 FPH on a good day, 1 FPH avg. DISCLAIMER: My posts are still absolutely useless. Just finding excuses not to learn the F-14 (HB's Swansong?). Annoyed by my posts? Please consider donating. Once the target sum is reached, I'll be off to somewhere nice I promise not to post from. I'd buy that for a dollar! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teknetinium Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 (edited) We fly in coalitions, so if russian awacs are used and J-11s are flying with Su-27S, I dont see reason why the systems already installed on J-11 not would be used. A option would be the best solution. Edited May 10, 2018 by Teknetinium 51st PVO Discord SATAC YouTube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yaga Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 Considering many of the DL capabilities do not work in MP already (wingman to wingman, for example), please keep the current capability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfa Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 Earlier version of J-11A although has upgrade to shoot R-77, it has no datalink (DL) support (Russian DL has its own support system). Since earlier version of J-11A has almost same avionics as Su-27SK, we directly use Su-27 SSM which brings J-11A DL. Here, I want your feedback: realistic (remove DL) or balance (keep DL)? With the mention of the upgrade to deploy R-77, I first read the above as a question of datalink support(radio correction) for the R-77. But now it seems that you are actually talking about datalink between the J-11A and other aircraft/AWACS. Could you clarify please? JJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agetec Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 Realistic please Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al531246 Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 Absolutely remove if the real aircraft counterpart doesn't have the capability. If it's kept for balance reasons we'll have begun a journey towards the death of what DCS prides itself on - accuracy. Intel i5-8600k | EVGA RTX 3070 | Windows 10 | 32GB RAM @3600 MHz | 500 GB Samsung 850 SSD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarksydeRob Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 I think some additional clarifications might be helpful here by the OP before making the vote. IIRC, the Su-27SK manual mentioned the datalink, so I presume the equipment was still there on the J-11A (given that even the labels in Russian were kept)? Is the problem then perhaps that the Chinese Air Force didn't have the required ground stations and/or AWACS aircraft? If so, I'd presume the datalink could still function between the flight members? Thats a good point. Is it a case of the aircraft missing datalink or the Air forces missing infrastructure to support datalink. Also by any chance you still have a link or a copy of the SK manual? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petertheduke21 Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 Gas! i mean realism! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esac_mirmidon Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 This really has not a deep impact in the game because in MP the datalink between wingmen players is not working either on the Su-27 so even if the J-11A keeps the DL, in MP is not working so.... Only useful in SP " You must think in russian.." [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Windows 7 Home Premium-Intel 2500K OC 4.6-SSD Samsung EVO 860- MSI GTX 1080 - 16G RAM - 1920x1080 27´ Hotas Rhino X-55-MFG Crosswind Rudder Pedals -Track IR 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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