TrackIR

Hi all,

I would like to buy TrackIR however i have a floor to ceiling mirror 1.6 meters behind me. Does anyone know if the mirror will cause problems with accurate tracking?

In my experience...maybe!

I had a similar setup. My mirror was also very wide (~6ft). If I used the TrackIR with the passive reflector clip (the thing that's stuck on the front of a cap), I had all sorts of issues as the TrackIR's internal LEDs were getting returned by the mirror, as my body didn't obscure it completely.

The solution was to use the 'active' pro-clip so there were no false returns. Been perfect ever since.

Also watch out for windows behind you during daylight hours, as this tends to screw-up both the passive and active setups.

The mirror should only cause a problem if your tracking system points LEDs at the mirror.

If you have the LEDs on a clip attached to your head, there should be no reflections from the mirror, as the LEDs should be pointing towards the screen, not the mirror.

yes, mirror will cause a problem anything that reflects is likely to

I have been thinking about getting TrackIR as well, but the price point is ridiculous.

If I do decide to put up the $ to get this, will the fluorescent lights above my computer degrade the performance? Also, any impact from people wearing glasses?

No and no (for your questions).

For the pricepoint: you have a point but then they have a monopoly or you have to go the DIY road with a webcam and other software like Opentrack.

I know it's expensive but TrackIR is a game changer. It may not be VR but there are actually advantages there too. It took me a couple of days, and then an hour here and there as I came across tips for it's use here, to get it set up to my liking. I would hate to go back to buttons or hats to control my view. I have mine set up w/ a center dead spot of about 7-8 degrees of head movement before the view actually moves. It is really surprising how much we move our heads w/o realizing it so this helps calm everything down. I then have curves for screen movement vs head movement that allows me to turn my head 90 deg to the side and get a 180 deg view movement. Yes, you can watch for that Mig behind you if you use labels. The label will show through your plane. BTW I have a couple of solid color beach towels that I can stick on door or window frames w/ push pins when the sun is in the wrong spot and messing me up.

I agree TRACKIR is amazing. get a sheet to hang over the mirror, there is noting better than trackIR for flying than full VR.

No and no (for your questions).

For the pricepoint: you have a point but then they have a monopoly or you have to go the DIY road with a webcam and other software like Opentrack.

Yes, I have looked at some of the other cheaper options, but none seem quite as user friendly and include as many features as Track IR. Yep, they do seem to have a monopoly and they are capitalizing on it.

Thanks for the answers about the overhead lights and wearing glasses. Might have to get the credit card out and give it a try. Just got into DCS a few months ago and am already frustrated with fumbling around with the viewing capabilities being mapped to HOTAS switches - kind of impacting the immersion.

FWIW, large mirrors are known for screwing up quite a few VR setups, too. Windows Mixed Reality is well known for having that problem, as would any "inside-out" style VR system. For that matter, I can't help but think the beacon-style VR tracking wouldn't play well with large mirrors either.

Just got into DCS a few months ago and am already frustrated with fumbling around with the viewing capabilities being mapped to HOTAS switches - kind of impacting the immersion.

You won't regret your purchase... totally different ballgame with TrackIR.

I have been thinking about getting TrackIR as well, but the price point is ridiculous.

Why is the price point ridiculous? It's only $149. That price for a low-volume, niche, highly functional device doesn't raise any flags for me.

Why is the price point ridiculous? It's only $149. That price for a low-volume, niche, highly functional device doesn't raise any flags for me.

it´s a device which has been on the market for decades, literally. No upgrades since last iteration TIR 5, released 11 years ago.

There are cheaper alternatives, from DIY stuff to semiprofessional.

It doesn´t work on consoles (one of the major markets for simracing, no niche anymore).

Surpassed at all levels by VR.

And here they are, keeping the same pricetag. I´m not saying it´s not a bad device but seriously, it´s not 2005 anymore.

Surpassed at all levels by VR.

And here they are, keeping the same pricetag. I´m not saying it´s not a bad device but seriously, it´s not 2005 anymore.

Immersion yes, performance and graphical wise, not so much.

 

Regarding inflation, it's 30% cheaper then 10 years ago...;)

I´m very happy at 40fps with my rift s lol. But yes you are right, I lost like 65% performance when switching to VR. For example, first mission of Red Flag A-10C campaign, it´s a slideshow.

Inflation, I will take that word when we all discuss TM Warthog now F-16 base and stick :D:D

Love my opentrack set up. Cost me about £15.

Anyone using the "TrackHat clip plus head tracking kit", or, UTC Mk II? Both have a much sturdier LED clip that Track IR5.

The track clip pro is extremely delicate for the price. Some of the custom designs are far more practical and probably cheaper. But I love the lightweight, the adjustable folding/rotating arm, and the method for clipping it on to a headset. I thought my original headset had finally failed and bought a new one, only to find that it was my USB hub that was failing. I use the new one just because, but the original still works fine. I have had the first one sent TIR 5 was released. I think I still have my TIR 4. I think I threw away my TIR 3 with vector at some point... maybe it got damaged while being stored in a junk drawer.

The additional cost over open track solutions is negligible if you use it as many years as I have. TrackIR support is native to most flight sims and with the right setup of passive reflector or active LED clip, every other solution can only hope to equal its performance and compatibility.

I got Oculus CV1 first and after Matt Wagner's thoughts on the Rift S with DCS World, I got the Rift S right away, too. VR is not only immersive, but I literally fly better in dogfights because of my ability to maintain situational awareness so much better with 1:1 head tracking and using stereo vision to see around canopy frames with little or no head movement.

But, I still end up flying Track IR up to 50% of the time. With good tuning of the head tracking profile, it can be both smooth and precise. The benefit is high steady frame rates generally locked at my 49-inch TV's 4K rate of 60 Hz with visual quality settings practically maxed out. The images are breathtaking, which is also immersive.

I love using TrackIR when doing training missions, basic navigation flights, etc. As long as you don't get in a violent, close-in dogfight (like I normally do flying F-86s and MiG-15s online), I can use the TrackIR just fine in combat. While you can technically see longer distances with higher resolution and quality settings, that is really only true if you can clearly pick out 1-pixel on a 4K screen with a low contrast background (like a camo plane flying over trees/bushes/ground with the same color(s).

Unless VR in DCS World makes some big, usable gains in both image quality and frame rates, I won't be ditching TrackIR anytime soon. If you can only afford VR or TrackIR and your PC and GPU are strong enough, I would go with VR. But if you can afford both, I think it is still very useful to have both.

Love my opentrack set up. Cost me about £15.

What hardware are you using with that software?

Track ir was the best ever investment I ever did and I have 3 of them

Marc..

I have been researching other comments on Track IR on the DCS forums and have found several posts about incompatibilities regarding modern monitor variable refresh rates and the scan/refresh rates of the Track IR camera/software, and having to cap fps in DCS. These incompatibilities are causing stuttering/micropauses in the onscreen view.

Seems that people are having to adjust refresh rates and play around with other video tuning apps in an effort make TrackIR play nice with different monitor refresh rates in DCS.

I am not technically knowledgeable about all this stuff, but is sounds like a major PIA for a lot of people. If I were to buy headtracking equipment, I would want it to work out of the box without having to be a computer wizard to figure out some type of work-around.

I don't fully understand all the technical conflicts that were being discussed between TrackIR, different monitor refresh rates, and capped DCS fps, but it doesn't sound that Plug & Play friendly.

It's still more P&P-friendly than any other DIY tracking solution on the market. You literally install drivers and software, plug the device, launch it, launch the game and it works on its default profile out of the box.

That being said, like with every single analog game device, you would quickly dump that default profile and start some further tweaking to your liking, because things like sensitivity, curves, shortcut keys etc. depend on personal preference anyway.

Refresh rate differences are an issue indeed, but I think it might apply to DIY device as well (someone correct me if I'm wrong). Also, with DCS extreme hardware requirements in general, you can forget about maintaining these 120-144fps all the time to be in sync with modern gaming monitors, so capping to 60 might not be a bad idea after all (in NVIDIA drivers it's easily done in control panel with a few clicks). Whether you choose TIR or DIY alternative, some effort, research and trial and error WILL be required, if not in one field of practical aspects, then in the other.

Last but not least, if you're not in hurry, I'd just wait and spend some time checking out Ebay an flight simming forums - every now and then there's someone converting to VR and selling his/hers TIR set for a reasonable price.

Thanks for that reply Art-J. I think I will just wait awhile and see if Natural Point, or other head-tracking manufacturers, come up with some improvements/updates to better deal with monitor refresh rates. Not something that I want to waste my time dealing with, given my limited technical knowledge of such issues.

Back in the day when TrackIR hit the market 60hz refresh rate was the norm. Even for TrackIR 5 which was released back in 2009, 60hz was still mainstream. Since then things moved up monitorwise but TrackIR didn't follow. If you have a 60hz monitor, it's still plug & play, if you have a monitor which can go higher, you have to click a few times extra. As Art-j points out, lots of monitors go 120-144hz these days (and higher, just been reading up on a new monitor doing 360hz refresh, especially for gamers), but those frequency's are very hard to maintain in DCS and even a lot harder if you go upwarts above HD in resolution. So 60hz maybe a step down but it solves the issue.

This Track IR refresh rate issue seems to be a well documented and frustrating problem that has generated a significant amount of dis-pleasure across a broad spectrum of gaming forums on the Internet. Given all the negative discussion that it has received, I am puzzled that Natural Point has seemingly made no effort to improve/update their product to help out their customer base. Almost sounds like they don't care.