Removed

The video is soooo tempting!:thumbup:

Just when can we have a high fidelity F-16 sim with DCS quality physics and graphics? Falcon 4 derivatives are bound to get old some day and we see no successor on the horizon...:cry:

NASA has used the F-15 pretty extensively too. From HiDEC to the F-15 S/MTD & ACTIVE, just to name a couple. NASA still uses the F-15B today, so I imagine the data is available somewhere.

Just as I have discovered. I've been stuck for months waiting for ground handling support and fuel mass distribution explanation. I know how it should work, but my aircraft weight doesn't seem to reflect the fuel.

No that's not possible it was stated a hundred times in the AFM/SFM discussions that such work takes a year.;)

He had a massive head-start on that year thanks to NASA doing all the work on the analysis of the aerodynamics. :)

Getting said aerodynamics data (lift coefficients, drag profiles) is the meat and potatoes of flight dynamics modelling.

Aerodynamic equations are easy to find, and many will give good results. They can be added in a few days (let's be generous and say 2 weeks). It takes yet more work if you want to expand on what you have (i.e. model certain behaviors not accounted for in simpler equations, or unique to your aircraft).

After that is the hard task of tuning the flight model so it is believable to fly. That takes a lot of trial and error, and time.

I had a very basic flight model running in a matter of a couple of hours - but it wasn't flyable. All it did was fly straight and level.

Best regards,

Tango.

Thinking of what you wrote just now, Tango: "model certain behaviors not accounted for in simpler equations, or unique to your aircraft" => How can be modeled behavior such as hypermanoeuvrability and tricks of the SU-35? (for exemple the double 'steady loop' or 'tail slide' it can perform)

That can be a nightmare to code in an AFM, isn't it?

Not so much a nightmare as requiring a lot of analysis to determine how/why it does what it does, so it can be integrated into the modelling. When it comes to creating computer simulations, there is not one set of equations/data for all situations. You will probably need to switch equations/data on the fly in order to create the desired effect(s). This effectively requires the production of multiple flight models and data sets.

Take backwards flight for example. As the NASA models demonstrate, equations that are good for forward flight are useless for backwards flight. It is not simply a case of reversing the flow over the wings. In that situation an entirely new analysis needs to be conducted, requiring new data and equations, to handle reverse flows.

Best regards,

Tango.

Yep, I know modeling the ground reaction is going to be an interesting task...I'm concentrating right now on getting the flight model looking good but I hope to develop even a low fidelity ground reaction model just so I can land and take-off.

Well from what I know, the basic ground handling should be there, but I don't know how to make it work. Don't think they planned on us making our own.

How can be modeled behavior such as hypermanoeuvrability and tricks of the SU-35? (for exemple the double 'steady loop' or 'tail slide' it can perform)

That can be a nightmare to code in an AFM, isn't it?

If you have some programming skill then look at ED FM template, thrust vector control is generally possible. Thrust parameters consist of thrust vector length and orientation. Vector length depend on throttle position and altitude. Your task is create algorithm for calculating angles for thrust vector orientation depend on stick and rudders.

Generally it`s possible.

You can do it! :D

Do you know if any 3rd party dev utilizing the AFM has got the DCS internal ground reaction modeling working? I would be very intested to know how this works.

Haven't seen any yet. I would assume you'll have to write your own reaction model and calculate a normal force for each tire when it impacts the ground. Then you can tweak elasticity and friction/grip.

The biggest point is to be clear on the equations used, and their limitations. The rest of the source code should provide clarity on the order each function is called, and exactly what it is doing at each step. It might be worth creating a flowchart of the structure.

Best regards,

Tango.

maybe ED can Donate their F-16 External Model so we can make something happen... it's been 2 years since those renders, the Max files are prolly degrading on some geeks flash drive..

This does not mean it won't be available for you to fly with!

Could you please explain what you mean by that? Will you guys create a flyable F16, with all its systems?( radar, target pod, weapons etc)?

Would love a DCS F16 that can replace/ supplement to falcon 4.0BMS

Either way, keep up the good work and good luck

Ok, thanks for the clarification.

i dont think NASA has test data for weapons either... lol

/Thread cleaned of Rule 1.2 infringements.

Let's not let that happen again Gentlemen.

Ta

Progress Update:

- Leading edge flap control law logic complete

- Actuator logic for all surfaces complete

 

To do this weekend:

- Higher level control laws

 

We'll be testing it internally and should have another video up soon of the improvements...

You do a clickable cockpit as well?

You do a clickable cockpit as well?

 

I think that was answered as a definite no. And I don't think that if they did, that it would represent the aircraft whose cockpit is in your picture.

I'm not promising anything :) my job/skills is with the flight model, if one of my members or a member of the community wants to extend it to add a nice cockpit, weapons, etc... they are more than welcome too!

If you get the cockpit done and all works as it should be, maybe alot of Falcon pilots switch over.Anyways, i hope one day, some day an F-16 Fighting Falcon with clickable cockpit is finished.

Let me ask you then, sir... If all this time is being put into the F-16, why not finish it out and make a DCS module out of it? I'd certainly pay for it...

- Actuator logic for all surfaces complete

You are quick indeed! Does this include fly by wire functions such as "auto trim"/automated stab trim drive in response to changing trim state? How about cancellation of uncommanded pitch excursions? (Turbulence, short period responses)

Oh no no, by actuators I mean I'm modeling the movement lag in the actuator servos at the control surface per design documents. Not a whole lot to it except writing a bunch of integrators...

Oh, ok! Got it. I'm not an engineer (I'm thinking you are,) so sometimes my terminology is probably a bit out of whack.

work, school, and life is keeping me from greatness.

Not alone there, man!

CptSmiley, one of the big differences between Block 50/52 and earlier Vipers is that the engine on the later blocks can go from idle to full A/B in 2 seconds (without stalling), vs around 4 seconds for earlier blocks. So you might want to be able to allow modification of the time constant for that particular parameter.

I just found an interesting paper with parameters for the Hornet, look for NASA TM-107601. There are some details on the Hornet control system in the paper "Susceptibility of F/A-18 Flight Controllers to the Falling-Leaf Mode: Linear Analysis" by Chakraborty et al 2011. (you'll find it very easily in Google). Even if you don't have much time now to read it still cast your eye over it so you can see what it common between it and the F-16 model. That way you'll be able to see what needs to be done to make your code more general.

You do a clickable cockpit as well?

.. Cuz i feel like being a tease right now.. see attachment, :joystick:

But it's not gonna happen, at least not the way people expect it to. as this pit source model does not belong to me and I'm not gonna modify it without permission and all that stuff.

F-16A vs. MiG-21. Hmmmmm......

Best regards,

Tango.

Looks pretty nice!:thumbup: