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VR NEEDS AA !


pagadi-zaiet

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Don't the aa settings work in game ? I mean they murder frames but they work Right? If you want to use them it becomes a question of does your hardware allow it...

Personally I'm hanging out for vive pro and the next gen nvidia releases

 

Have you tried supersampling and pixel density settings?

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The builtin MSAA works fine but is slow as all hell. It would be nice if we had the option to use a lower quality but fast AA algorithm.

 

Oculus recently added 8x MSAA support to their SDK, I wonder if ED will add this for Rift users. I guess not.

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Here's hoping that Vulkan will release enough performance to allow the use of MSAA...

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?

AA works in VR.

Most VR users are high-end and tend to be running 1080 TIs, and are getting pretty good performance with 2x AA in VR.

 

Above that it's very taxing on performance though.

 

AA is not working optimally in 2.5, but that's not just a VR issue.

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Here's hoping that Vulkan will release enough performance to allow the use of MSAA...

 

Yep, i set my money on this! There wil be a 40 %, maybe 50 % boost! :D

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Vulcan will free up the CPU, not the GPU, so I'm not holding my breath wrt using higher MSAA. VR users don't need a high quality algorithm (until we have high res displays), we just need something to smooth the worst of the jaggies. I use 2x and its OK but it would be nice to have something faster.

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Most VR users are high-end and tend to be running 1080 TIs, and are getting pretty good performance with 2x AA in VR.

Above that it's very taxing on performance though.

I beg to differ. Already MSAA 2x gives a big hit on FPS with Deferred Shading (DS) on. I did a comparison when DS was introduced in DCS 2.1 https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=188063

One can see that going from MSAA 0X to 2X nealy cuts your FPS in half. It's already a while back but I don't think this changed significantly.

 

Sometimes I try to re-enable MSAA 2x for testing but I have to lower my pixel density from 1.5 to 1.3 (or less) to maintain the same FPS as with MSAA off. In the end, I always go back to MSAA off. I think this is also what Wags uses in VR with his 1080Ti.

 

Of course, there are also other FPS killers like shadows. If I turned them off, I could probably enable MSAA. But I prefer to have those on for the immersion.

 

Anyway, Wags said recently that they are investigating into AA, which is all I wanted to hear. So I cross my fingers that they come up with a nice implementation at some point.

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i fast tested this yesterday in a su25t freeflight mission.

 

140fps max settings (medium shadows) no msaa

100fps same settings x2 msaa

80fps same settings x4 msaa (From here an on bulding in the distance stop flashing and its playable lol)

70fps same settings x8 msaa

 

quite a cut on the x2 lol. was impressed. btw at least on that free mission flying around in the town down there, ill never go behind 70 so i could play on x8 aswell (of course prolly only me at 1080p 60hz display). (and on that mission).

 

nonetheless i think it was a rough tradeoff. might need some work.

 

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i fast tested this yesterday in a su25t freeflight mission.

 

140fps max settings (medium shadows) no msaa

100fps same settings x2 msaa

80fps same settings x4 msaa (From here an on bulding in the distance stop flashing and its playable lol)

70fps same settings x8 msaa

 

quite a cut on the x2 lol. was impressed. btw at least on that free mission flying around in the town down there, ill never go behind 70 so i could play on x8 aswell (of course prolly only me at 1080p 60hz display). (and on that mission).

 

nonetheless i think it was a rough tradeoff. might need some work.

 

yeah now divide that by 2 to get where us VR users are.

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yeah now divide that by 2 to get where us VR users are.

 

yeah or 2.5... i'm going from 110 in non VR to 45 in VR with sometimes a little less.

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Your target frame rate in VR should be 45 FPS.

... Should be 90 but have to be 45 with this engine :/

 

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Vulcan will free up the CPU, not the GPU, so I'm not holding my breath wrt using higher MSAA. VR users don't need a high quality algorithm (until we have high res displays), we just need something to smooth the worst of the jaggies. I use 2x and its OK but it would be nice to have something faster.

 

Agreed, my CPU @ 4.7ghz hardly ever goes over 50-60% on any single core load. It's not the bottleneck. Meanwhile my 1080Ti GPU, overclocked as fast as it will go, is the obvious bottleneck...although it has been topping out at only a 93-95% Memory Core Load lately.

 

I need ways to create some GPU headroom, just so that my CPU can then be further utilized in parallel (if necessary at all). Hopefully they can offload some tasks from the GPU to the CPU.

 

AA is not working optimally in 2.5, but that's not just a VR issue.

 

Agreed, but those not in VR have other options as workarounds -- i.e force AA through Nvidia Control Panel and supplement with Reshade.


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I wouldn't call it badly. Could it be better? of course. But bad? Not really.

 

But I understand that what's acceptable to one is horrible for another.

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For sure it's not bad.

The problem just comes from the fact that DS is needed to have a good looking environment (especially trees), but then MSAA is not an option in VR as this kills FPS.

And we're then stuck with ugly shimerings everywhere...

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For sure it's not bad.

The problem just comes from the fact that DS is needed to have a good looking environment (especially trees), but then MSAA is not an option in VR as this kills FPS.

And we're then stuck with ugly shimerings everywhere...

 

Gamma and lighting can also be used for an enormous advantage. Fly when the sun is coming up, or going down, or at night, and the game looks the most realistic and gorgeous thing I have ever seen. The overlapping mountainous valleys and snowy forests contrasted with the pinkish/orange skies, and the dazzling morning sun! I guess though for a lot of people who play competitive MP choosing their own time of day is not really allowed and they are forced by others to fly at 12 lol! Myself I'm just ecstatic flying around Vegas blowing stuff up!

 

I mean it looks practically real and I just cant get over how fantastic it is. The other sim we all like can not hold a candle to 2.5 when it is at its best, in the right light at the right time!

 

Remember too Gama can be changed in game in the options, this can have an enormously positive effect and make maps that look too bright, darker, and those that look too dark lighter. Just take all those shimmering bad textures and hide them with the gamma slider!

 

Try flying with no MSSA and go back to 2x and you will really appreciate how much better it looks compared to no MSSA, whereas if you come from 4x you're going to be noticing the shimmering more.

 

Don't let a bit of shimmering spoil the experience though because with DS DCS looks better than it ever has!

 

Have you guys who play MP in the US or Europe never thought about getting together and starting VR only servers? I think DCS really needs such servers because then the settings could be properly tailored to the special specifications of VR, namely performance and lighting.

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I do not have 1080ti, Just 1070, but I find dcs 2.5 better and less stuttering than 1.5.8. I play msaa 2x and tried PD 1.2 but do not have solid 45 FPS, while with msaa 2x and PD 1 I have. And I find graphics quite good, surely better than 1.5.8. I'm trying PD 1.1 but maybe I'll come back to 1 since IMHO the most AA effect is obtained with Just msaa 2x.

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