New (again) to DCS with noob plane questions.

Hi guys and gals,

Many years ago I bought LockOn for me and my stepdad. Back then we were noobs and tried to do it right but had too many issues so we quit trying. Our issues back then were conflicts with our X52 HOTAS and either Logitech or Microsoft keyboards or driver issues etc. When we did manage to fly we had cheat-sheets to get the plane fired up and into the air. It was fun but my stepdad got his into the air faster and then strafed me on the runway. Good times. :music_whistling: Anyhow, I have a renewed interest and installed DCS 2.5 and bought FC3 and quickly realized the planes cockpits are not clickable so I want to buy a good all around jet that is more noob friendly. Any recommendations?? And for the controls I still have my brand new X52 and also a Sidewinder FF2 joystick. Will the FF2 work nowadays? And is the X52 "good enough" for now? Also, my neighbor is the one that mentioned this DCS sim and I told him of the good old days and he wanted me to come fly with him. So, for my stepdads birthday I bought him FC3 and we hope to fly with my neighbor (along with a lot of other enthusiasts) soon...

Thanks,

Dave

p.s. My new freshly built Win10 Pro with 32GB ram and a 1080TI and i7-8700k cpu ought to handle it I think. :D

The only clickable module I can recommend you is the one you like/love. All of them are hard at the begin but sweet like honey after you learn them. What it matters is do you like air to air or air to ground role? I fly the Mig-21Bis and I love it, I also fly the A10C, have learned it pretty much and I love this one too. If you love a plane, you will learn to fly it. What do you think of the new F/A-18C?

The only clickable module I can recommend you is the one you like/love. All of them are hard at the begin but sweet like honey after you learn them. What it matters is do you like air to air or air to ground role? I fly the Mig-21Bis and I love it, I also fly the A10C, have learned it pretty much and I love this one too. If you love a plane, you will learn to fly it. What do you think of the new F/A-18C?

I love the F/A-18C. :thumbup: I like both Air to Air and Air to Ground but air to air probably better. But I love the A-10 too. So I guess I need to get one dedicated for each task. Maybe a Mig-21B, FA-18C, and a A10C. I like the F-15 too so I need to make a decision...

On the terrains that new Persian gulf map is looking good. I suppose in the end I will get all 3 of those...

Though I agree with the statement that you should get a module that you like, there are still, I think, modules that are more complicated than others.

From the clickable cockpit modules (not FC3), I own the Mig21bis, the Mirage 2000C, the F-5E, the A10C...

If I'd list them by levels of difficulty, the least difficult first, I'd say:

F5E - Mig21bis - Mirage 2000C - A10C.

And I should say... the A10C is a lot of fun, but it is "by far" the most complicated module I have. Obviously, once you get the hang of it, one could argue that "it is not all that complicated". But, the learning curve is steeper that the others. At least this was my experience.

I think, one of the reason for that, is because you basically need something like 6 hat switches on your joystick for the A10. If you don't, like me, you map them to something else, but it does increase difficulty. Most of those "hat switch" controls are for things you want to have access to quickly. That is, not have to push buttons on your keyboard.

And also, understanding the logic of locking, slaving targets, etc on the A-10 takes a bit of time to get. There are a lot of posts on this forum that help understand though. It really helped me.

 

I think, one of the reason for that, is because you basically need something like 6 hat switches on your joystick for the A10. If you don't, like me, you map them to something else, but it does increase difficulty. Most of those "hat switch" controls are for things you want to have access to quickly. That is, not have to push buttons on your keyboard.

 

Yeah, the A10C requires a HOTAS with a lot of buttons. The F-18C seems to require less but I don't know yet.

I love the F/A-18C. :thumbup: I like both Air to Air and Air to Ground but air to air probably better. But I love the A-10 too. So I guess I need to get one dedicated for each task. Maybe a Mig-21B, FA-18C, and a A10C. I like the F-15 too so I need to make a decision...

 

On the terrains that new Persian gulf map is looking good. I suppose in the end I will get all 3 of those...

You can buy the F18 while on a pre-purchase discount, save 20 dollars. Before you get into A10C and Mig21Bis, do some research on yt, there are a lot of dcs videos of them.

Edit- Altho the F18 will be amazing when completed, having only dumb bombs and rockets might not be interesting for a long period, until it gets the smart weapons. If you want something with GBUs, Mavericks, JDAMs, then the A10C is just right, before the F18 gets them.

I love the F/A-18C. :thumbup: I like both Air to Air and Air to Ground but air to air probably better. But I love the A-10 too. So I guess I need to get one dedicated for each task.

[...]

There are multirole aircraft as well. The F/A-18 is a prime example for that. But FistofZen is right: It depends on what you like (fighter, ground pounder, helos, vintage aircraft, ....).

If you want module no that is "jack of all trades" for Air-to-Air as for Air-to-Ground, I would go for Harrier AV-8B N/A. It is more capable than A-10C, carries just little less ordinance but you do more sorties in the time that A-10C does. The Harrier is like 70% ground and 30% air at the moment, even when we are limited now to AIM-9 IR missiles. But if developers get things going well, we would see AV-8B+ that is a Air-to-Air variant of it, carrying AIM-120 etc and it is more like a 60% air-to-air and 40% air-to-ground.

The F/A-18C Hornet would be in future maybe the best one, as it is like 50/50 for Air-to-Air as Air-to-Ground. It ain't as fast as F-15C, Mirage 200C or Mig-21Bis is, but very capable air-to-air performer. It can carry good load of smart bombs etc, but it ain't even same class as Harrier is and even less than A-10C is.

Mirage 2000C is more like 80% air-to-air and 20% air-to-ground. Nice set of bombs and rockets to carry, and can do fancy GPS bomb lofting etc, but it is still designed to be a bomber interceptor and close-combat maneuverable.

So I would forget A-10C and all other modules and get either Harrier or Hornet for starter. Other gets released in this month (or so). Other is already out.

The F-15C is fancy and as you have FC3 already, you have it. You as well have Su-25T and Su-25A that are excellent air-to-ground pounders (arguably better than A-10C) but as you want clickable cockpit, it is just for those two western aircrafts as there likely ain't anything coming for eastern side for couple years. And you as well already have A-10A so you get to play that now and then.

The Harrier I would say is fairly "n00b friendly", a much easier than A-10C is.

I dare to claim that if Harrier II would have been released same time as A-10C was, there would be more Harrier II pilots than A-10C pilots. So good that aircraft is.

And I am little in conflict with F/A-18C as I preordered it on first day, but purchased Harrier for reason that I don't even remember now, and it has caused me to reconsider F/A-18C purchase just because how well with Harrier one can take combat against F-15C and F/A-18C (even when those are piloted by AI with unfair flight modeling for their benefit).

I recommend you to go to YouTube and search some Harrier and Hornet documentaries and interviews and check which one will "click" you more.

The F/A-18C likely will be the most complex by avionics to handle compared what there is now. The upcoming F-14 Tomcat is likely the most complex when it comes out as it after all has Pilot + RIO combination, but that I could think to be your and your co-pilot dream to fly as you could sometimes hold flight weekends where you set your computers side by side or in line just for sake of fun and fly other being pilot and other being a RIO.

I would start with the new F18 because multi rol or Av8b. But notting is more rewarding then when you learn the plane and avionics and makes it easier when you buy a different westren planes what comes out in the future. The other planes are regular on sale like the A10c,F5e

Hi guys and gals,

Many years ago I bought LockOn for me and my stepdad. Back then we were noobs and tried to do it right but had too many issues so we quit trying. Our issues back then were conflicts with our X52 HOTAS and either Logitech or Microsoft keyboards or driver issues etc. When we did manage to fly we had cheat-sheets to get the plane fired up and into the air. It was fun but my stepdad got his into the air faster and then strafed me on the runway. Good times. :music_whistling: Anyhow, I have a renewed interest and installed DCS 2.5 and bought FC3 and quickly realized the planes cockpits are not clickable so I want to buy a good all around jet that is more noob friendly. Any recommendations?? And for the controls I still have my brand new X52 and also a Sidewinder FF2 joystick. Will the FF2 work nowadays? And is the X52 "good enough" for now? Also, my neighbor is the one that mentioned this DCS sim and I told him of the good old days and he wanted me to come fly with him. So, for my stepdads birthday I bought him FC3 and we hope to fly with my neighbor (along with a lot of other enthusiasts) soon...

Thanks,

Dave

 

p.s. My new freshly built Win10 Pro with 32GB ram and a 1080TI and i7-8700k cpu ought to handle it I think. :D

There are noob friendly jets and planes that are a lot of fun. F-86 has rockets, bombs, and lots of guns to play with. Startup is so easy that it almost hurts. 3 buttons and a radio call. It's pretty much the easiest fully clickable cockpit plane and it's a lot of fun.

How anyone can recommend the F18 t this point is beyond me. No one has flown it......

So the direct answer your question...F-86 is pretty easy. F5 and Mig15 are also very easy to get going. Mig is a little more challenging due to its rigging design. After that...trainers are all pretty easy to fly. WWII planes are all out for now as they are the most challenging. After the trainers is probably goes to the Mig21, and then the more modern advanced planes. But F-86 is the easiest and most versatile for noobs.

Will the FF2 work nowadays?

I guess your other questions were already answered in detail.

All rotary pilots say the MS FFB2 is all around the best FFB stick out there, and it gets harder and harder to find some on ebay for a reasonable price. So absolutely, keep it if you ever intend to go the rotary wing way. :thumbup:

I guess it also works well the the Warbirds. For modern HOTAS jets, it probably lacks the buttons needed to make good use of the aircraft.

There are noob friendly jets and planes that are a lot of fun. F-86 has rockets, bombs, and lots of guns to play with. Startup is so easy that it almost hurts. 3 buttons and a radio call. It's pretty much the easiest fully clickable cockpit plane and it's a lot of fun.

How anyone can recommend the F18 t this point is beyond me. No one has flown it......

So the direct answer your question...F-86 is pretty easy. F5 and Mig15 are also very easy to get going. Mig is a little more challenging due to its rigging design. After that...trainers are all pretty easy to fly. WWII planes are all out for now as they are the most challenging. After the trainers is probably goes to the Mig21, and then the more modern advanced planes. But F-86 is the easiest and most versatile for noobs.

I gotta agree (partially) with you on the F18. Some have flown the aicraft in early access.

However, to recommend a plane that is far from being released is kinda dumb...

Also, nobody is mentioning that the Harrier is still in beta... It is still a work in progress, from what I know. I think whoever recommends it should also give a heads up that there are still bugs and things being developped. Such as the missions, trainings, etc, are under development.

Though I agree with the statement that you should get a module that you like, there are still, I think, modules that are more complicated than others.

 

From the clickable cockpit modules (not FC3), I own the Mig21bis, the Mirage 2000C, the F-5E, the A10C...

 

If I'd list them by levels of difficulty, the least difficult first, I'd say:

F5E - Mig21bis - Mirage 2000C - A10C.

 

And I should say... the A10C is a lot of fun, but it is "by far" the most complicated module I have. Obviously, once you get the hang of it, one could argue that "it is not all that complicated". But, the learning curve is steeper that the others. At least this was my experience.

 

I think, one of the reason for that, is because you basically need something like 6 hat switches on your joystick for the A10. If you don't, like me, you map them to something else, but it does increase difficulty. Most of those "hat switch" controls are for things you want to have access to quickly. That is, not have to push buttons on your keyboard.

 

And also, understanding the logic of locking, slaving targets, etc on the A-10 takes a bit of time to get. There are a lot of posts on this forum that help understand though. It really helped me.

Very good info for me here. I want to fly sooner than later so I can put the A10C on the back burner for now... I appreciate the "levels of difficulty" comparison. Makes me think of an F5E for starters but I have read ahead in these posts and the Harrier might be in my hangar too. I appreciate the good info.

Thanks,

Dave

Yeah, the A10C requires a HOTAS with a lot of buttons. The F-18C seems to require less but I don't know yet.

 

 

 

You can buy the F18 while on a pre-purchase discount, save 20 dollars. Before you get into A10C and Mig21Bis, do some research on yt, there are a lot of dcs videos of them.

 

Edit- Altho the F18 will be amazing when completed, having only dumb bombs and rockets might not be interesting for a long period, until it gets the smart weapons. If you want something with GBUs, Mavericks, JDAMs, then the A10C is just right, before the F18 gets them.

More good info to think about...dumb bombs and rockets. :( The A10C may be a Xmas gift for me as I want to fly sooner than later. My neighbor likes the F86 but I am thinking the F5E so I don't have the same jet. ;)

Thanks,

Dave

I would like to add that Chuck's Guide can help you a great deal in understanding the full fidelity modules. Combined with the manual that comes with the module of your chosing you shouldnt have a super hard time. It takes some time and practice, but you will get there eventually, and these guides can really help you understand faster!

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=135765

There are multirole aircraft as well. The F/A-18 is a prime example for that. But FistofZen is right: It depends on what you like (fighter, ground pounder, helos, vintage aircraft, ....).

I think over time I will have multiple clickable jets. What is the average number of jets people end up with I wonder. I am thinking I will end up with 4 for some reason... :)

I think over time I will have multiple clickable jets. What is the average number of jets people end up with I wonder. I am thinking I will end up with 4 for some reason... :)

Probably almost all of them. How many of them we're actually capable pilots in... personally, I gotta say just the A-10C. ;)

If you want module no that is "jack of all trades" for Air-to-Air as for Air-to-Ground, I would go for Harrier AV-8B N/A. It is more capable than A-10C, carries just little less ordinance but you do more sorties in the time that A-10C does. The Harrier is like 70% ground and 30% air at the moment, even when we are limited now to AIM-9 IR missiles. But if developers get things going well, we would see AV-8B+ that is a Air-to-Air variant of it, carrying AIM-120 etc and it is more like a 60% air-to-air and 40% air-to-ground.

 

The F/A-18C Hornet would be in future maybe the best one, as it is like 50/50 for Air-to-Air as Air-to-Ground. It ain't as fast as F-15C, Mirage 200C or Mig-21Bis is, but very capable air-to-air performer. It can carry good load of smart bombs etc, but it ain't even same class as Harrier is and even less than A-10C is.

 

Mirage 2000C is more like 80% air-to-air and 20% air-to-ground. Nice set of bombs and rockets to carry, and can do fancy GPS bomb lofting etc, but it is still designed to be a bomber interceptor and close-combat maneuverable.

 

So I would forget A-10C and all other modules and get either Harrier or Hornet for starter. Other gets released in this month (or so). Other is already out.

 

The F-15C is fancy and as you have FC3 already, you have it. You as well have Su-25T and Su-25A that are excellent air-to-ground pounders (arguably better than A-10C) but as you want clickable cockpit, it is just for those two western aircrafts as there likely ain't anything coming for eastern side for couple years. And you as well already have A-10A so you get to play that now and then.

 

The Harrier I would say is fairly "n00b friendly", a much easier than A-10C is.

 

I dare to claim that if Harrier II would have been released same time as A-10C was, there would be more Harrier II pilots than A-10C pilots. So good that aircraft is.

And I am little in conflict with F/A-18C as I preordered it on first day, but purchased Harrier for reason that I don't even remember now, and it has caused me to reconsider F/A-18C purchase just because how well with Harrier one can take combat against F-15C and F/A-18C (even when those are piloted by AI with unfair flight modeling for their benefit).

 

I recommend you to go to YouTube and search some Harrier and Hornet documentaries and interviews and check which one will "click" you more.

 

 

 

 

 

The F/A-18C likely will be the most complex by avionics to handle compared what there is now. The upcoming F-14 Tomcat is likely the most complex when it comes out as it after all has Pilot + RIO combination, but that I could think to be your and your co-pilot dream to fly as you could sometimes hold flight weekends where you set your computers side by side or in line just for sake of fun and fly other being pilot and other being a RIO.

Loads of good info here. Thanks. And the F14-Tomcat in the future. Yikes! Like a dream come true. I am going to watch these videos and look more closely at the Harrier and the F5E. I see a lighter wallet in my future. :D

edit: Quick question. I do not own any VR Headset and was curious if any module "requires" one or if they are just optional on some module that offer it??

If you want to get down to the basics and make it sweet and simple, get the L-39 and use the ZA version for light CAS and counter insurgency stuff. Great fun.

I would start with the new F18 because multi rol or Av8b. But notting is more rewarding then when you learn the plane and avionics and makes it easier when you buy a different westren planes what comes out in the future. The other planes are regular on sale like the A10c,F5e

Thanks for the info. F18 may be bought for the discount but I am thinking F5E for getting in the game quicker. Or maybe the Harrier. :book:

There are noob friendly jets and planes that are a lot of fun. F-86 has rockets, bombs, and lots of guns to play with. Startup is so easy that it almost hurts. 3 buttons and a radio call. It's pretty much the easiest fully clickable cockpit plane and it's a lot of fun.

How anyone can recommend the F18 t this point is beyond me. No one has flown it......

So the direct answer your question...F-86 is pretty easy. F5 and Mig15 are also very easy to get going. Mig is a little more challenging due to its rigging design. After that...trainers are all pretty easy to fly. WWII planes are all out for now as they are the most challenging. After the trainers is probably goes to the Mig21, and then the more modern advanced planes. But F-86 is the easiest and most versatile for noobs.

Thanks for the info. Neighbor flies the F-86 so I may go with the F5E as to not have the same plane. I knew he picked that plane for a reason. :P

If you want to get down to the basics and make it sweet and simple, get the L-39 and use the ZA version for light CAS and counter insurgency stuff. Great fun.

I just looked at the Albatros and it looks pretty cool too. I guess I need to plan on buying multiple planes over time as this looks like going into a gun store and only buying one gun. It's not gonna work. :smilewink:

Thanks

Thanks everybody that replied to my thread. I will do some final thinking and see what I come up with. Right now I see 3 purchases and I haven't even bought the terrains yet. Lucky there are only 3 of them. :huh: That Persian Gulf looks great. Not so interested in Normandy (old planes) and the Nevada test range looks ok. I can fly in the Caucasus for a while but may but the Persian Gulf before the end of the month...

A word of warning, learning full fidelity AC will be both frustrating and oh so rewarding. In my case, it's highly addicting and in turn, I have all the modules both for fixed wing and rotary. I started with the A-10C and with a Logitech 3D Pro (the lack of buttons was a handicap), then moved to a X52 and was able to map the buttons to my liking (this forum has great resource but ultimately, it's down to your preference and be prepared to lose yourself trying different layouts). Most of the folks here are aviation enthusiasts and some hardcore ones at that.

The F5E is a good choice, just be prepared to want more :)

A word of warning, learning full fidelity AC will be both frustrating and oh so rewarding. In my case, it's highly addicting and in turn, I have all the modules both for fixed wing and rotary. I started with the A-10C and with a Logitech 3D Pro (the lack of buttons was a handicap), then moved to a X52 and was able to map the buttons to my liking (this forum has great resource but ultimately, it's down to your preference and be prepared to lose yourself trying different layouts). Most of the folks here are aviation enthusiasts and some hardcore ones at that.

 

The F5E is a good choice, just be prepared to want more :)

Yeah, I figure it will be a challenge but I like challenges. I know there will be some tough days and some very good ones. I used to code in VB6 and some days turned into nights and apps took months to years to develop. But the challenge kept me at it. I was curious about the mapping of the buttons and switches too. For instance, are there any cheat-sheets for the X52 Pro and are the DCS "default settings" pretty good or does everybody go with their own preferences? Just curious if it is better to stay with defaults and learn them for ease of being standard when talking to others when I have issues.

Thanks,

Dave

Yeah, I figure it will be a challenge but I like challenges. I know there will be some tough days and some very good ones. I used to code in VB6 and some days turned into nights and apps took months to years to develop. But the challenge kept me at it. I was curious about the mapping of the buttons and switches too. For instance, are there any cheat-sheets for the X52 Pro and are the DCS "default settings" pretty good or does everybody go with their own preferences? Just curious if it is better to stay with defaults and learn them for ease of being standard when talking to others when I have issues.

Thanks,

Dave

You can't use DCS default control settings. By default it will map useless things on your joystick buttons. For instance, map the "view change" to one of your hat switch. It's fine if you really want to use it. But a lot of people here either use TrackIR (some go VR if you have the budget, and computer for it).

The X52 is a popular joystick, so you will surely find "suggested" button maping and such, but I believe a lot of people will experiment and use their own stuff. At least, that is what I do. I don't mind using suggestions as a starting point, but I will always adjust to my personal preferences.

And, I have a joystick that is not that much popular, even though I think it is great value for the price (Thrustmaster T16000m Stick, Throttle and Rudder)

There are existing profiles for some that shared their profiles for X52 (just make sure you use the profile appropriate for your X52 as there is a Pro and a non-Pro). I used one for the Hog with complete cheat sheets and a graphical layout of the buttons. I personally try to map the buttons as close to how the buttons are in real-life, then map the rest of the most frequently used buttons/switches depending on the aircraft.

The key is to learn how to fly the A/C first then the mapping becomes intuitive and you can decide what layout makes sense to you. That's why I find it difficult to suggest layouts but they can be good starting points, specially if the ones who made the profile mirrors the actual buttons as close to real-life.