To defer shading or NOT to defer shading, this is the question...

Deffered shading is only way to go.

Deffered shading is only way to go.

I think you'll find both here and in quite a few other threads on this topic, that is very much a matter of opinion.

Of course I think it is great that DCS is looking much better especially the clouds but lets not lose sight that most of us have stuck with it for so long because it is first and foremost a high fidelity military combat simulator. I have a very pretty simulator with $1500 in addons a lot having to do with making it look great. It's call P3D.

To "realistically" depict reality in the sim it would look horrible. You would simply max out brightness, suck all the color out and add a filter to represent sunglasses.

Just seems odd that so many who scream for flight realism and by the book numbers to within a few mph and complain about a lack of a rivet or strut compression are also trying to create "pretty" sunrise/sunset "aahhhh" moments.

As long as I do not see immersion breaking jaggies, does not look like a comic book or cartoon and runs great, I am just not as picky.

Set up a mission against some tough ai, throw in some sams and ground to air defenses and suddenly I found I am not that concerned about how the shadows fall across the cockpit.

I admit to once being a .cfg junkie in FS9/FSX/P3D but TBO sometimes it's easy to get caught up in the weeds and lose sight of the goal which is to enjoy yourself. If you find yourself spending more time in the menus and loading screens there is a very good chance you too are that person.

On a related note, with DS off the trees look weird partly because there's a huge color difference between them and the forest floor bitmap. Any idea where the bitmap is stored so I could tinker with it some?

immersion breaking jaggies

This. The only thing I've truly hated in any 3D application I've ever used. Can't have them at all.

Sorry for the mini rant but "no affiliation" but go watch the Grim Reaper's fly some imaginary missions. Very, very exciting and imo the very core of what DCS was based on. I never once watching those missions and worry or really notice the shadows, trees, water color etc.

I remember when doing a gun run there was a PAUSE every time you pulled the trigger. A stutter during a explosion. I could never be a programmer. I can imagine late nights, Redbulls and months/years to free up some valuable cycles, a few fps only to have someone else fill it with eye candy.

I have been around long enough to see a pattern. 2 steps forward, one step back. I understand eye candy pulls in the casual player and it's great for sales but I would not trade one frame for a better explosion or moving grass.

Done typed another book but just don't want DCS to turn into FSX or Star Citizen thats all. I want the programmers to concentrate on the meat and potatoes and get it running great with as few hiccups as possible.

Movement forward and listening to those who have supported the sim since day one is why I have and still stick it out. When I see flying through rings I will become nervous.

When I see flying through rings I will become nervous.

Do you mean like in the P-51 training campaign?

Try calibrating your monitor.

 

I often calibrate my monitor referring to this gamma chart.

https://translate.google.co.jp/translate?sl=ja&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=ja&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.geocities.jp%2Foredisc%2Fmemo%2Fgamma%2Fgamma.html&edit-text=&act=url

The webpage recommends to adjust the monitor to Gamma=1.0 but usually 1.8 to 2.2 works. See the checker images at the bottom of the page.

Actually for PC platform the standard target is 2.2, mac is 1.8. This is because of the phosphor pigments' response of CRTs that required that gamma in order to look like 1. Today's displays continue to electronically mimic CRT gamma response so the 2.2 number is still the goal.

I'll use these charts now they are better that the ones I've used, so thanks for the link ;)

Im sorry OP, but I cant disagree more about DS...DS ON is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better IN ANY SITUATION than having it turned off...

DS enhances many things but no, you can't deny that the screenshots of cockpits against the sun are totally unrealistic and hilarious. Just drive your car against sunrise and tell me if you see your dashboard as brightly. Don't try to lie to everybody including yourself.

DS is tuned for day situation with the sun at the back only. Altering the situation just reveals how evident the range is too high and desperately static. Nothing will be better for low-lighting conditions and sun glare without bringing HDR back in whatever form. Tuning the materials only is hopeless.

Somehow I never felt cockpit too dark or unrealistic even against the sun in 2.5 DS and GI enabled, I had the same problem more especially in 1.58 and before with HDR though. Even looking at your screenshot I felt same except for MiG-21 at night. I often use A-10C, F-5E, AV-8B, F-15C, UH-1H, and VIGGEN. Haven't actually flown MiG-21 and BF109.

The human eye has a much wider latitude for brightness than game graphics can produce. Usually, the HDR rendering is a graphics technologies to compensate those differences.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-dynamic-range_rendering

However, In DCS, HDR option works more like an auto exposure of DSLR camera than what HDR will do. It adjusts in-game image exposure dynamically, set shadows as dark as possible and set highlights as brighter as possible. So when the sun is in the view it darker the cockpit and make them invisible. If the whole image is in the night, this will brighten up the image and things like a white needle of gauges become visible.

BTW, Deferred Shading hits performance with Multi-Sampling enabled in general. Usually, games with DF use post-processing anti-aliasing mode like SMAA or FXAA. DCS somehow didn't implement them. We can't even turn FXAA from Nvidia CP.

We can't even turn FXAA from Nvidia CP.

Sure we can, I've been using it since DS was implemented. I'm using 2D screen, however. It seems some folks have problems making it run in VR lately.

I tried this tonight, deferred shading is brilliant for terrain but cockpits look FAR better without it at the moment.

Not all cockpits are still in need of update, least with my experience.

Is there a list of modules that are ready for deferred shading? Does this apply only to Eagle Dynamics modules or are 3rd parties obligated to update their modules to the same standard?

I tried this tonight, deferred shading is brilliant for terrain but cockpits look FAR better without it at the moment.

 

Is there a list of modules that are ready for deferred shading? Does this apply only to Eagle Dynamics modules or are 3rd parties obligated to update their modules to the same standard?

In my opinion, it’s not a module thing, it’s a DCS thing. All cockpits are too contrasted, too extreme of dark and light with no subtle detail in different lighting with DS on, unlike HDR with DS off.

Just look at metal texture, or the instrument glass reflections.

From my experience, deferred shading looks 1000x better. I run the sim through my oculus and get absolutely beautiful frames with deferred shading on and with most of the graphic settings jacked up all the way. I tried a few times turning off deferred shading and HDR on, and honestly it looked terrible.

From my experience, deferred shading looks 1000x better. I run the sim through my oculus and get absolutely beautiful frames with deferred shading on and with most of the graphic settings jacked up all the way. I tried a few times turning off deferred shading and HDR on, and honestly it looked terrible.

That might be true with your oculus, but with a Monitor I believe it is not...

The cockpits and night lightning are awful...

That might be true with your oculus, but with a Monitor I believe it is not...

The cockpits and night lightning are awful...

The cockpits are a little dark and the contrast can look off. You are right. but ya know, its beta so hopefully there will be some adjustments down the road.

The cockpits are a little dark and the contrast can look off. You are right. but ya know, its beta so hopefully there will be some adjustments down the road.

"A little dark" ? More Pitch black with wrong night lightning I'd say.....

And my Monitor is a professional one, calibrated and properly set.

Razbams Harrier and Mirage cockpit are superdark with deffered shading. Unfortunatly for very long time. And nothing is still fixed :(

I have FC3, Mig-21, KA-50, F-5E, A-10C. All the cockpits are dark with Deffered Shading. All the textures outdoors looks bright and burned out, regardless of gamma. The worst shading is on new trees. Trees in 1.5.8 were properly dark and fast. In 2.5 they are bright green, even at night. Not good results.

Mr.9-

Has this problem with dark cockpits been brought up to the Dev's or put into the proper bug report? Also would you mind keeping us posted on the memory leak situiation?

Laz

There was an update about MemLeak Situation in the Newsletter today.