REAL LIFE Hot Shot Case 1 Recovery...

IRL once I set the trim to on-speed, I didn’t touch it again. Some other guys may have their own techniques.

In real life? In a real Hornet? That’s not what a retired Navy pilot is teaching me. Don’t you need to make trim changes in concert with power changes?

In real life? In a real Hornet? That’s not what a retired Navy pilot is teaching me. Don’t you need to make trim changes in concert with power changes?

In the airplanes I’ve flown that aren’t Hornets, yes I need to readjust trim as I change my power setting.

For ball flying, you do not need to retrim for all the hundreds of power corrections made in the groove. I don’t do ball flying in those other airplanes. The only time you’d need to retrim in the groove is if you trimmed it wrong originally and you need to fix it.

IRL, I trimmed it for onspeed on the downwind, then I didn’t touch it again, 99% of the time.

In real life? In a real Hornet? That’s not what a retired Navy pilot is teaching me. Don’t you need to make trim changes in concert with power changes?

Once you trim to on-speed, you should pretty much stay on-speed regardless of throttle input and not require any additional pitch trim unless you're pitching up/down on the stick. But whatever works I guess.

The video in the OP? Can quite clearly see it being trimmed at about 50 sec.

I must have blinked. :)

Lol why has no-one referenced that for a start its a different airframe lol. Why you guys thus trying to replicate it or reference the differences to a Hornet C.

Bigger wing surface area for a start (90 square feet circa 25%), different engines(extra 9000lbs thrust), extra 10,000 lbs of weight. Break turn has very high g in the break, loosing speed much quicker than a bow break "normal circuit" with less g and smaller wing/mass.

Don't see what the commotion is, trained and experienced pilot flying and simply that doing his job and a bit of showboating.

As for using the stick alot, again ?? He's getting nose authority, also he's using alot of rudder to get his aspect to where it needs to be.

Lol why has no-one referenced that for a start its a different airframe lol. And why you guys thus trying to replicate it or reference the differences to a Hornet C.

 

Bigger wing surface area for a start (90 square feet circa 25%), different engines(extra 9000lbs thrust), extra 10,000 lbs of weight. Break turn has very high g in the break, loosing speed much quicker than a bow break "normal circuit" with less g and smaller wing/mass.

 

Don't see what the commotion is, trained and experienced pilot flying and simply that doing his job and a bit of showboating.

 

As for using the stick alot, again ?? He's getting nose authority, also he's using alot of rudder to get his aspect to where it needs to be.

Ball flying mechanics are virtually identical for the Hornet and Super Hornet. Also, he is not using the rudders in the groove. They are not used for ball flying at all.

Ball flying mechanics are virtually identical for the Hornet and Super Hornet. Also, he is not using the rudders in the groove. They are not used for ball flying at all.

Didn't say in the grove that's common sense unless sudden wind direction changes /gusts - he's using alot during the turn obviously. Also not referencing the ball flying, was referring to how the jet is bleeding speed compared to some of the first comments in the chain.

"..Nasty perfected the SHB shit hot break. His signature maneuver was to approach the Boat at 600 knots and 600 feet. Nasty would bring his section of F-14s in 30 degrees inside the wake so that he would have more than 180 degrees to slow down. He would hit the intersection of ship and wake and snap, knife edge over the platform, both saluting and taunting the LSOs who stood slack-jawed with necks craned staring up at him.

Nasty would hit the abeam a little fast and wide, but nailing 600’. He would give the nose one more emphatic reef, slowing down enough to spread the wings and drop the gear. With 90 to go the flaps would be fully deployed and Nasty would be on profile, though still about 20 knots fast. He would roll into the groove a little high and fast, and work it down with such patience and precision that it was a joy to watch. After the inevitable 3-wire, I would turn to the writer with a big smirk and say what I always did, “High fast start, little high fast in the middle. OK pass.”

.. "

Ok, i will try and do a better job this time explaining the concept.

 

... aircraft naturally seek what they are trimmed for regardless of power, attitude, control type, etc (if in fact the pilot has the control of the trim in the first place). Positive longitudinal stability.

 

If you are properly trimmed on speed, the aircraft will seek that. As it seeks on speed it will go through a series of oscillation (trading kinetic energy for potential and vice versa. basically the nose pitching up and down) if left to its own demise, those oscillation will eventual dampen out and reach equilibrium (on speed if that is in fact what you are trimmed for). You can expedite the aircraft seeking equilibrium by helping dampen out those oscillation with your right hand. this is the "influencing the nose" concept.

 

What you don't what to do is over pitch the nose and exacerbate those oscillation.

Nor do you want to change the trim (again, given the primes that you are trimmed for what you want, on speed) thus changing the aircraft seeking on speed, to something other than.

 

The way this will all display in the cockpit and be useful information to you as the front seat stick actuating meat puppet is: The E bracket and velocity vector will move together. IF they move excessively independently from each other, you are flying glide slope with the nose and that is no bueno ...

 

Hope that helps. :)

 

EDIT: just read the previous page (sorry i am on my phone) and looks like others have said exactly what my dumb but regurgitated. sorry about that, carry on.

Hi - thanks for insight, so useful...... can I ask, do I understand correctly that once you trimmed the jet to on speed at the start of the downwind leg and levelled out , that you should not touch the trim again? I find in the sim that as I manoeuvre ( and obviously, the worse I fly, ie more manoeuvring, the bigger these are) I will get the bracket & VV separating. Currently I am making small pitch adjustments to compensate, driven mostly by Banklers scoring system that grades if you are on speed at various points, so that my score is higher. If I understand correctly you are saying once trimmed, leave it and just fly by throttle and “influencing” the stick, don’t worry about being out of true on the line up of the bracket, as it will resolve itself if you are properly trimmed?

Edit...damn, should have read the whole post first before typing that..... I see it’s all there.... sorry!

Chris Hadfield's 2.3 million twitter followers now think this is how aircraft are recovered at night in the rain.

Tried it too in a hog. Just for fun. Had to execute a high altitude dive to gain enough speed to touch 500KIAS, the max I think.

@Ready the phalanx so wanted to shoot down the unidentified intruder. good job though