AbortedMan Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Can we please get guns on the Huey? Blue currently has zero anti-heli options to protect themselves when they happen to meet an Mi-8 and SA342M isn't very capable either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frostie Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 (edited) The video specifically shows the fighter to fighter capability...there is no AWACs in that example. Only works with AI wingman for whatever reason. Apart from AWACs, there is a ground Radar unit that also works with it. Could be used to replace the current ones and 27s would have DL with them. The datalink in mp is very simple, it uses either AWACS or an EWR unit. Two EWR units exist in DCS where one of them is used in BlueFlag at every airbase to determine whether AI flights get triggered or not (EWR alive or dead). Unlike single player in mp this datalink is not fighter to fighter and ED don't have plans to fix that for mp. From a coverage point of view obviously AWACS gives far better coverage than EWR does from the ground. As far as I remember when checking the EWRs in BF they have had broadcasting turned off. Edited June 14, 2017 by Frostie "[51☭] FROSTIE" #55 51st PVO "BISONS" Fastest MiG pilot in the world - TCR'10 https://100kiap.org Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thrud Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Can we please get guns on the Huey? Blue currently has zero anti-heli options to protect themselves when they happen to meet an Mi-8 and SA342M isn't very capable either. And the other 2 gazelle models. Haven't been on the server since they're missing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oceandar Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 The datalink in mp is very simple, it uses either AWACS or an EWR unit. Two EWR units exist in DCS where one of them is used in BlueFlag at every airbase to determine whether AI flights get triggered or not (EWR alive or dead). Unlike single player in mp this datalink is not fighter to fighter and ED don't have plans to fix that for mp. From a coverage point of view obviously AWACS gives far better coverage than EWR does from the ground. As far as I remember when checking the EWRs in BF they have had broadcasting turned off. Oh yeah, since this is a testing phase let us test this. Both DL in one separate round and limited ER to 2 only as Rage suggested. I'm ready :D Sent from my A1601 using Tapatalk Mastering others is strength. Mastering yourself is true power. - Lao Tze Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cisco Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 There is no way to limit it to 2 ER's without either making the airfield empty of ER's and then your aircraft spawn with missiles (meaning no rearm of ER's) or then putting them in inventory of the airfield meaning you can take as much as you want. We had 27ER's AND ET's on the Su-33 before and ofc F-15's where whining but we where pretty balanced and stuck fighting over coastline sochi - gudata area. 104th has missions with ER vs AIM-7 and it turns out just fine. The ER's are still stupid in terms of chaff and notch so if you get shot down in the F-15 for employing stupid tactics its pretty much your own fault. ER is more balanced than R IMHO. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Rage* Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Im useless with the ME stuff. So you're saying its either no ERs or full ER? Is there not a possibility to limit the pylon loadouts individually (ie block the other non-ER MRM pylons for the Su27)? [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 64th "Scorpions" Aggressor Squadron Discord: 64th Aggressor Squadron TS: 195.201.110.22 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbortedMan Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 This entire server does not revolve around the Mirage. Some people don't have it, choose not to fly it, etc. Just because its on both sides does not mean its an even playing field for A2A. In most games, since you and I talked about MMO's you can use that as an example, if something is overpowered, people make changes to balance a server. Yes most of the time those changes are from devs, but that does not mean that the guys here at 373/BF can't make changes to balance things for this server specifically. Things get really stale when its just M2000 vs M2000 all the time and that is what it is now. Also, balance is something that is ongoing. In any game you play, Counter strike etc. there are on going changes to weapons and balance. If something is over used changes are made to balance the game and the environment. If DL doesn't help, take it out. All we want to do is try new things to see what it does to the environment. By the way, DL is STANDARD equipment for the Flanker. It was taken out originally in BF because it was broken. ED fixed it. Even 104th is letting the Flanker use DL now. We are not, and not advocating, for adding anything the Flanker does not have as standard equipment. If you don't want non-standard things to be in the sim than take away the M2000C D2M pod as it was only ever designed for the D variant and has never been deployed on a C. Honestly not trying to sound like a dick or start an argument, but should anyone really be having a conversation with you about how balance works when you're the guy that thinks it's totally ok to be connecting with dual DCS accounts/installs to take both a fighter slot and a Forward Observer slot at the same time to have GCI information on a 2nd monitor while you fly a fighter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frostie Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Im useless with the ME stuff. So you're saying its either no ERs or full ER? Is there not a possibility to limit the pylon loadouts individually (ie block the other non-ER MRM pylons for the Su27)? Only by adjusting lua files then everybody would have to do it for ic. Basically no go. "[51☭] FROSTIE" #55 51st PVO "BISONS" Fastest MiG pilot in the world - TCR'10 https://100kiap.org Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mia389 Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Honestly not trying to sound like a dick or start an argument, but should anyone really be having a conversation with you about how balance works when you're the guy that thinks it's totally ok to be connecting with dual DCS accounts/installs to take both a fighter slot and a Forward Observer slot at the same time to have GCI information on a 2nd monitor while you fly a fighter? Its Ironic that you are calling out someone, when you were the one in spectator for over an hour while your buddies were flying around on server a few nights ago. Blue logged off because of it, including me. Since I have came back you have added nothing but whining in this thread. Time to use the ignore feature :pilotfly: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pheonix0869 Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 (edited) Found this about some one at ED working on missile code: https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3156910&postcount=14 Like I said, I think things have gone off the rails a bit. The goal is to eliminate the M2K v M2K "balance" issue, right? I'm not sure how adding the ER or data-link will execute this task. A far simpler solution, if this is indeed the "problem" that we are dealing with, would be to limit M2K spots... ~10-15 each side. Maybe less. I choose to fly the Viggen over the A-10C most of the time, because I enjoy flying it and the challenges it offers. If you added cluster munitions to the A-10 I wouldn't stop flying the Viggen... the logic here is off the wall, insanity. People will fly what they want to fly, because its their free time. I wouldn't join a server to do a "job." If people wanted to fly the 27 they would, and they do. SO... go ahead, try balancing the mission by giving the ER to the SU-27, but when this doesn't solve the issue of M2K v M2K, i will so be typing "I told you so." In either case, in 6-mo this will all be moot, with 2-3 more "study level" fighters set to be released. Edited June 14, 2017 by Pheonix0869 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M0ltar Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 (edited) Honestly not trying to sound like a dick or start an argument, but should anyone really be having a conversation with you about how balance works when you're the guy that thinks it's totally ok to be connecting with dual DCS accounts/installs to take both a fighter slot and a Forward Observer slot at the same time to have GCI information on a 2nd monitor while you fly a fighter? I've never hidden that I GCI'd for RVE while I flew. Anyone that asked I told them what was up. I never tried to hide it from anyone. Hell, you and I even talked about it because you said you had a problem with it and I said, even though I didnt agree with you, that I'd stop, which I did . Ive even talked to the BF guys about it. If you want to make this about personnel attacks I'm more than Happy to talk to you off line or TS about it again. and we can rehash this chat we had. Edited June 14, 2017 by M0ltar 1 [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 64th Aggressors TS DCSWorldEvents Twitch Splash One Gaming Splash One Gaming Discord The Merge SATAL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M0ltar Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Found this about some one at ED working on missile code: https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3156910&postcount=14 Like I said, I think things have gone off the rails a bit. The goal is to eliminate the M2K v M2K "balance" issue, right? I'm not sure how adding the ER or data-link will execute this task. A far simpler solution, if this is indeed the "problem" that we are dealing with, would be to limit M2K spots... ~10-15 each side. Maybe less. I choose to fly the Viggen over the A-10C most of the time, because I enjoy flying it and the challenges it offers. If you added cluster munitions to the A-10 I wouldn't stop flying the Viggen... the logic here is off the wall, insanity. People will fly what they want to fly, because its their free time. I wouldn't join a server to do a "job." If people wanted to fly the 27 they would, and they do. SO... go ahead, try balancing the mission by giving the ER to the SU-27, but when this doesn't solve the issue of M2K v M2K, i will so be typing "I told you so." In either case, in 6-mo this will all be moot, with 2-3 more "study level" fighters set to be released. That may be why you fly the Viggen, but ask others why they fly the Mirage. Ive done it quite a bit on red and a lot it is because there is advantage, a major advantage. Most people, not all, will fly or use whatever gives them the best bets in a fight. This to me is true no matter what game or situation you're in. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 64th Aggressors TS DCSWorldEvents Twitch Splash One Gaming Splash One Gaming Discord The Merge SATAL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pheonix0869 Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 That may be why you fly the Viggen, but ask others why they fly the Mirage. Ive done it quite a bit on red and a lot it is because there is advantage, a major advantage. Most people, not all, will fly or use whatever gives them the best bets in a fight. This to me is true no matter what game or situation you're in. I guess I'm a glass half full kinda guy... there is only one way to find out though. In the meantime, it would be unfair for me to continue this discussion without first hand experience in the SU-27 online, thus, Red, here I come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ciribob Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Balance is a tricky subject. In the end, we as BuddySpike can only do so much - the rest is up to YOU as a community. If you feel there are too many Mirages, then don't fly Mirage - ask other teammates and friends to join you in other airframes and contribute to the mission in other ways. The whole concept of BlueFlag requires teamwork and mixed airframes. If one team only does CAP then its unlikely they'll be able to advance very far, although they will also likely stop the other team advancing or make it very difficult - ending in a stalemate. Remember - In the end, this is for fun and we try not to force anything, just nudge people towards certain play styles and hopefully towards teamwork :) Scripts: Complete Transport And Logistics Deployment - CTLD / CTLD Examples - Lots of example of how to use CTLD CSAR Script - Downed Pilot Rescue / Dedicated Server Script - Automatically launch DCS Multiplayer server at startup Range Scoring Script - Get scores and counts hits on targets for gunnery or bombs / SimpleSlotBlock - Multiplayer dynamic Slot Blocking Script Projects: DCS-SimpleRadio Standalone - DCS Radio Integration for All Aircraft - NO TeamSpeak Required! :) DCS-SimpleRadio Troubleshooting Post / DCS-SimpleRadio Free Support Channel on Discord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M0ltar Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 I guess I'm a glass half full kinda guy... there is only one way to find out though. In the meantime, it would be unfair for me to continue this discussion without first hand experience in the SU-27 online, thus, Red, here I come. Come fly with us! Always great to have someone new on the dark side. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 64th Aggressors TS DCSWorldEvents Twitch Splash One Gaming Splash One Gaming Discord The Merge SATAL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RED Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Hey Ciribob today I flew su25 on red side and there was awacs available. I think that's not intended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oceandar Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Hey Ciribob today I flew su25 on red side and there was awacs available. I think that's not intended. What? I was in Mirage an hour ago and didnt notice any AWACS on Red Sent from my A1601 using Tapatalk Mastering others is strength. Mastering yourself is true power. - Lao Tze Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oceandar Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 I guess I'm a glass half full kinda guy... there is only one way to find out though. In the meantime, it would be unfair for me to continue this discussion without first hand experience in the SU-27 online, thus, Red, here I come. Oh yeah, I'd gladly wait for your impression regarding the 27R against 7 or 530D :D Mastering others is strength. Mastering yourself is true power. - Lao Tze Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbortedMan Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 I've never hidden that I GCI'd for RVE while I flew. Anyone that asked I told them what was up. I never tried to hide it from anyone. Hell, you and I even talked about it because you said you had a problem with it and I said, even though I didnt agree with you, that I'd stop, which I did . Ive even talked to the BF guys about it. If you want to make this about personnel attacks I'm more than Happy to talk to you off line or TS about it again. and we can rehash this chat we had. It's not about hiding it. It's about the utilization of mechanics you feel you're entitled to for some reason with no consideration of balance. You're advocating that DataLink will give the Su27 the advantage it needs to bring it to a competitive level. I'm assuming you are of the mind that DataLink will fill in the performance gaps that exist between the Mirage, Su27, and F-15. During our conversation about your use of dual boxing a fighter and GCI slot you stated it hardly gave you any information that helped your effectiveness. That it was not enough of an advantage to matter. It was a justification that minimized this information availability. In essence, you were gaining an advanced version of the DataLink mechanic that shares information across every airframe on a much larger scope in a much larger format. The issue I have with your perspectives on balance is the conflicting sentiment I see here. 1. DataLink is a function that will sway the scales and provides a balance for the Su27 2. Dual accounts using GCI while in a fighter (effectively simulating DataLink) provides no advantage and does not affect the outcome of fights enough to be morally unsound. Which is it? This isn't a personal attack, I'm just trying to get clarification on why the topic of balance is being brought up specifically from the position you've taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RED Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 What? I was in Mirage an hour ago and didnt notice any AWACS on Red Sent from my A1601 using Tapatalk Mirage -> no simplified radio You also don't hear some sad ATC talking to himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cisco Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Very nice you added DL to SU-27. Its very nice. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M0ltar Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 (edited) Mirage -> no simplified radio You also don't hear some sad ATC talking to himself. Isn't the sad ATC default on all missions? He talks to me when I land or take off. EDIT: Nevermind, looks like DL is on for testing. Edited June 14, 2017 by M0ltar [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 64th Aggressors TS DCSWorldEvents Twitch Splash One Gaming Splash One Gaming Discord The Merge SATAL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M0ltar Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Does blue have the AI AWACS right now? [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 64th Aggressors TS DCSWorldEvents Twitch Splash One Gaming Splash One Gaming Discord The Merge SATAL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M0ltar Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 New issue. F10 view in any slot can see everything on the map, blue, red, it doesn't matter what slot. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 64th Aggressors TS DCSWorldEvents Twitch Splash One Gaming Splash One Gaming Discord The Merge SATAL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mia389 Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Isn't the sad ATC default on all missions? He talks to me when I land or take off. EDIT: Nevermind, looks like DL is on for testing. Awesome! Maybe more will fly the su27. At least it gives the su27 a bit more something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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