Bullseye question

Regarding Wags last update, he indicated that the AA waypoint needs to be a waypoint in your flight plan sequence. This does not make any sense to me. Normally bullseyes are theatre wide points shared by all flights.

How does awacs know what waypoint a flight has selected as their bullseye? How do package flights coordinate bullseye if everyone can set their own?

Why does the waypoint have to be part of the sequence?

Is this how its really is in the hornet or is this just EDs implementation?

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Think you got it backwards. Wherever the bullseye has been placed that day, the flight would just add that location as a waypoint. It’s not the flight’s call where bullseye is placed

Yep just re read it. The question i still have is why does the aa waypoint need to be part of the sequence?

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It's insightful to realize the WYPT A/A being strictly restricted to a point in the active sequence would be limiting practically. I share your skepticism that it is so limited when free selection is so obviously an improvement.

It's hard to say without seeing the .2 NATIP.

Obviously even if it was a limitation there would be practical ways around it like making it after the last point of your flight plan which doesn't mesh so well with how DCS does things in the ME.

What about this part:

"When the navigation WPT is the same as the A2A WPT, it's pictured as a diamond. If they are different, then it will be pictured as a circle."

Hrm, what exactly is a A2A waypoint? Is that an other term for bullseye?

Yes it appears an A2A way point is just a normal waypoint that you tell the system is where bullseye is.

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Ah,ok, got it now.

He just says, if a WP is the bullseye, then it is a diamond. If a WP is not the bullseye, it is a circle.

I got it backwards at first: if the bullseye is a WP, then its a diamond, if the bullseye is not a WP, then it is acircle. That got me confused quite a bit... ^^

I think the answere why the waypoint is placed on the bullseye location is that you can identify bandits due to BRA Information which you receive from the AWAC. The AWAC gives you the location of bandits from bullseye. Due to the fact that you set your waypoint on the bullsey Location you can find in your Radar with the TDC the exact place which was given by the AWAC.

If you do not have set your waypoint on the bullseye Location than you do not receive the distance and bearing Information in your Radar from bullseye to the hostile Group.

I hope I could help.

regards

blc

I am struggling with the placing the Bullseye over the WP also.

Typical scenario

Large scale mission

Flight A comprised of 4 hornet takes off from Mozdock, and heads east to attack airfield

Flight B takes off from Batumi and heads to Kobuleti to take that out

where would the bullseye be for that?

Thanks Specter

In a real theater of operations, there will usually be more than one reference point/aka multiple bullseyes

I am struggling with the placing the Bullseye over the WP also.

 

Typical scenario

 

Large scale mission

 

Flight A comprised of 4 hornet takes off from Mozdock, and heads east to attack airfield

 

Flight B takes off from Batumi and heads to Kobuleti to take that out

 

where would the bullseye be for that?

 

Thanks Specter

As smnwrx already said: The location of the bullseye will be defined on some higher command level. The individual flights will then have to tell their Hornets where the bullseye is located at and they do that by creating a waypoint on that position and define it as the A2A-WP.

Now what does indeed not really make sense is, that this A2A-Wp has to be part of the flight plan sequence as the flight might not fly over that location. Did Wags really say, that the A2A-Wp has to be part of the flightplan sequence? It would make much more sense if the A2A-WP can just be any WP, regardless of it being part of the flightplan sequence or not.

Honestly, I think it just has to part of any sequence, not necessarily the active one, and then set as the A/A waypoint. That would make more sense rather than requiring it to be part of the active sequence. I guess we'll need to get confirmation from the powers that be.

The bullseye waypoint SHOULD have nothing to do with the flight plan!

But it seems to be like that in Wags video. I hope there will be an option the enter waypoints manually in later updates. Or the bullseye from the mission editor should be default.

This should be given for other planes as well, otherwise it is not possible to fly in packages with other type of planes (M2K, A-10, F-14 etc.). All MUST have the same bullseye coordinates in the same scenario.

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I hope there will be an option the enter waypoints manually in later updates. Or the bullseye from the mission editor should be default.

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Manual waypoint entry has arrived already months ago.

But good idea to implement an automatism to set the ME Bullseye for all aircraft featuring an indication!

The implementation that ED are going for fits better with more modern multiple reference point and multiple possible flight plans. Whilst a single B/E is hard coded as an actual DCS game object, literally any predefined point can be used as a common reference and my understanding is that single reference points are not the current trend, for obvious distance reasons. Rather than changing the game to have multiple fixed possible reference points, it makes WAY more sense to have configurable reference points as player definable, and player changeable, coordinates.

The system you see is both more realististic and makes more sense.

The way the video came across to me is not how a Bullseye is established or implemented.

So a flight lead decides to set a bullseye "Waypoint" as part of his flight plan, then what? He has to pass that location onto every other flight, AWACS, Air Defense system, etc so they know where it is and be able to produce calls from it. Then every other flight lead does the same thing? I doubt it.

It is a single location established by the Command HQ for a period of time that is passed on to "All" assets to be used as the Bullseye. It's a perfect example of the saying "everyone playing from the same sheet of music", no confusion.

Why is it part of the flight plan? It should just be a Bullseye location (call it a markpoint if necessary) entered into the system that shows on the HSI / Radar.

Bullseye is set by the mission creator and has nothing to do with the f-18 flight plan. It's just part of the mission file. AWACS will reference this bullseye regardless of what waypoints are programmed into any aircraft.

Waypoints can be pre-loaded into aircraft by the mission editor (to save us the hassle and to simulate data being pre-loaded into aircrafT).

The mission creator either sets a waypoint in the f-18 to coincide with bulls, or you have to manually create it when you get in your aircraft. You'd just look at the map. Find the coordinates for bulls, and add a waypoint.

I hope that clarifies

If the F/A-18 designers wanted to embrace the concept of bullseye completely they would have called the feature bullseye exactly, spelling and all, like A-10 or F-16. Instead it's officially WYPT A/A which may suggest a slightly different way of thinking.

There is nothing inconsistent about the concept of BE as universal reference and the fact that the airplanes must be set individually correctly or incorrectly. Being able to set a reference different than the directed one by the physical machine doesn't imply any encouragement or permission to do so.

BE is not part of the flight plan. By the information given it must be part of the sequence. But the question is raised if if it must be part of the sequence or any sequence or not in a sequence in reality. Method of selecting and what are valid selections is contained in .2 document so we cannot know.

Personally I think it is likely that real WYPT A/A is selectable from a much wider array of points than DCS info suggests but this is speculation based on what I think is obvious design.

The way the video came across to me is not how a Bullseye is established or implemented.

 

So a flight lead decides to set a bullseye "Waypoint" as part of his flight plan, then what? He has to pass that location onto every other flight, AWACS, Air Defense system, etc so they know where it is and be able to produce calls from it. Then every other flight lead does the same thing? I doubt it.

 

It is a single location established by the Command HQ for a period of time that is passed on to "All" assets to be used as the Bullseye. It's a perfect example of the saying "everyone playing from the same sheet of music", no confusion.

 

Why is it part of the flight plan? It should just be a Bullseye location (call it a markpoint if necessary) entered into the system that shows on the HSI / Radar.

All flights will be pre-briefed on the location of all relevant reference points inside the theater. The reference points do not need to be part of your flight plan in the F-18, it simply needs to be a waypoint.

If the F/A-18 designers wanted to embrace the concept of bullseye completely they would have called the feature bullseye exactly, spelling and all, like A-10 or F-16. Instead it's officially WYPT A/A which may suggest a slightly different way of thinking.

Reference points/AA waypoints will be given different names, and it's not always called bullseye. During the shoot down of a pair of mig-21s by F-18s during desert shield, the reference point they are using is called Manny. Video for reference.