Georgian Oil War Campaign Mission 1 - ED Forums
 


Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-28-2020, 06:04 AM   #1
Taz1004
Member
 
Join Date: May 2020
Posts: 451
Default Georgian Oil War Campaign Mission 1

Can anyone tell me how I can get my wingman to engage? I tried all datalink commands, engage my target, engage ground targets... He says "Roger" and then just flies around keep saying "Running in" I accelerated time and he just bounces around.

One time, he flew high and hovered, so I thought "okay there he goes". But then he moves forward a little and says "Running in" And then repeats until he gets too close and then goes jumping around again. It looked like he was trying to target and can't.

I don't have enough weapons to finish this mission on my own.

I also tried editing the mission to make him Excellent skill (was set to Random). I noticed waypoint command only has CAS. Other missions I see has Search and engage task. Does this have anything to do with the wingman not engaging?

I'm just trying to figure out what makes a wingman not respond. He certainly responds in Instant Action missions. So I'm guessing the problem is something in the mission?
Taz1004 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-28-2020, 05:28 PM   #2
Taz1004
Member
 
Join Date: May 2020
Posts: 451
Default

Fixed it by editing AI. Seems like lua editing is required skill in playing DCS.

Basically the AI couldn't see the target I assigned him because of the fog. Wasn't even that thick. And was trying to get closer and closer and whenever he got close to terrain, he kept bouncing.

I increased AI detection range and removed the fog threshold. And he started firing away. AI are stupid enough that they don't need these handicap.
Taz1004 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2020, 01:45 AM   #3
MadDog-IC
Beta Tester
 
MadDog-IC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,103
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Taz1004 View Post
Fixed it by editing AI. Seems like lua editing is required skill in playing DCS.

Basically the AI couldn't see the target I assigned him because of the fog. Wasn't even that thick. And was trying to get closer and closer and whenever he got close to terrain, he kept bouncing.

I increased AI detection range and removed the fog threshold. And he started firing away. AI are stupid enough that they don't need these handicap.
Good to know, I have had that type of issue before, with the FOG marked off it was still affecting AI behaviour as if FOG was on, toggled the command off and on a couple of times and it came right with both FOG on or off.

AI is also very retarded when faced with AAA guns in hilly terain, it spends all its time porpoising around and never shooting at anything .

I am most likely going to be doing some extra work on the KA-50 GOW campaign in the near future, so will be looking more in depth at issues and reporting such issues to ED when able to.

Ps. Having lua editing skills is a must.

Regards, Ian.
__________________
Asus p877v-pro, Intel I7 3770k 4.2ghz, 32gb Ripjaw X ram, Nvidia RTX-2070 Super, Samsung 32" TV, Saitek x52 pro Joystick and Combat rudder pedals, TrackIR 5, Win8.1 x64 with SSD and SSHD protected by (Avast AV).

DCS Tech Support.
MadDog-IC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2020, 02:02 AM   #4
MadDog-IC
Beta Tester
 
MadDog-IC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,103
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Taz1004 View Post
Can anyone tell me how I can get my wingman to engage?

I also tried editing the mission to make him Excellent skill (was set to Random).

I noticed waypoint command only has CAS.

Other missions I see has Search and engage task. Does this have anything to do with the wingman not engaging?

I'm just trying to figure out what makes a wingman not respond. He certainly responds in Instant Action missions. So I'm guessing the problem is something in the mission?
CAS command is standard command to search for any enemy on the whole map and engage the closest priority target which might be 250km away, it will do this without regard to flying any set waypoints, once the enemy targets are destroyed it will return to the waypoint that had the CAS command and then fly the waypoints. This behaviour is no good for scripted missions where you want the AI to fly the waypoints and only engage enemies in a set zone or within an offset of several km from your flight plan, hence the "Search in Zone" and other advanced command, this way the AI will execute the "Search" when it hits the waypoint, kill the enemy and return to the flight plans next waypoint and so on.

Your already have figured out why it didn't work, nothing to do with the advanced waypoints commads, if you deleted the CAS statement and any "Search and Engage in zone" or those type of command then yes the AI may never engage any enemy and will just fly the waypoints to landing, but obviously when you physically command him with DATALINK commands, that is a priority command to be done instantly, regardless of any AI programming in the ME.

Nearly all of the missions I have every edited have the "Players" flight programmed to complete the whole mission correctly as a human would when I change the "Players" flight to AI, (Turn on Immortal) and then use Combined Arms module (Battle Commander) to do radio trigger work in missions, this means I don't have to fly the thing over and over to test it, I just let the AI do it and I can monitor all the facits are working as expected, with the exception of in cockpit testing of "DATELINKING",Etc.

Having said that, this self test system hasn't been applied to this "Ka-50 GOW" Campaign as of yet, it is a big task to take on editing approx 90-100 or so missions and putting in that AI commands for "Player" flight and then testing that the mission works on a whole, with correct scoring, campaign progression, broken triggers, incorrect briefings, corrupt or missing briefing pictures, corrupted waypoint commands, incorrect aircraft skins and a multitude of other parameters. Work would be 20-30 days at 8 hours a day.

Regards, Ian.
__________________
Asus p877v-pro, Intel I7 3770k 4.2ghz, 32gb Ripjaw X ram, Nvidia RTX-2070 Super, Samsung 32" TV, Saitek x52 pro Joystick and Combat rudder pedals, TrackIR 5, Win8.1 x64 with SSD and SSHD protected by (Avast AV).

DCS Tech Support.

Last edited by MadDog-IC; 07-30-2020 at 02:24 AM.
MadDog-IC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2020, 02:38 AM   #5
Taz1004
Member
 
Join Date: May 2020
Posts: 451
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MadDog-IC View Post
CAS command is standard command to search for any enemy on the whole map and engage the closest priority target which might be 250km away, it will do this without regard to flying any set waypoints, once the enemy targets are destroyed it will return to the waypoint that had the CAS command and then fly the waypoints. This behaviour is no good for scripted missions where you want the AI to fly the waypoints and only engage enemies in a set zone or within an offset of several km from your flight plan, hence the "Search in Zone" and other advanced command, this way the AI will execute the "Search" when it hits the waypoint, kill the enemy and return to the flight plans next waypoint and so on.

Your already have figured out why it didn't work, nothing to do with the advanced waypoints commads, if you deleted the CAS statement and any "Search and Engage in zone" or those type of command then yes the AI may never engage any enemy and will just fly the waypoints to landing, but obviously when you physically command him with DATALINK commands, that is a priority command to be done instantly, regardless of any AI programming in the ME.

Nearly all of the missions I have every edited have the "Players" flight programmed to complete the whole mission correctly as a human would when I change the "Players" flight to AI, (Turn on Immortal) and then use Combined Arms module (Battle Commander) to do radio trigger work in missions, this means I don't have to fly the thing over and over to test it, I just let the AI do it and I can monitor all the facits are working as expected, with the exception of in cockpit testing of "DATELINKING",Etc.

Having said that, this self test system hasn't been applied to this "Ka-50 GOW" Campaign as of yet, it is a big task to take on editing approx 90-100 or so missions and putting in that AI commands for "Player" flight and then testing that the mission works on a whole, with correct scoring, campaign progression, broken triggers, incorrect briefings, corrupt or missing briefing pictures, corrupted waypoint commands, incorrect aircraft skins and a multitude of other parameters.

Regards, Ian.
Thanks, that's good info. I'm beginning to learn ME in order to play DCS as well. When you do your GOW for Ka-50, please set wingman AI to Excellent by default. I see that he's set to Good or High on Mission 1 and 2 so far. They're already stupid enough as Excellent.

As for the fog issue, that's not the only issue it seems. Atmosphere, darkness, a lot of handicap for wingman it seems. I removed most of those from AI lua and he wingman seem pretty reliable. Problem is any AI editing I do seems to apply to enemy AI as well. Which is fair I guess. Playing by same rule.

LOS is another issue I haven't figured out how to solve. If they don't have LOS, they're not very efficient at repositioning. I believe this is more of an issue with Ka-50 due to low altitude attack nature. I was looking for ways to tell him to just get more altitude when there's no LOS but doesn't seem to be possible. For now, I make sure I take him with me to where there's clear LOS and then give him the order.
Taz1004 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2020, 04:00 AM   #6
MadDog-IC
Beta Tester
 
MadDog-IC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,103
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Taz1004 View Post
Thanks, that's good info. I'm beginning to learn ME in order to play DCS as well.

When you do your GOW for Ka-50, please set wingman AI to Excellent by default. I see that he's set to Good or High on Mission 1 and 2 so far. They're already stupid enough as Excellent.ff
All ways do set any Friendly wingman to Excellent, only enemy might be left at random.

Quote:
As for the fog issue, that's not the only issue it seems. Atmosphere, darkness, a lot of handicap for wingman it seems.
Atmosphere is definetly an issue with newer lighting systems, this is a real problem with AI aircraft detecting enemy and also missile lock and launch ranges.

Quote:
LOS is another issue I haven't figured out how to solve. If they don't have LOS, they're not very efficient at repositioning. I believe this is more of an issue with Ka-50 due to low altitude attack nature. I was looking for ways to tell him to just get more altitude when there's no LOS but doesn't seem to be possible. For now, I make sure I take him with me to where there's clear LOS and then give him the order.
Yeh probably the only way to get it done, hate having to micro manage wingmen, you can send them to attack points made on the ABRIS and Datalinked to the wingmen if I remember correctly, but you will not know for sure if they have LOS from their either.

Regards, Ian.
__________________
Asus p877v-pro, Intel I7 3770k 4.2ghz, 32gb Ripjaw X ram, Nvidia RTX-2070 Super, Samsung 32" TV, Saitek x52 pro Joystick and Combat rudder pedals, TrackIR 5, Win8.1 x64 with SSD and SSHD protected by (Avast AV).

DCS Tech Support.
MadDog-IC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-31-2020, 09:08 PM   #7
Taz1004
Member
 
Join Date: May 2020
Posts: 451
Default

So this campaign is very frustrating as is. I'm on my 6th mission (ATO A.08.2) and now I can't target with Shkval. Issue seems to be related to cloud density. It's set to 9 and I can't lock up a tank until 3.8km range. At which point they shoot at me. I know I can fire without locking it up but is this realistic?

If I lower density to 6, I can lock it up from 8.8km.

Frankly between 6 and 9, visual difference isn't that much.
Taz1004 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 08-01-2020, 04:17 AM   #8
MadDog-IC
Beta Tester
 
MadDog-IC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,103
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Taz1004 View Post
So this campaign is very frustrating as is.

I'm on my 6th mission (ATO A.08.2) and now I can't target with Shkval. Issue seems to be related to cloud density. It's set to 9 and I can't lock up a tank until 3.8km range. At which point they shoot at me. I know I can fire without locking it up but is this realistic?

If I lower density to 6, I can lock it up from 8.8km.

Frankly between 6 and 9, visual difference isn't that much.
Always good to get feedback from someone playing through the actual campaign, I am sure it was never an easy task to win any of them, given wind and environment settings.

I will take note of the these recommendations and may implement them some time in the future.

The other campaign Medvedev has high winds that would blow the vhikr missiles off the laser guidance systems cone of effect, not even the AI could shoot a tank with them.

Regards, Ian.
__________________
Asus p877v-pro, Intel I7 3770k 4.2ghz, 32gb Ripjaw X ram, Nvidia RTX-2070 Super, Samsung 32" TV, Saitek x52 pro Joystick and Combat rudder pedals, TrackIR 5, Win8.1 x64 with SSD and SSHD protected by (Avast AV).

DCS Tech Support.
MadDog-IC is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

All times are GMT. The time now is 01:04 PM. vBulletin Skin by ForumMonkeys. Powered by vBulletin®.
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.