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RWR Question


CajunJosh

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Two aircraft are flying at each other with radars active. The target air crafts RWR system detects the aggressors radar sweeping and gives an indicator to the pilot. The agreessor locks the target aircraft and the target's rwr system detects that the agreessor is no longer sweeping but locked constantly and gives the appropriate warning.

 

Now the agreessor fires a radar guided missile. The rwr somehow detects this and gives the launch warning. My question is what changed on the agressors radar scan from a lock to a launch and how does the rwr system know a launch occurred? Wouldn't the radar behavior of the agreessor be the same after a launch? Stay locked on target? Curious if someone in the know can explain this.

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From what I understand, nothing should change unless and until the missile itself (if able) goes active because that would add a different radar signature to the mix. However, getting a lock notification should be the key that makes you do something to avoid getting shot.

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Negative. When a missile is launched, radar energy is further increased to its maximum energy output as it must now relay target telemetry. Essentially, the RWR is interpreting the signal strength changed as a possible missile launch.

With a semi active radar guided missile, you will never see the actual missile position appear on the RWR. That is the advantage that still exists with that type of weapon.

Now, with an active radar guided missile such as the AMRAAM, you will receive missile location once the missiles onboard radar has gone active (pitbull). However, until that point you will still only get the "possible missile launch tone"

So, for DCS purposes.. yes the tone change is a missile launch. However, in real world the alert is merely identifying the signal strength change which is MOST LIKELY a missile launch.

Hope, that clears it up a bit.

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Is the RWR in DCS sophisticated enough to make that fine distinction between search power / lock power / shot power?

 

yep

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That's why most shoot in TWS. This will not alert the RWR to the launch until the missile goes pitbull.

 

This article about the F-15 on Mud spike is a great read and shows just how deep (At the moment) DCS models this.

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Actually when the semi active missile is fired the radar emits a Continuous wave (cw ) signal that guides the missile. It's the CW signal that gives you the missile warning. There is no increase in energy.

 

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There is also the addition of a datalink signal from the shooter to the missile, which can be detected by the aircraft's RWR system giving further confirmation on the launch.

 

So if STT lock, max operating power + shooter-missile-datalink signal, then missile launch.

 

In TWS the launch cannot be detected because even though there is a datalink signal, you can't be sure if it is directed at you or not.

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I think that's why we get launch tone from friendly aircrafts that are clearly shooting to aggressors .
In reality this is why fighters fly combat spread or Battle formation, it stops interference from each other's radars and ensures that if a one bandit spikes you, you know who is clean.

 

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In reality this is why fighters fly combat spread or Battle formation, it stops interference from each other's radars and ensures that if a one bandit spikes you, you know who is clean.

 

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There are a buch of other factors but yes, that is one additional reason to flying Battle formation / Tactical formation / Combat spread (whichever term is used in any given country)

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I think that's why we get launch tone from friendly aircrafts that are clearly shooting to aggressors .
Maybe I should have expanded a little which may help. The beam width of the radar is a couple of degrees so if you flew through it when your wingman had his CW on ( our backseaters could just turn it on and did so every time we did weapons checks as a systems check ) you would get a missile warning. Generally you would not see the lock from him, as if you were in front of him, it would only be briefly not long enough for the rwr to consider it a spike.

 

In DCS for some reason an AI locks seems to blast way wider than 2 degrees but it appears to be somewhat better in multiplayer and the CW missile warning appears to everyone in a similar vein. It would be good if it could be tightened up and maybe it will with the new radar code.

In reality a 2v1 semi active is easy as the 1 can only lock one guy.

 

Unfortunately until this is fixed these RWR lock comments will still come up as it is frustrating and was one of my biggest annoyances at the start of my messing with DCS, but let's face it while we love accuracy the sim is a blast and maybe it is a correlation problem that would take too much processor time to fix. While the rwr lock indications may be annoying the Radars themselves are amazingly good lol.

 

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and I guess some is still highly classified....

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