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Old 08-21-2019, 10:20 PM   #731
pepin1234
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harlikwin View Post
PS Overstratos,

You guys should do a mig29 after the 23... Just sayin...
With all the Physics and instruments, 3D models they are closer to Mig-27.
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Old 08-21-2019, 10:32 PM   #732
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Originally Posted by OverStratos View Post
You are just talking here about the beam properties of the radar without taking into account that the antenna actually moves so it sweeps the space in front of it. The N003 search sweep cover +30°/-35° in elevation and 60° in azimuth. This can change in dependence of the radar mode.


As this radar belongs to the firsts to use Doppler signals for look-down, anything under 1km altitude is detected below the distance of 30km.
The radar sweep position on lock target will be represented somehow in Hud? e.g like our Su-27 do?
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Old 08-21-2019, 10:32 PM   #733
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27 does have a six barreled 30mm....
the radar for the 23 will be interesting to learn to use, it seems it suffers in medium PRF band has trouble with receding targets?
Pepin there is no radar scope if you look at cockpit photos, all done on HUD
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Old 08-21-2019, 10:43 PM   #734
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepin1234 View Post
With all the Physics and instruments, 3D models they are closer to Mig-27.
Thats true. And redfor could use a good striker. The mig27 wasn't exported much, so unless they have an "in" in Russia or maybe India or Sri Lanka I'd say they are hosed on that front. And you are re-doing the avionics anyway which is the difficult documentation to get.

Mig29 OTOH, well even the Cubans have some, which is where they got the info on the mig23 they are doing as I heard it... Just sayin.
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Last edited by Harlikwin; 08-21-2019 at 10:49 PM.
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Old 08-21-2019, 10:46 PM   #735
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Originally Posted by AeriaGloria View Post
Pepin there is no radar scope if you look at cockpit photos, all done on HUD
Look the picture, circle is the target, but also there is a small mark. Maybe radar position?. I am talking about the radar angle position on Hud representation. Also for similar, look our Su-27 in lock mode.

https://images.app.goo.gl/uQt6eDavABCDnQrP9
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Old 08-21-2019, 11:40 PM   #736
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You should really go to our Discord, these discussions are taking place there all the time.
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Old 08-22-2019, 06:07 AM   #737
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OverStratos View Post
You are just talking here about the beam properties of the radar without taking into account that the antenna actually moves so it sweeps the space in front of it. The N003 search sweep cover +30°/-35° in elevation and 60° in azimuth. This can change in dependence of the radar mode.


As this radar belongs to the firsts to use Doppler signals for look-down, anything under 1km altitude is detected below the distance of 30km.
Mig-23 radar has pulse and moving target indicator (MTI) pulse modes, but no pulse doppler modes.


https://www.seeninside.net/sapfir23_radar.html


The first Russian fighter with Pulse Doppler was the MiG-31 (1981).

The below material indicates that the fighter radars up through the MiG-25 used pulse radars (not pulse Doppler) as indicated by the continued interest in reducing "ground clutter" and increasing clutter suppression.

https://toad-design.com/migalley/ind...-smerch-radar/



The video below explains the difference between Doppler and MTI techniques.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQGj1G9yD_Y

Generally speaking, MTI simply separates moving returns from non-moving returns and has no means of measuring specific doppler or target velocities. It also has far worse SNR (poor detection range), and usually many doppler blind zones (recurring at the rate of the PRF).
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Old 08-22-2019, 11:25 AM   #738
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harlikwin View Post
Thats true. And redfor could use a good striker. The mig27 wasn't exported much, so unless they have an "in" in Russia or maybe India or Sri Lanka I'd say they are hosed on that front. And you are re-doing the avionics anyway which is the difficult documentation to get.
My bad. Mig-23BN. It is a really interesting ground attack version. The laser targeting sensor make bombing more accurate. Also have an extra pylon and we still can do some air combat with R-3S and R-13 missiles. I hope they put this version in roadmap for future. Will be very convenient have afterburner in CAS mission.

http://www.airwar.ru/enc/fighter/mig23bn.html
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Old 08-22-2019, 08:05 PM   #739
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I would still take the Mig-27 for its improved visibility and pure strike aircraft purpose. It would be the one against F-111 and Viggen etc. Until Su-24 comes out.

Of course if it would be possible, I would take all three. Mig-23MLA, Mig-23BN and Mig-27K.
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Old 08-22-2019, 08:54 PM   #740
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beamscanner View Post
Mig-23 radar has pulse and moving target indicator (MTI) pulse modes, but no pulse doppler modes.


https://www.seeninside.net/sapfir23_radar.html


The first Russian fighter with Pulse Doppler was the MiG-31 (1981).

The below material indicates that the fighter radars up through the MiG-25 used pulse radars (not pulse Doppler) as indicated by the continued interest in reducing "ground clutter" and increasing clutter suppression.

https://toad-design.com/migalley/ind...-smerch-radar/



The video below explains the difference between Doppler and MTI techniques.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQGj1G9yD_Y

Generally speaking, MTI simply separates moving returns from non-moving returns and has no means of measuring specific doppler or target velocities. It also has far worse SNR (poor detection range), and usually many doppler blind zones (recurring at the rate of the PRF).

Overstratos have right, S-23 is doppler pulse radar, first of this class in Soviet Union. With MiG-25 situation is bit more complicated: first fighter variant MiG-25P had pulse radar RP-25A2 or A4 "Smierch", later variants MiG-25PD/PDS had scaled up variant of Flogger's N-003 called N-005 "Saphir"-25 (RP-25M or later MN).


Quote:
Originally Posted by pepin1234 View Post
My bad. Mig-23BN. It is a really interesting ground attack version. The laser targeting sensor make bombing more accurate. Also have an extra pylon and we still can do some air combat with R-3S and R-13 missiles. I hope they put this version in roadmap for future. Will be very convenient have afterburner in CAS mission.

http://www.airwar.ru/enc/fighter/mig23bn.html

Only AA weapon for BN is canon, no AAM's on this variant.
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