Nealius Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 I was playing around with SnakeEyes today and could never get a good CCIP solution, or even AUTO solution, despite being able to hit things very accurately with slicks in CCIP. First problem is the CCIP pipper refuses to appear in the HUD at all unless I am in excess of 550kts and less than 1,000 or so AGL. Second problem, I always get an big X in the HUD, even at 5° or 10° dive angles. Even at 2,000 AGL I'll get a big X. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong. I don't recall ever having this much trouble with retarded bombs in the A-10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revelation Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 You're too high at this stage of development for the Snakeyes. Either go lower or wait until ED works on the release logic for retarded bombs. Win 10 Pro 64Bit | 49" UWHD AOC 5120x1440p | AMD 5900x | 64Gb DDR4 | RX 6900XT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delevero Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 Tip for hitting something with ccip and example ordinary mk82 ( they are actual not that bad and actual hit what you aim for most of the time.. ) make a steep diver such as 45 degree and you should see the ccip cross even from a high altitude. The hornet calculate wind automatic by the way so where you aim is pretty much where you will hit. Keep in mind that dumb bombs are not precission ammonition but you will hit the area. regarding snakeyes that have drag, then you need a little bit of angle for best result. Try to experiment with the speed/angle/height. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirkey_badgers Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 For CCIP dives think it's more like a 20-30 pitch dive to make sure the little cross is at the bottom of the bombing line. The cross you see on your hud is because, if you look at your first attached screenshot, just above the 10 degrees line, there are 2 brackets either side of your predicted flight marker. If you dip below that bracket, the computer is telling you it maybe unsafe to release bombs at that point, as the blast or shrapnel may strike the hornet. I think for a retarded bomb approach though, contradictory to what I said above, a video I saw said best approach was at like 500knts and 500feet. Bombs should be dropped at above 450knts Try having a look at videos on youtube from the Grim Reapers or RedKite channels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealius Posted August 13, 2018 Author Share Posted August 13, 2018 You're too high at this stage of development for the Snakeyes. Either go lower or wait until ED works on the release logic for retarded bombs. I tried releasing at around 500-600 AGL and they wouldn't even arm. Duds on impact. Even at that height, 450kts, the pipper was barely even in the HUD. I find that strange since I used to nail targets in the A-10 with 5-degree CCIP runs at less than 300kts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealius Posted August 13, 2018 Author Share Posted August 13, 2018 (edited) How do you mark the target for CCRP without exposing yourself? I played around a bit with AUTO mode but I had to go high to get a good fix on the target, then by the time I got the cue actually fixed on the target I was too close (and high) and had to turn around and start my run all over again. Edited August 13, 2018 by Nealius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealius Posted August 13, 2018 Author Share Posted August 13, 2018 (edited) Was this always done with sensors even in the 90s? Or was it possible to plug in coordinates and turn that into a drop point? I've seen some old 90s footage of Hornets doing runs with 3xM82AIR in a triangular pattern, but I didn't notice any sensor pods on them. (for reference) UcykP7apWpo 28:47 -- pair dropped at shallow dive angle, high 28:56 -- single dropped, no sensor pods, only centerline tank 33:38 -- triple dropped, no sensor pods, only centerline tank Edited August 13, 2018 by Nealius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joca133 Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 I hope this will all change soon, as it is I feel like A/G in the early access hornet is just too basic to be effective. At least for me (poor aim?). Soon we will get guided bombs and better cluster, also pods to help target from afar. I am far from being an expert on anything, but I do share the frustration on getting a proper release and accuracy. Even with guns I couldn’t hit some targets, the piper wasn’t giving me a correct solution. Again, probably my inexperience, but it feels too early and with many limitations. Might as well try some rockets for now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealius Posted August 13, 2018 Author Share Posted August 13, 2018 Revelation mentioned something about the release logic on the retarded bombs. Maybe that's part of the issue? With low-drag bombs I have zero problems hitting point targets in CCIP. Same with guns: I'm able to hit whatever I aim at with >90% accuracy. It's only the high-drag bombs giving me problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirkey_badgers Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 How do you mark the target for CCRP without exposing yourself? I played around a bit with AUTO mode but I had to go high to get a good fix on the target, then by the time I got the cue actually fixed on the target I was too close (and high) and had to turn around and start my run all over again. Same methodology as the M2000 I think for CCRP, say start at 10,000 feet, zoom in and mark your target, then drop low and get the desired speed and altitude, fly to the Release point path, flare and roll out. There's another mode possible now too with last update, the LOFT method. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zyll Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 Retarted mk82s on the Hog were quite effective for me when flying under 400 feet using a CCRP solution. Could usually drop on top of a single vehicle. Of course, I too am looking forward to a targeting pod on the Bug. Trying to slew the TDC on the HUD is not a happy experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cik Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 >using retarded bombs in modes that are not CCRP do you even vietnam kid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dangerman Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 How do you mark the target for CCRP without exposing yourself? I played around a bit with AUTO mode but I had to go high to get a good fix on the target, then by the time I got the cue actually fixed on the target I was too close (and high) and had to turn around and start my run all over again. Retarded bombs are for low level delivery in laydown or shallow dive Ccip needs eyeball on target. Doesn’t matter if your nav kit is 20 miles out. If you are a kit baby and need a diamond at the target, your kit better be in good order or you can pop up in a hostile environment just to get a mark on it with a sensor...... you need eyeball acquisition. ( see my previous posts elsewhere for more detail) Pipper through target with a (PREFERABLY)forward firing height sensor to resolve ballistic computations is CCIP. High angle dives and high altitude drops with retarded bombs is asking to miss. The bomb is retarded so you can xxxx-off in fine pitch with the bomb now having less forward motion relative to you....to avoid fragging yourself at low level. The retarded bomb has the same gravity drop as slick bomb but less relative forward motion as a slick. You would never drop a retarded bomb from high angle / high altitude delivery You would never drop a slick at low level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadoga Posted August 13, 2018 Share Posted August 13, 2018 (edited) Back in the days of Fulda Gap scenarios, the late Cold War, before sensor pods and guided ammo became the standard, air-to-ground radar for target acquisition and low&fast attack runs below radar SAM coverage was the shit. Days of Tornado, Fencer & Viggen. Falcon 4 (AF/BMS) is sweet for this, DCS not yet. Too bad air-to-ground radar is No.Last on the Hornet feature list to be completed...! Hornet & Viper got a/g radar upgrades towards abovementioned doctrine. 1990 and the years to follow changed everything with Gulf War 1 & the end of Cold War - towards asymmetric air war. Today's A-10C wouldn't loiter/LGB over a battlefield with integrated air defense systems and without total air superiority. Edited August 13, 2018 by Shadoga Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldur Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 There's another mode possible now too with last update, the LOFT method. You must have travelled in time and came back to the past which is our very present. Haven't seen a LOFT mode yet... just toss-lofting in AUTO with some wild guesstimation of when to pull up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealius Posted August 14, 2018 Author Share Posted August 14, 2018 (edited) Retarded bombs are for low level delivery in laydown or shallow dive Ccip needs eyeball on target. Doesn’t matter if your nav kit is 20 miles out. If you are a kit baby and need a diamond at the target, your kit better be in good order or you can pop up in a hostile environment just to get a mark on it with a sensor...... you need eyeball acquisition. ( see my previous posts elsewhere for more detail) Pipper through target with a (PREFERABLY)forward firing height sensor to resolve ballistic computations is CCIP. High angle dives and high altitude drops with retarded bombs is asking to miss. The bomb is retarded so you can xxxx-off in fine pitch with the bomb now having less forward motion relative to you....to avoid fragging yourself at low level. The retarded bomb has the same gravity drop as slick bomb but less relative forward motion as a slick. You would never drop a retarded bomb from high angle / high altitude delivery You would never drop a slick at low level. That doesn't address the problem in the opening post at all....I'm low. I'm at a shallow dive angle. I'm fast. I have eyeball on the target. CCIP pipper is well below the nose and never appears unless I'm even lower and near 600kts. In comparison, I get valid cuing at much slower speeds in the Harrier and Warthog by doing the same 5° CCIP runs. I also don't understand why I'm getting a big flashing X the whole time, even when I'm at 1,600AGL straight and level. Edited August 14, 2018 by Nealius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dangerman Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 My points were directed at other posts comments on employment and ballistics of retarded bombs However, I agree there is an issue with the CCIP for retarded bombs. I’ve messed about with various fusing options in an attempt to get a realistic CCIP picture delivery and managed it once. My small brain cannot recall which combination got it to work and I’ve never replicated it. No problems using mirage and Harrier in laydown/shallow dive. Point to note....regardless if there is a glitch or not....Looking at your picture I would say you are still too high for a reasonable laydown delivery for a retarded bomb in a high threat environment..... ingress should be be as low as you dare with every AAA looking at you with a small climb if super low to achieve (classified) fusing height to allow the wee propeller to make enough turns so it all goes bang at the bottom... for reference, check out the A4 attacks on Royal Navy in Falklands war and how the British newspapers gave the game away to the Argentinians. At the height AGL in your picture, you would not have a breakaway cross or self damage issue with a retarded bomb... but you probably would with a slick bomb.... weapons memory on manual numbers is fading me now If you have air superiority with no ground threats and have run out of LGB kits ....go 20 degree dive toss with slicks, you can’t miss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dangerman Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 Back in the days of Fulda Gap scenarios, the late Cold War, before sensor pods and guided ammo became the standard, air-to-ground radar for target acquisition and low&fast attack runs below radar SAM coverage was the shit. Days of Tornado, Fencer & Viggen. Falcon 4 (AF/BMS) is sweet for this, DCS not yet. Too bad air-to-ground radar is No.Last on the Hornet feature list to be completed...! Hornet & Viper got a/g radar upgrades towards abovementioned doctrine. 1990 and the years to follow changed everything with Gulf War 1 & the end of Cold War - towards asymmetric air war. Today's A-10C wouldn't loiter/LGB over a battlefield with integrated air defense systems and without total air superiority. ^^^^What he said^^^^^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirkey_badgers Posted August 14, 2018 Share Posted August 14, 2018 You must have travelled in time and came back to the past which is our very present. Haven't seen a LOFT mode yet... just toss-lofting in AUTO with some wild guesstimation of when to pull up. Is this what you describe or proper LOFT mode? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nealius Posted August 15, 2018 Author Share Posted August 15, 2018 I totally forgot the Hornet had an A-G radar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts