Viper first impressions

Ok, so despite all my efforts to resist, I broke down and bought the F-16 Module the other day. And just when I was starting to be somewhat proficient in the Hornet. Damn it!

Seriously, though.... 1st impression is really good. It's certainly not perfect, but I wasn't expecting it to be. I really wanted to just take it for a spin around the block and see how it looked. There are some things I really like about it and I am pretty confident that once all the systems are modeled and it becomes more mature, it will be outstanding.

Pros:

- Cockpit is nicely modeled and the ergonomic and UFC is more intuitive and easier to use IMHO than the Hornet.

- There are already more instant and training missions to jump right into than the Hornet to practice with.

- Love the bowless canopy

- There seems to be more HOTAS-able items with the F-16 stick than the F-18 stick. I have both TM sticks and switch back and forth depending on which module I'm flying. I might have to get the Thrustmaster Cougar throttle now to have the correct throttle HOTAS for the F-16.

Cons (maybe)

- Obviously lots of WIP items that are not functional. I'm trying to be patient ;-)

- The drag model seems a bit optimistic. Even with 2 bags, bombs and missiles - it didn't want to slow down very quickly. Not sure if that's normal. I would expect that for sure with a clean jet, but not one in that draggy a configuration.

- When pulling Gs at Med Altitude (15K) and high-ish AOA - I would expect there to be more rumble and burble from the wings than there is. It is distinctively there in the Hornet and you can see it shudder and shake when it gets slow but much less so in the Viper. Again, not sure if that's normal due to HAL actually flying the jet.

- Roll and pitch rates (mostly roll) are not as "snappy" as I remember or would expect. I've got my axis curves set to 0 and deadzone set to 2 just like Wags had in his excellent video. Its not slow, just not as fast as I would have expected. Although in fairness I think that was with two tanks, so I'll go try it clean and see if there is a difference. There should be.

None of the above is criticism in the slightest, just observations. Especially as most stuff is WIP. I can't wait for it to get to a mature state. I hope the parallel development with the Hornet means they feed off each other and both progress faster.

My dilemma now is which one to concentrate on. Do I fly the Viper now and learn it while its being developed or do I park the F-16 for now and continue with the Hornet since the systems and mission aspects are much more mature and then pick up the Viper again in a year or so? Hmmmm.......

Well done ED, well done. Now get this damn thing finished! :smilewink:

my first impressions

flying canteen

- There are already more instant and training missions to jump right into than the Hornet to practice with.

I honestly have no idea where that comes from.

Currently, the Viper has 2 TMs and 45 Instant Action/Missions, and the Hornet has 20 TMs and 101 IA/Missions! It has the most comprehensive set of practice missions of any module I have seen.

I honestly have no idea where that comes from.

 

Currently, the Viper has 2 TMs and 45 Instant Action/Missions, and the Hornet has 20 TMs and 101 IA/Missions! It has the most comprehensive set of practice missions of any module I have seen.

i had the same problem until i changed from stable to Openbeta, and bum all the hornet missions are there :)

A lot of the training missions are on maps other than the Caucuses. I had the same impression until I bought Nevada and the Persian Gulf.

A lot of the training missions are on maps other than the Caucuses. I had the same impression until I bought Nevada and the Persian Gulf.

The training missions are all on the Caucasus map.

Even if we take Caucasus only, the Viper has 2 TMs, and 18 IA/missions whereas the Hornet has 20 TMs and 44 IA/Missions.

I honestly have no idea where that comes from.

 

Currently, the Viper has 2 TMs and 45 Instant Action/Missions, and the Hornet has 20 TMs and 101 IA/Missions! It has the most comprehensive set of practice missions of any module I have seen.

Yep, you are correct. Sorry, I clicked on the wrong thing. :doh:

Flying the Hornet will make you a better overall pilot as you have a lot more work to do when taking off, landing and flying in general. That's not a criticism at all, it's just the nature of its digital flight control system. It's nowhere near as synthetic as the Viper. If you're really good at flying the Hornet, you can make the Viper your bitch ������

I have the Hornet, Tomcat, Mirage, Mig21, F-86, L39, A10C, AV8B and FC3. Since release, I only fly the Viper and I fly almost exclusively online. The others were placeholders until it came out. I've flown it on another sim for 20 years and I know it inside out, backwards and forwards. Therefore I don't run the risk of negative training. What I've done is fly it like an A model.except it has 120's and CBU97's. So which one should you fly? Whichever you enjoy more of course lol.

As to the drag model and overall PFM, sadly it's a work in progress and it is what it is. I also agree with you on roll rate. The Mirage roll rate makes the Viper seem to roll like a Cessna. I set my roll curve to -18.

A couple of addendums to the above obs....

The more I fly the Viper module, the better I like it.

-- The "feel" (shake, rumble, etc) during High G turns seems more realistic now the more I do it.

-- The AB response seems VERY slow. I watch the nozzle move from 0 to 40% and its slow to open. Not sure how a GE-129 motor is supposed to react. Maybe that's correct in how the DEEC programs it. I also would expect the nozzle to open quite a bit more in full AB.

-- As others have said, the MPDs are dark and VERY hard to read. They are practically unusable unless I VR zoom in on them.

-- I like the radar mech over the Hornet. The ability to bump the top/bottom of the scope to change range or bump the sides to change azimuth scan is what I expect. I'm shocked the Hornet doesn't have the same ability. I find the Hornet radar mech with HOTAS to be very clunky.

-- I find the SMS page far more intuitive and easier to use than the Hornet Stores page. Maybe its because the F-16 is still a WIP and there are a lot of features not yet implemented. But stuff like setting up bomb ripple and interval seems more intuitive on the Viper.

Overall, still loving the new module. Still LOTS to learn.

 

-- I'm not seeing ASE circles for the AIM-9s on the HUD. Is that still a WIP?

 

There are a few things not working correctly with the AIM-9s at the moment - similarly with the Hornet - so, yes, WIP.

Hi!

Here are my personal remarks:

- Roll behaviour is strange (looks like a sort of Control Wheel Steering A/P mode behind, somehow maintaining or stabilizing the bank angle/roll stop.)

- Landing gain (Pitch/Roll) not correct.

- As said be other users, FF is off.

- Seems that a an electric starter is used instead of a HYD accumulator (but I'll have to check it again, I am not about that.)

- Landing gear light sequence if wrong (for the moment). No alternate gear.

- Lack of rudder induced roll.

- Altimeter setting non functional ... etc ...

No need to talk about ICP/DED/MFDs ... they are WIP.

- I like the behaviour on ground (no clues if it is accurate, but is convincing).

- Gauges motion are nice.

- Sound system is great.

- Textures are beautiful.

Much too early to give have a real opinion. Lets give them the time to work on it. Many things are on an initial state. It is a beta.

Regards.

Afterburner response is off. I posted a description of the changes made to the F-16C Block 50 written by Lockheed Martin. It states that the Block 50 CJ should go from idle to full AB in 2 seconds. Not seeing that at all but hopefully we will as it's fleshed out.