Anyone tried going waaay vertical in the 'Cat?

https://ibb.co/f8vGxNp

Just tried this maneuver in the 1v1 instant action. Hit the merge fast with full burner then pull at max sustainable G until around 10-20 degrees past vertical then unload to maximize your altitude gain. Once airspeed bleeds down near corner speed pull the nose down onto the target and hit him from above.

Funny thing is the AI doesn't seem to know what to do with this maneuver, the Flanker turns flat to match your initial course and then appears to be waiting for you to shoot him on the downhill pass. Like fish in a barrel.

Biggest challenge on that maneuver is, to find the target again when going down...

Works like a charm against the instant action f16 and f5s.

Like most ACM tactics, so long as your opponent didnt expect / see it / have a counter move this works a charm against AI or humans.

One thing thats unique to the F-14 and was commented on many times by AF pilots doing DACT against them is that your energy state / gameplan is broadcast as soon as they see you visually which happens quite far away for such a big jet. Those damned swing wings that give us such high speed + low speed manuverability do give the game away.

What you're suggesting I think is called a Wingover so you blow through, pull hard and then at the top of the pull as the speed bleeds off you reverse direction by kicking either rudder, re-acquiring and then building up a lot of speed in the dive to get on their tail. So long as the other guy doesn't acquire you first and doesn't have a lot of high alpha nose-pointability you've got a great opportunity to cut into his horizontal circle and splash him.

Long story short - mostly any ACM tactic can work so long as you manage to move your jet into a place where your opponent doesn't expect to reacquire you during / after their own turn. Equally though its not a guaranteed victory.

For sure, there are no magic bullets in ACM.

Rather than a wing over with rudder I just roll as necessary to put the bogey in-plane then pull straight back again to bring the nose over the top of the loop, I don’t have faith in the engines staying lit with that much yaw.

Like most ACM tactics, so long as your opponent didnt expect / see it / have a counter move this works a charm against AI or humans.

 

One thing thats unique to the F-14 and was commented on many times by AF pilots doing DACT against them is that your energy state / gameplan is broadcast as soon as they see you visually which happens quite far away for such a big jet. Those damned swing wings that give us such high speed + low speed manuverability do give the game away.

 

What you're suggesting I think is called a Wingover so you blow through, pull hard and then at the top of the pull as the speed bleeds off you reverse direction by kicking either rudder, re-acquiring and then building up a lot of speed in the dive to get on their tail. So long as the other guy doesn't acquire you first and doesn't have a lot of high alpha nose-pointability you've got a great opportunity to cut into his horizontal circle and splash him.

 

Long story short - mostly any ACM tactic can work so long as you manage to move your jet into a place where your opponent doesn't expect to reacquire you during / after their own turn. Equally though its not a guaranteed victory.

One Cat Driver in a video I watched talked about the plane coming in slow, but with wings full sweep back into the merge... The bandit sees the sweep, things it is coming in supersonic and flies through. Once past, the cat would move full sweep wings forward and cut the low speed turn right on to the bandits 6 and fire. All the while, the bandit thinks he is going to out turn the cat. This was part of the added benefit to having a sweep manual override on the throttle.

Been wanting to try that maneuver in one of the MP servers to see who I could fool. :pilotfly::pilotfly:

But the cat pilot discussed the very thing you just mentioned.

 

 

One thing thats unique to the F-14 and was commented on many times by AF pilots doing DACT against them is that your energy state / gameplan is broadcast as soon as they see you visually which happens quite far away for such a big jet. Those damned swing wings that give us such high speed + low speed manuverability do give the game away.

 

 

If you're convinced that your opponent is using your sweep against you, you can always go manual to really ruin their day.

But I'm not convinced that it's such a big disadvantage to give away your speed with sweep. It can be had from radar or eyeball anyway.

Sorry if I wasn't clear my point was less - these wings spoil my game and more throwing out yet another one of the mental move / counter moves that are happening in ACM in addition to all the move / counter moves that are happening with the stick :D

One thing I wonder is, what regimes does the Flanker out perform the Tomcat in? I haven't seen the curves, but I had the impression that its strength was in low speed/high AoA control, but it sort of seems like that's firmly in the Tomcat's home turf, plus the 'cat seems to have solid high speed agility too if it wants to play the energy fighter role.

Or am I reading to much into the AI Flanker performance?

Or am I reading to much into the AI Flanker performance?

You should not compare to AI at all as it uses standard flight model - very simplified. Flanker should be comparable to F-14 dogfight wise imho but definitely has more nose authority - ever heard of the cobra?

I'm not sure there isn't some mixing of terms going on which might be adding confusion.

The Flanker absolutely has more high alpha stability and nose authority than the F-14, if you try getting into a high alpha state and then dare put in some left or right stick movement you'll quickly drop a wing and end up in a spin in the 14.

What the F-14 does have is a very slow speed + very small diameter turn circle, although its turn rate is not really much to write home about.

One thing that still bites me in ACM on occasion is due to its very stable flight the F-14 can literally be dropping at 1000fpm but still have the nose pointed right where you want it so long as the AOA isn't off the scale and you don't try and combine it with roll inputs - with no HUD altimeter / rate gauge you can lose a good bit of height imperceptibly staring out the window.

One Cat Driver in a video I watched talked about the plane coming in slow, but with wings full sweep back into the merge... The bandit sees the sweep, things it is coming in supersonic and flies through. Once past, the cat would move full sweep wings forward and cut the low speed turn right on to the bandits 6 and fire. All the while, the bandit thinks he is going to out turn the cat. This was part of the added benefit to having a sweep manual override on the throttle.

 

Been wanting to try that maneuver in one of the MP servers to see who I could fool. :pilotfly::pilotfly:

 

 

But the cat pilot discussed the very thing you just mentioned.

ive had exactly that idea but havnt had a dogfight to test it yet lol

The Flanker absolutely has more high alpha stability and nose authority than the F-14, if you try getting into a high alpha state and then dare put in some left or right stick movement you'll quickly drop a wing and end up in a spin in the 14.

Lateral stick is bad idea but you can still use the rudder at high AoA.

Btw: AI F-14B is quite challanging opponent last time I tried. Flanker doesn't hold its ground.