Removed

Good to see you are here listening to the feedback and talking back OverStratos. I have confidence you will get the FM right, and at that point you can be sure I will buy your product :thumbup:

So what is the FM like now? Can the jet still supercruise? Has the drag/aoa issue that caused the insane sustained turn rate been fixed?

I think it flies great now. It’s always going to be fast and have insane sustained turns

I think it flies great now. It’s always going to be fast and have insane sustained turns

(And low fuel amount :lol:)

So what is the FM like now? Can the jet still supercruise? Has the drag/aoa issue that caused the insane sustained turn rate been fixed?

I just got it and it doesn't seem to do that in my very limited flying of it. If anything it seems slow to me and slow to rebuild speed, though I'm not sure if I'm actually using the Afterburners (no visual AB effect). Probably a "me" problem or is there some special "mig-ism" that I'm missing there?

One thing that did impress me so far is that I somehow inadvertently managed to enter a flat spin during a dogfight that I couldn't get out of. The reason it impressed me, is that a) I've seldom entered spins in DCS that weren't hard to get into and absurdly easy to recover, and b) in general its hard to get planes to spin in DCS IMO (F14 being a notable exception).

Glad to hear that its still being worked on though.

The sustained turn rate should be better now than at release, but this is an area that needs some work yet. So far it´s a little difficult to tune this without messing other flight parameters, so our FM coder is slowly but steadily improving turn performance.

I just got it and it doesn't seem to do that in my very limited flying of it. If anything it seems slow to me and slow to rebuild speed, though I'm not sure if I'm actually using the Afterburners (no visual AB effect). Probably a "me" problem or is there some special "mig-ism" that I'm missing there?

 

One thing that did impress me so far is that I somehow inadvertently managed to enter a flat spin during a dogfight that I couldn't get out of. The reason it impressed me, is that a) I've seldom entered spins in DCS that weren't hard to get into and absurdly easy to recover, and b) in general its hard to get planes to spin in DCS IMO (F14 being a notable exception).

 

Glad to hear that its still being worked on though.

There is an afterburner activation button, "afterburner enable". Give it a long press while @ full Mil power. There are some green lights in the lower right of the front panel that indicate on/off.

The flat spin from low speed stall is a killer. She has a nasty low speed high AOA turning stall also.

There is an afterburner activation button, "afterburner enable". Give it a long press while @ full Mil power. There are some green lights in the lower right of the front panel that indicate on/off.

Good, figured it was a "me" problem. I've got less than an hour in it at this point.

The flat spin from low speed stall is a killer. She has a nasty low speed high AOA turning stall also.

Good! :thumbup:

That's great news! I"m tempted to get the module now :)

That's great news! I"m tempted to get the module now :)

For 25 bucks its not a bad deal.

Hello guys, I'm necro-ing this topic to bring you guys some news on the FM work that is ongoing on the Mig-19.

Major corrections were done to the lift coefficient discontinuity in AoA, that was causing annoying pitch control behavior.  Along with that change, the overall lift coefficient was tuned to match the data we have which brought the turn performance stuff in line better.

The other smaller change was the correction of the CG so that the static margin matches the data we have (which gives more accurate pitch moment feel for the aircraft).

CL before the adjustments

CL after the adjustments

@myHelljumper Guess I'll repost from the Status thread: if I understand those plots correctly - the dashed blue and continuous blue lines are both the coefficient of lift at sea level, while the green/violet/red are for increasing altitude? Shouldn't the two blue lines match then, implying that with these adjustments the coefficient of lift is going to be a bit too high (granted, only ~10%, so it's within DCS-ism limits)? Also, how come it is completely unchanged above 5000m? Am I missing something obvious?

I just asked the dev and he said that the tool used to make this graph only did the tests a 0m and 5000m so only these lines are valid. The 10000m and 15000m are to be ignored here.

This is still work in progress and we already have a closer line right now. We will see if we can get a complete graph sometime in the future.

I replaced the graph you were talking about with the new, closer one.

Cool, thanks! Nice to see this issue finally addressed, I'm really curious to see what it will do to the feel of the aircraft.

Thank you for FM changes!

Thank you so much for the FM change!! It gave this module a new life again.

Yeah thanks for the progress, looking forward to more development

Can someone give a short summary of what the fm feels like now?

Like a fighter

It feels like it doesn't quite have the nose authority of the 21 or F-5, but it can pull its nose and while it still beasts both of those in sustained turn rate, it's easier to stay within the right speed band now. You don't immediately lose all your speed and fall out of the sky like you used to, it'll still punish bad flying but is much more forgiving than it was before. You don't have to dread split-S manoeuvres anymore as (like the 21) it needs surprisingly little room to make them. All in all it's a huge improvement, it feels absolutely wonderful to fly and complements the 21 quite nicely when they're on the same team.

One thing I find a bit strange about the FM since both before & after the latest updaes, is the odd snappiness in pitch & yaw, it feels like there's a lack of inertia.

On 9/4/2021 at 2:08 AM, Hummingbird said:

One thing I find a bit strange about the FM since both before & after the latest updaes, is the odd snappiness in pitch & yaw, it feels like there's a lack of inertia.

Same here, the FM feels good except for that lack of inertia. Though I feel it mostly when banking the aircraft. Apply side stick to roll the aircraft, now center the stick and the aircraft will stop the roll immediately.

Other thing I find different, it's harder to keep the aircraft aligned on the runway in crosswind takeoffs, it feels as if the rudder has very little authority until it's going very fast.

Elsewhere the aircraft feels better and more realistic.

To me it feels like the roll rate is slow.

Do you guys have any technical data to confirm the roll rate?

On 11/16/2021 at 6:29 PM, vasco12r said:Other thing I find different, it's harder to keep the aircraft aligned on the runway in crosswind takeoffs, it feels as if the rudder has very little authority until it's going very fast.

 

I have noticed this too. With the current rudder authority the max x-wind for the Mig-19 would be around 15 knots which I highly doubt to be correct

Regarding the roll rate, the 19's wings have a slight anhedral, which makes the plane more unstable and able to overcome inertia.  This should help with instantaneous roll rate, i.e quick changes in roll.  I find the roll rate currently to be less than I expect.  Does anyone's have any metric evidence that the 19's roll performance should be further reduced?

If there were any aspects of the FM which I might suggest as still an area for improvement, it would be 2 items.

One would be that the fowler flaps on take off setting should not auto retract at such a low speed of 500 km/h, but instead at 800 km/h so they can be used in combat maneuvering.

The other would be the heavy inertia and ineffective air brakes.

Others are quick to note what seems to be overhyped bias against the MiG-19s ability to pull out of a dive, citing its thick wings and the compressibility effect.  So in a dive, I now have to kill the engines to idle and whip out the air brakes.  Fair enough.  But now you have to be super careful otherwise you then don't have enough airspeed to pull out of the dive because of the inertia.

But why is it that when going level or even climbing upwards I always overshoot other planes, even something as fat as an F-4?

This does not make to me.  The MiG-19 is as small as an F-86.  It has about the same fuselage length of about 35 ft, and roughly the same diameter.  Both have about the same empty weight of about 11,000 pounds, only a little more than a F-5E.

The MiG-19 has 3 rather than 2 air brakes compared to the F-86.

So why do I overshoot and F-4 even after cutting my throttle, and dropping brakes, when I was only a few km/h more for the purpose of gradually catching up to it.

The current inertia is is not representative of this light fighter.