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Valve Index Hands On


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Valve Index Hands On

 

Unless you can keep FPS above the screen refresh rate it will be either.

1. Ghosting with motion smoothing on. This is more noticeable on headsets with high-res screens since things do not look blurry to begin with.

2. Screen tearing when looking to the side with motion smoothing off.

 

For dogfighting at high altitude you should be able to get FPS >80 on a high-end system by using no supersampling and going easy on graphic settings. It’s all about fine tuning your system to get what you want with some compromises. Personally, I’d take ghosting over screen tearing any day since it doesn’t induce nausea. I would also take some ghosting in gameplay if it means significant improvement in image fidelity. In general, I tune my setup for zero tearing on terrains and buildings and just ignore some ghosting on the aircraft.


Edited by Supmua

PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti.

Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L

Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2

Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon)

VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/

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Valve Index Hands On

 

With MSAA?

 

 

 

The image quality looks better with MSSA on (with negative LOD setting) since it smoothes out the shimmering on cockpit texts and linear structures. Of course this taxes your FPS, but you can lower supersampling to compensate.

 

I’ve been messing with LOD settings and can definitely make the cockpit more blurry than default. So there is that too :)


Edited by Supmua

PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti.

Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L

Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2

Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon)

VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/

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The image quality looks better with MSSA on (with negative LOD setting) since it smoothes out the shimmering on cockpit texts and linear structures. Of course this taxes your FPS, but you can lower supersampling to compensate.

 

I’ve been messing with LOD settings and can definitely make the cockpit more blurry than default. So there is that too :)

 

Yes, also for me it is not clear the good or bad impact of LOD settings...

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Personally, I have best clarity results with 204% steam app SS, and PD=1.0 in DCS.

 

Thorought NV ispector, to have better clarity in textures, I edited the following parameters. Image attached. I have modified those parameters in other games and I have a quite similar result like sharpening filter, but in VR.

 

 

When you say you're setting the Steam App to 204%, can you clarify whether you mean the SteamVR App under Applications in settings or SteamVR Custom Resolution under the Video section. If you're setting the SteamVR App under settings Applications, what is your SteamVR Custom Resolution set to? Default/unchecked or checked and 100%?

 

I ask because if I do not check the custom resolution box and change it to 100% it will default to 150% which is what SteamVR says my computer will run best.


Edited by Wicked.-

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Intel i9 9900K @ 5.1Ghz HT Disabled, Asus RoG Strix z390E Gaming, 64GB G.Skill Trident Z 3200, Asus RoG Strix RTX2080Ti OC @ 1.9Ghz, 1TB Samsung Evo 970Pro M.2 TM Warthog, CH Pro Pedals, Saitek Pro Rudder Pedals, Samsung 49" Curved Gaming Monitor, Samsung 50" 4KUHD TV, Acer 27" Touch Panel, CV1, Pimax 5K+, Valve Index, FSSB3 Lighting, F-16SGRH, 3 TM Cougar's and a Saitek X36 that I can't bring myself to part with.

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What you are seeing is the effect of Valves Motion Smoothing algorithm (at least with regards to #1&2 above). Oculus ASW has a similar, but IMO, less dramatic effect as it’s a more refined algorithm at this point. I found the Valves Motion Smoothing to be pretty bad at times especially in the Viper cockpit, lots of warping of cockpit elements during high speed maneuvering (even during takeoff)which is a real bummer given the overall quality of the Index vs the Rift

 

You’ll see those effects go away if you switch off motion smoothing but then you may need to deal with a juddery / choppy experience... it’s all about trade offs

 

One of the big differences between valves motion smoothing and the oculus ASW is that the former works purely on the image while the latter uses depth information if available in the programme, which it is in DCS. Oculus ASW didn’t always use this information and did also show lots of distortions but then was upgraded. Does anyone know if valve intend to incorporate depth information?

For example with the old oculus ASW in the spitfire especially you would get distortion of The illuminated sight against the propeller. When they upgraded to use depth information ( I assume the programme knows the sight and propeller are in different planes) the distortion stopped.

I also have upgraded to the index and now also experience the distortion again. A great vr unit but definitely two steps forward and one step back regarding the current valve motion smoothing

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I have a question, please excuse me for the Off topic : what's the maximum resolution supported by DCS WORLD?

I mean monitors...

Thank you

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I have a question, please excuse me for the Off topic : what's the maximum resolution supported by DCS WORLD?

I mean monitors...

Thank you

 

 

Over 4K so above 4096x2160

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Intel i9 9900K @ 5.1Ghz HT Disabled, Asus RoG Strix z390E Gaming, 64GB G.Skill Trident Z 3200, Asus RoG Strix RTX2080Ti OC @ 1.9Ghz, 1TB Samsung Evo 970Pro M.2 TM Warthog, CH Pro Pedals, Saitek Pro Rudder Pedals, Samsung 49" Curved Gaming Monitor, Samsung 50" 4KUHD TV, Acer 27" Touch Panel, CV1, Pimax 5K+, Valve Index, FSSB3 Lighting, F-16SGRH, 3 TM Cougar's and a Saitek X36 that I can't bring myself to part with.

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So, 4096 x 2160 is the highest?

 

I don't know for a fact it's the highest res it can display but it's the highest res I've ever flown with on a 70" 4KUHD tv. It's not the game that is the limiting factor but the video card that sets the limit. If the video card tells DCS it can do 5K resolution then DCS can do 5K.

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Intel i9 9900K @ 5.1Ghz HT Disabled, Asus RoG Strix z390E Gaming, 64GB G.Skill Trident Z 3200, Asus RoG Strix RTX2080Ti OC @ 1.9Ghz, 1TB Samsung Evo 970Pro M.2 TM Warthog, CH Pro Pedals, Saitek Pro Rudder Pedals, Samsung 49" Curved Gaming Monitor, Samsung 50" 4KUHD TV, Acer 27" Touch Panel, CV1, Pimax 5K+, Valve Index, FSSB3 Lighting, F-16SGRH, 3 TM Cougar's and a Saitek X36 that I can't bring myself to part with.

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So, 4096 x 2160 is the highest?

 

 

 

No, when you run muti-monitor setup it goes higher than 4K but I’m not sure what the limit is. In VR, the rendering in my setup is already higher than 4K with supersampling.

PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti.

Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L

Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2

Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon)

VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/

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Valve Index Hands On

 

Tips for Index controller grip settings.

 

This allows the controller to mimic the grip button on Oculus controller. Normally the Index’s grip function activates when you just touch the grip which may not be desirable in many situations. This way you have to apply slight force on the grip to activate it. This is particularly great in non-DCS games to avoid grabbing swords or guns unintentionally.

 

1. Create a new binding.

2. In Grip setting, delete the default setting and choose add, use as Button.

3. Click Or Held setting - Grip Value, everything else none.

4. Options: Generate click from Force (leave everything else at default).

5. Save and use this binding.

 

Edit:

You can also add haptic feedback when you grip the button which is really useful, by using haptic force and duration setting.

 

You can also add haptic feedback to thumb stick middle click, since a lot of early Index controllers don’t always give the tactile feedback when you click the thumb stick while pushing it away from the center.


Edited by Supmua

PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti.

Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L

Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2

Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon)

VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/

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You can always tell the Index owners are happy.... it's crickets in here again lol.

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Intel i9 9900K @ 5.1Ghz HT Disabled, Asus RoG Strix z390E Gaming, 64GB G.Skill Trident Z 3200, Asus RoG Strix RTX2080Ti OC @ 1.9Ghz, 1TB Samsung Evo 970Pro M.2 TM Warthog, CH Pro Pedals, Saitek Pro Rudder Pedals, Samsung 49" Curved Gaming Monitor, Samsung 50" 4KUHD TV, Acer 27" Touch Panel, CV1, Pimax 5K+, Valve Index, FSSB3 Lighting, F-16SGRH, 3 TM Cougar's and a Saitek X36 that I can't bring myself to part with.

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I definitely am - my only issue is MSAA or no MSAA. I do get frame issues in busy areas and around the tankers using the 148/138 mix.

 

Does anyone else have issues spotting with the MSAA on? I may go back to no MSAA to see if I can get my eyes on target.


Edited by Nagilem

:pilotfly: Specs: I9-9900k; ROG Strix RTX 2080ti; Valve Index HMD; 32GB DDR4 3200 Ram; Samsung 970 EVO 1TB SSD; TM Warthog with pedals, 3 TM MFDs

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I definitely am - my only issue is MSAA or no MSAA. I do get frame issues in busy areas and around the tankers using the 148/138 mix.

 

Does anyone else have issues spotting with the MSAA on? I may go back to no MSAA to see if I can get my eyes on target.

 

Yep. MSAA is super sampling which shrinks a large render to increase clarity up close. Unfortunately this make things at distance much smaller and therefore harder to see. I keep it off.

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Intel i9 9900K @ 5.1Ghz HT Disabled, Asus RoG Strix z390E Gaming, 64GB G.Skill Trident Z 3200, Asus RoG Strix RTX2080Ti OC @ 1.9Ghz, 1TB Samsung Evo 970Pro M.2 TM Warthog, CH Pro Pedals, Saitek Pro Rudder Pedals, Samsung 49" Curved Gaming Monitor, Samsung 50" 4KUHD TV, Acer 27" Touch Panel, CV1, Pimax 5K+, Valve Index, FSSB3 Lighting, F-16SGRH, 3 TM Cougar's and a Saitek X36 that I can't bring myself to part with.

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Hi,

 

I use MSAA 2x with Index. I found the shimmering with MSAA off to be too much to bear, even at the cost of some fps.

 

MSAA blurs edges so they don't shimmer which is great for the attenuation of shimmering or the stairs effect. This makes far, not linear objects become blurred and somewhat faded which is a negative side effect.

 

Anyway I can spot aircraft quite far, even for real life standards. The problem is that one must put the eyes exactly on the right piece of sky to achieve this, which makes it an art form.

 

But in reality it is the same.

 

I'm coming from Rift CV1 and the visual pickup has evolved to a point comparable to real life, when talking about distances only. The crispiness of the tallies is still way too far behind from reality and the VID distances as well as a consequence. But, from a CV1 comparison perspective the visual arena is now manageable.

 

Maybe with 8K for each eye...

 

Tech will get there for sure!!!

 

For the ground targets it is easier in DCS than real life by miles. This is because the terrain is simpler, with less clutter than real life and any object becomes more easily observable.

 

Having said this I think that spotting is well modeled in DCS. I know that some people complain about it but only bigger (size) monitors and more resolution in both monitors and VR will solve this... or labels, which I never use anyway.

 

ED has done a good job in this department.

 

Cheers!!!

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I totally agree that MSAA is needed to counter the aliasing, especially in the Viper which is the worst of all my modules. Unfortunately, I run my settings too high to use it and still get decent frame rates. Aliasing is the worst when the sun is in front of you. MSAA does clean it up though.

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Intel i9 9900K @ 5.1Ghz HT Disabled, Asus RoG Strix z390E Gaming, 64GB G.Skill Trident Z 3200, Asus RoG Strix RTX2080Ti OC @ 1.9Ghz, 1TB Samsung Evo 970Pro M.2 TM Warthog, CH Pro Pedals, Saitek Pro Rudder Pedals, Samsung 49" Curved Gaming Monitor, Samsung 50" 4KUHD TV, Acer 27" Touch Panel, CV1, Pimax 5K+, Valve Index, FSSB3 Lighting, F-16SGRH, 3 TM Cougar's and a Saitek X36 that I can't bring myself to part with.

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Anyone out there using a 9700k paired with a 1080ti and the Index? I'm currently on a 6700k OC'd to 4.6, 16GB of 3000mhz RAM and the 1080ti with no OC. DCS is on a SSD drive. For settings on the Index I'm using a 90hz refresh rate at 96% resolution under the "video" settings with no motion reprojection. On the applications tab I use a custom resolution setting of 100%. In the Nvidia control panel I use a setting of antialiasing transparency of 2x. In the game I use no MSAA or shadows with an IPD setting of 1.2. Textures are on high, view distance is on high and water is on high. Pre load radius is about 3/4 of the way to max with the slider for clutter and grass all the way down and tree visibility at about half. My issue is that in missions with large numbers of ground assets I seem to get some mini stutters through my Index and I'm wondering if perhaps a 9700k would help eliminate those?

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Depending on what server I’m on I get some stuttering as well when on the ground. It’s a combination of the time it takes to receive the packets and then process them. You will definitely notice a difference in performance with the 9700K over the 6700K. Just know up front it probably won’t eliminate the stuttering completely.

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Intel i9 9900K @ 5.1Ghz HT Disabled, Asus RoG Strix z390E Gaming, 64GB G.Skill Trident Z 3200, Asus RoG Strix RTX2080Ti OC @ 1.9Ghz, 1TB Samsung Evo 970Pro M.2 TM Warthog, CH Pro Pedals, Saitek Pro Rudder Pedals, Samsung 49" Curved Gaming Monitor, Samsung 50" 4KUHD TV, Acer 27" Touch Panel, CV1, Pimax 5K+, Valve Index, FSSB3 Lighting, F-16SGRH, 3 TM Cougar's and a Saitek X36 that I can't bring myself to part with.

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Anyone out there using a 9700k paired with a 1080ti and the Index? I'm currently on a 6700k OC'd to 4.6, 16GB of 3000mhz RAM and the 1080ti with no OC. DCS is on a SSD drive. For settings on the Index I'm using a 90hz refresh rate at 96% resolution under the "video" settings with no motion reprojection. On the applications tab I use a custom resolution setting of 100%. In the Nvidia control panel I use a setting of antialiasing transparency of 2x. In the game I use no MSAA or shadows with an IPD setting of 1.2. Textures are on high, view distance is on high and water is on high. Pre load radius is about 3/4 of the way to max with the slider for clutter and grass all the way down and tree visibility at about half. My issue is that in missions with large numbers of ground assets I seem to get some mini stutters through my Index and I'm wondering if perhaps a 9700k would help eliminate those?

 

Personally, I would go for the 8700K. It has slightly less performance than the 9700K, but has hyperthreading which can be very beneficial in some applications. Good for O/Cing as well reaching 5.1GHz easily.

 

Just out of interest, when I had the 9900K, I saw very little difference in DCS compared to my exisitng 8700K. So, I sent it back!

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Thanks for the comments guys. Yes, these are not on ground stutters, but in air stutters when flying over the assets. I should mention this is very prevelant while trying to use the “Capture the North” mission available on the DCS website. I think it has something like 800 assets!

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Thanks for the comments guys. Yes, these are not on ground stutters, but in air stutters when flying over the assets. I should mention this is very prevelant while trying to use the “Capture the North” mission available on the DCS website. I think it has something like 800 assets!

 

 

That will do it! You'll get a minimum of 400Mghz more speed out of the 9700K over the 6700K. It WILL make a positive difference especially in the air. Besides, I would update any processor below a 7700K anyway.

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Intel i9 9900K @ 5.1Ghz HT Disabled, Asus RoG Strix z390E Gaming, 64GB G.Skill Trident Z 3200, Asus RoG Strix RTX2080Ti OC @ 1.9Ghz, 1TB Samsung Evo 970Pro M.2 TM Warthog, CH Pro Pedals, Saitek Pro Rudder Pedals, Samsung 49" Curved Gaming Monitor, Samsung 50" 4KUHD TV, Acer 27" Touch Panel, CV1, Pimax 5K+, Valve Index, FSSB3 Lighting, F-16SGRH, 3 TM Cougar's and a Saitek X36 that I can't bring myself to part with.

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Nope, VR is still terrible. Haven't used it extensively in several months.

 

 

Sorry to hear that. Specs?

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Intel i9 9900K @ 5.1Ghz HT Disabled, Asus RoG Strix z390E Gaming, 64GB G.Skill Trident Z 3200, Asus RoG Strix RTX2080Ti OC @ 1.9Ghz, 1TB Samsung Evo 970Pro M.2 TM Warthog, CH Pro Pedals, Saitek Pro Rudder Pedals, Samsung 49" Curved Gaming Monitor, Samsung 50" 4KUHD TV, Acer 27" Touch Panel, CV1, Pimax 5K+, Valve Index, FSSB3 Lighting, F-16SGRH, 3 TM Cougar's and a Saitek X36 that I can't bring myself to part with.

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Nope, VR is still terrible. Haven't used it extensively in several months.

 

Try some non-DCS games and you might change your mind. Been playing some co-op games with my kids and it was just pure fun, especially Stormlands.

PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti.

Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L

Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2

Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon)

VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/

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Just curious - anybody here having issues around tankers with FPS dropping like a stone? I get around a tanker with one or two other AC and my frames drop from 40 to less than 20. I don't seem to have issues with those same AC flying around without the tanker close.

:pilotfly: Specs: I9-9900k; ROG Strix RTX 2080ti; Valve Index HMD; 32GB DDR4 3200 Ram; Samsung 970 EVO 1TB SSD; TM Warthog with pedals, 3 TM MFDs

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