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Old 09-28-2016, 03:38 PM   #51
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But that'll pull attention from the current full-fidelity "fighters." Let's look at what's out there: MiG-21, while a very capable aircraft, is an interceptor. The F-5 has been set up as a fast ground pounder. The only ASM fighter out there that will be able to stand a chance against an ASM Eagle is probably the Mirage. At least until the Russian 4th gen fighters also get the overhaul... Besides, other than ground ops stuff, most if not all necessary functions (at least from what I can see and how I have my setup run) will be mapped to the HOTAS anyway, negating a need for a "clicky pit", however utilising master arm and the MPCD would be nice.
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Old 09-29-2016, 03:21 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -=42VFG=-Fenrir View Post
But that'll pull attention from the current full-fidelity "fighters." Let's look at what's out there: MiG-21, while a very capable aircraft, is an interceptor. The F-5 has been set up as a fast ground pounder. The only ASM fighter out there that will be able to stand a chance against an ASM Eagle is probably the Mirage. At least until the Russian 4th gen fighters also get the overhaul... Besides, other than ground ops stuff, most if not all necessary functions (at least from what I can see and how I have my setup run) will be mapped to the HOTAS anyway, negating a need for a "clicky pit", however utilising master arm and the MPCD would be nice.



and f5 isnt merely a fast ground pounder but a light inexpensive multirole fighter, for economical export. Its very much capable and meant to be used as a air to air dog fighter. back then when the F5 was designed WVR with guns and seekers was very more common place, and quite clients who bought the F5 would have had neighbors in the region who operated the Mig21, so its still a contemporary when compared.

mig21 may have been a interceptor but its perfectly capable of going against fighters and not just "intercepting" bombers. and its has some air to ground function too, so the BIs could be considered multirole for its day.

i think were getting too caught up behind the mere labels of aircraft.


I dont see whats wrong with a clicable F15C. It wont change anything as itl still have the same capabilities as the FC3 F15C, just full fidelity, It'l continue facing off not against the M2000 but the Su27, russia;s closest counterpart to the eagle ( and to a lesser degree the mig29S) as it always has in FC3. eventually ED has expressed interest in creating a full fidelty versions of the su27 and Mig29, just not the SM variants, due to public data on them being restricted.
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Old 09-29-2016, 01:40 PM   #53
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My point was more to the fact of having available frames perform their INTENDED taskings. At least in the USAF, there's what's called an MDS which stands for Mission, Design, Series. Every aircraft in the inventory has one. Just because every currently available airframe can perform ground attack save the F-15C (a decision I still to this day don't understand) doesn't necessarily mean it should, and same with A2A (although there has been misidenetification, intentional or otherwise ie F-117.) I said about the F-5 being a fast mud mover because if they wanted an air superiority platform, they would've modelled the "G" model, which could carry AIM-120s.So far the only jet available that is A2A ONLY is the Eagle, and while I would love to see it get the ASM overhaul, I don't see it in the near future due to already available ASM birds that can be shoe horned into a fighter role, unless their intention is to (hopefully) release the Eagle, Su-27B and MiG-29A or G as a package deal not unlike FC3.
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Old 09-29-2016, 04:34 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -=42VFG=-Fenrir View Post
My point was more to the fact of having available frames perform their INTENDED taskings. At least in the USAF, there's what's called an MDS which stands for Mission, Design, Series. Every aircraft in the inventory has one. Just because every currently available airframe can perform ground attack save the F-15C (a decision I still to this day don't understand) doesn't necessarily mean it should, and same with A2A (although there has been misidenetification, intentional or otherwise ie F-117.) I said about the F-5 being a fast mud mover because if they wanted an air superiority platform, they would've modelled the "G" model, which could carry AIM-120s.So far the only jet available that is A2A ONLY is the Eagle, and while I would love to see it get the ASM overhaul, I don't see it in the near future due to already available ASM birds that can be shoe horned into a fighter role, unless their intention is to (hopefully) release the Eagle, Su-27B and MiG-29A or G as a package deal not unlike FC3.
they modelled the f5e because it's the more common exported variant and because that's the one that was the contemporary of the mig21bis in the 70s. mig21 has no Amrams. so there was no point adding a modernised f5. mig21s r3r may be a Sarh but it's still a wvr missile due to its short range.( not much more than IR seekers)

the f5e3 is specifically the aggressor type that used by the usn and us af. we weren't meant to get a modern variant. I think some have a misconception that it was supposed to be an f16 lite or something.
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Old 09-29-2016, 05:11 PM   #55
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I guess we got sidetracked by semantics here. My original point was basically if you want an ASM ground pounder you got the A-10C. Multi-role, plenty to choose from. The only area lacking in ASM is dedicated air superiority, meaning gets on station quickly and has the loiter time and armament to achieve and maintain airspace denial.
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Old 09-29-2016, 06:19 PM   #56
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We have 3 such ASM fighters at this time, the F-5E, MiG-21Bis and Mirage 2000C. We also have the F/A-18C and F-14A/B in officially confirmed development. The F-5E and MiG-21Bis are simply from the 1970's instead of 1985-ish (Su-27 and MiG-29A) or 2000+ (FC3 F-15C). Any plane that isn't designed to maintain local air superiority as its primary function isn't a fighter.
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Old 09-29-2016, 06:32 PM   #57
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no need for you guys to get so worked up over this, as no amount of reasoning or correctness will actually accomplish any work for an f-15c, nor for any modules in the pipe ahead of an f-15c.
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Old 09-29-2016, 09:21 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -=42VFG=-Fenrir View Post
I guess we got sidetracked by semantics here. My original point was basically if you want an ASM ground pounder you got the A-10C. Multi-role, plenty to choose from. The only area lacking in ASM is dedicated air superiority, meaning gets on station quickly and has the loiter time and armament to achieve and maintain airspace denial.
so realistically only the f15 and su27 have enough station time to do so.( and upcoming f14)


yeah we have plenty of multirole. but none that can employ more advanced avoincis for the role. none that yet that have smart munitions, sead function. or use tgp as to be able to engage targets from a safer distance instead of relying on unguided munitions whilst dive bombing.

we have no multirole fighter yet than cn perform the above. at least not until we get the f18c from ed.
hence the greater importance of expanding the 4tg gen multirole area. besides multirole planes probably get more sales in dcs because it's a better bang for your buck deal too.


there aren't really many dedicated single role air superiority aircraft in the 4th generation begin with. f15 and su27 which we have in fc3 ( and eventually f14 tomcat from leartherneck)

4th generation- present the age of the multirole fighter. especially as most nations don't have the budget to maintain specialized role specific expensive aircraft. hence why planes like the f16 sold like hotcakes around the world. versatility plus affordability.

the Russian really only would have the mig25 or mig31 but those are pure bred interceptors. they can't maneuver too well. and don't have too good visibility from the cockpit.
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Old 12-31-2016, 03:47 PM   #59
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Since Chizh is revealing a lot of info in the Russian subforum (see his latest post about belsimtek getting involved in the f/a -18c project), perhaps a Russian speaking member could ask if they still have plans to develop a full f-15c module. Perhaps the development of the f/a- 18 could benefit the f-15. E.g. the development of new air to air radar code from scratch and not as evolution from the simplified fc3 version (https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.p...86#post2911086 ) could be used as a foundation to create an advanced radar for the f-15 also.

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