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Mi-24 Gunner Sight


Focha

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… The gunners job is to look for targets, call them out, and if ordered to engage with the ATGM's. So its a bit different than the western model of helo's where the gunner has more to do, and the tactics are pop up from behind a hill etc.

Commentary by a real Russian military helicopter pilot.

Ну почему же оператору нечего делать. Он в первую очередь навигатор, а потом оператор. Летит, ведет ориентировку, рассчитывает время прибытия на поворотные и цель, помогает искать цели, контролирует параметры и т.д. Как оператор выполняет пуски ракет по целям. Конечно же все хотят быть командирами. Но будут люди, которые захотят летать операторами.

 

It’s a wild world. How many of those PKVs were made? Jesus it must’ve been like printing money to get into the PKV business in the Cold War

By the way, the Mi-24P operator does not have a PKV reflector sight, but he does have a PKI reflector sight. :)

 

Original in Russian

 

Комментарий реального российского военного пилота-вертолётчика.

 

Кстати, у оператора Ми-24П нет коллиматорного прицела ПКВ, но зато у него есть коллиматорный прицел ПКИ. :)

 

Sorry, I don't speak English, so I use Google Translate.

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The key here is to know if our AI gunner will be able to detect and tell us about enemy positions, manpad launched and AAA fires. Thats what I would love to know.

 

This would be great, although I'm not sure it would help that much at the altitudes you fly in this thing. Unless you happen to be extremely lucky a MANPAD launch against a heli in DCS is almost always a hit.

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Interesting! I assume they are related designs, since they look so similar? what are the differences?

There are some differences in design and aiming reticle.

<…>

 

5840319.jpg post-6112-0-01383000-1380915996.jpg

 

<…>

<…>

[ATTACH]207432[/ATTACH]

  • The PKI sight (Russian: ПКИ – прицел коллиматорный истребительный, "Fighter's Reflector Sight") is a reflector sight of the WW2 era, a later modification of the PBP-1B reflector sight, which was also installed on Il-2 attack aircraft.
  • The PKV sight (Russian: ПКВ – прицел коллиматорный вертолётный, "Helicopter's Reflector Sight") is a reflector sight of the Cold War era, designed for installation on Soviet army aviation helicopters.

 

Original in Russian

 

Имеются некоторые различия в конструкции и в сетке прицелов.

 

  • Прицел ПКИ (прицел коллиматорный истребительный) – коллиматорный прицел времён ВМВ, более поздняя модификация коллиматорного прицела ПБП-1Б, который устанавливался в том числе и на штурмовики Ил-2.
  • Прицел ПКВ (прицел коллиматорный вертолётный) – коллиматорный прицел времён Холодной войны, разработанный для установки на советских вертолётах армейской авиации.

 

Sorry, I don't speak English, so I use Google Translate.

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The key here is to know if our AI gunner will be able to detect and tell us about enemy positions, manpad launched and AAA fires. Thats what I would love to know.

The BST is developing for the DCS: Mi-24P a newer modification of the ASO-2V CMDS, IIRC, the control of firing heat flares from which can be carried out both from the operator's cockpit and from the pilot's cockpit.

Yes there are flare dispenser on the MI-24, also on the MI-8. Attached is a picture, the old style of attaching them was under the tail boom with tension straps, the newer style is behind the wings.

 

[ATTACH]243707[/ATTACH]

PilotMi8 writes in this post that the AI will help the player fire heat flares when a threat is detected.

 

Original in Russian

 

BST делают для DCS: Ми-24П более новую модификацию установки АСО-2В, ЕМНИП, управление отстрелом ЛТЦ из которой может осуществляться как из кабины оператора, так и из кабины пилота.

 

PilotMi8 пишет в этом сообщении, что ИИ будет помогать игроку с отстрелом ЛТЦ при обнаружении угрозы.

 

Sorry, I don't speak English, so I use Google Translate.

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Commentary by a real Russian military helicopter pilot.

 

 

 

 

Original in Russian

 

Комментарий реального российского военного пилота-вертолётчика.

 

Кстати, у оператора Ми-24П нет коллиматорного прицела ПКВ, но зато у него есть коллиматорный прицел ПКИ. :)

 

Well web translate more or less confirms he basically spots, and also does missiles and Nav.

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The BST is developing for the DCS: Mi-24P a newer modification of the ASO-2V CMDS, IIRC, the control of firing heat flares from which can be carried out both from the operator's cockpit and from the pilot's cockpit.

 

PilotMi8 writes in this post that the AI will help the player fire heat flares when a threat is detected.

 

Original in Russian

 

BST делают для DCS: Ми-24П более новую модификацию установки АСО-2В, ЕМНИП, управление отстрелом ЛТЦ из которой может осуществляться как из кабины оператора, так и из кабины пилота.

 

PilotMi8 пишет в этом сообщении, что ИИ будет помогать игроку с отстрелом ЛТЦ при обнаружении угрозы.

 

Apart from missiles, I hope he calls for targets and AAA.

I don't understand anything in russian except Davai Davai!

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Google Translate

 

Apart from missiles, I hope he calls for targets and AAA.

Andrey Chizh in his interview in Russian promises (

) that the AI in the DCS: Mi-24P will be made at a fairly high level. :)

 

Original in Russian

 

Андрей Чиж в своём интервью на русском языке обещает (

), что ИИ в DCS: Ми-24П будет сделан на достаточно высоком уровне. :)

 

Sorry, I don't speak English, so I use Google Translate.

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Andrey Chizh in his interview in Russian promises (
) that the AI in the DCS: Mi-24P will be made at a fairly high level. :)

 

Original in Russian

 

Андрей Чиж в своём интервью на русском языке обещает (

), что ИИ в DCS: Ми-24П будет сделан на достаточно высоком уровне. :)

 

cool..

but until I see it working in game Ill wait to see what 'fairly high level' means.

I mean that could mean almost anything.

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Andrey Chizh in his interview in Russian promises (
) that the AI in the DCS: Mi-24P will be made at a fairly high level. :)

 

Original in Russian

 

Андрей Чиж в своём интервью на русском языке обещает (

), что ИИ в DCS: Ми-24П будет сделан на достаточно высоком уровне. :)

 

Can't wait to check it by myself!

I don't understand anything in russian except Davai Davai!

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cool..

but until I see it working in game Ill wait to see what 'fairly high level' means.

I mean that could mean almost anything.

 

That it don't call targets from 100 km :lol:

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The original idea of this thread was to know more about the Mi-24 sensor suite.

 

I found a great site, although it is in Portuguese, with a lot of details and an amazing Revell build.

 

https://www.spmodelismo.com.br/howto/he/progress/progress04.01.php

 

Specifically the sights/sensors.

 

Does anyone have more information about Mi-24P and its sensor suite/sights?

 

Thank you.

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Andrey Chizh in his interview in Russian promises (
) that the AI in the DCS: Mi-24P will be made at a fairly high level. :)

 

Original in Russian

 

Андрей Чиж в своём интервью на русском языке обещает (

), что ИИ в DCS: Ми-24П будет сделан на достаточно высоком уровне. :)

 

 

 

Hope spotting will some kind of realistic for the AI, for example a Tank sit's in a camoflage Forrest and u see for only 2% for Tank shining trough the Forrest.

For Human it would be unlikley to spot this Thread, and hopefully the AI will not immedatly spot something because Line of Sight...

Once you have tasted Flight, you will forever walk the Earth with your Eyes turned Skyward.

 

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9./JG27

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Hope spotting will some kind of realistic for the AI, for example a Tank sit's in a camoflage Forrest and u see for only 2% for Tank shining trough the Forrest.

For Human it would be unlikley to spot this Thread, and hopefully the AI will not immedatly spot something because Line of Sight...

 

h3.jpg

 

Scimitar-Camo-Nets-02.jpg

 

Sure you will spot those when they sit at the wide open and flat crop field, but put them near other bushes, trees and such that doesn't make them pop-up in overall terrain shapes and you do not spot them even on foot unless they make noise or they move.

 

The movement reveals everything easily. Staying still makes you very difficult to spot even if without any camouflage.

 

And dream to come true is as well that ground vehicles would receive these camouflage tactics to hide vehicles from FLIR and A-G radar. Have the AI automatically seek for a proper hidden place at the edge of the forest and so on, instead sitting as a target practice board like now.

 

That is as well why I would like to see more of ground foliage in DCS, with all kind random generated (by map developer, not by the client) terrain elements like small trees, bushes, rocks, pits and all kind stuff that will render many locations just challenging to fight.

 

And for same reason I would want to have a fake-HMS kind reticle for calling out targets for AI when player spots them. So that player can look at the direction by placing area in center of view and tell AI to "look there". And then AI would concentrate its search pattern in that general area (like +- 2-3 degree zone) at similar angle for range.

 

So human player could be there searching targets, spot something and then looks at the direction and press PTT button for "Target at...." and AI would very likely suppose to as well spot the same thing that human already did.

 

As if we come to situation that human does spot the target and AI is "Nope, nothing there". Then it will be extremely frustrating experience as player knows there is something and AI is stupid.

The opposite is true when AI spots something and player is like "Where?" and it makes them feel stupid....

 

And this is important if there is going to be a synced Gunner sight crosshair visible on the pilot sight so that pilot can see where gunner has locked their target, as even if pilot doesn't see the target (no FLIR etc) it is possible be engaged as you just place a crosshair on crosshair and fire.

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  • 7 months later...
On 9/14/2020 at 2:35 PM, toilet2000 said:

 

 

No it's not. the Raduga sighting system started from a 1930s submarine periscope, but it is modified extensively with gyro-stabilization, extended zoom and more.

 

 

It's a myth that it is simply a submarine periscope. It's purpose built, but based on a periscope design.

Any idea of the magnification options on the Raduga sight?

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