Reflected Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 I must be doing something wrong, but 12 AI 190s vs 12 AI Mustangs set to "Average" and I'm getting slaughtered every single time. I'm not even close to downing any of them, they fly circles around me horizontally and vertically. If I switch them to Spits, it's an instant death mission. I have some great plans with the Anton, but please, give me some tips how to make it balanced against the AI. Facebook Instagram YouTube Discord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrExplosion Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 Solution: Make it 12 Antons vs 6 Mustangs. :-) The version of the Anton we have at the moment is strictly inferior to its allied counterparts. The RLM was of the same opinion so the version we have in the game right now was only produced for ~3-4 months, but was the version in service during D-Day. Kein Anderer als ein Jäger spürt, Den Kampf und Sieg so konzentriert. Das macht uns glücklich, stolz und froh, Der Jägerei ein Horrido! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic Zach Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 The A8 is kinda Stuka's replacement, for its role. A8 isn't really intended for much air combat, or at least used that way. It spent a lot of time ground attacking. For air combat the A-6 was much more suited Hardware: T-50 Mongoose, VKB STECS, Saitek 3 Throttle Quadrant, Homemade 32-function Leo Bodnar Button Box, MFG Crosswind Pedals Oculus Rift S System Specs: MSI MPG X570 GAMING PLUS, RTX 3090, Ryzen 7 5800X3D, 32GB DDR4-3200, Samsung 860 EVO, Samsung 970 EVO 250GB Modules: AH-64D, Ka-50, Mi-8MTV2, F-16C, F-15E, F/A-18C, F-14B, F-5E, P-51D, Spitfire Mk LF Mk. IXc, Bf-109K-4, Fw-190A-8 Maps: Normandy, Nevada, Persian Gulf, Syria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cintra Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 The A8 is kinda Stuka's replacement, for its role. A8 isn't really intended for much air combat, or at least used that way. It spent a lot of time ground attacking. For air combat the A-6 was much more suited That would be the F-8 you are thinking about. The A8 is still a fighter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DD_Fenrir Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 The A8 is kinda Stuka's replacement, for its role. A8 isn't really intended for much air combat, or at least used that way. It spent a lot of time ground attacking. For air combat the A-6 was much more suited Eh? The A's were always fighters first, ground attack second. The F and G series were dedicated ground attackers and were the erstwhile Stuka replacements. The heavier armament of the A-7 (the direct precedent to the -8.) came as a direct response to have greater firepower for dealing with the massive bomber raids over the Reich. How do you explain the Fw 190 A-8/R8 - the purpose designed heavy bomber interceptor with additional armour and 30mm cannon? The actual reason that the Luftwaffe was stuck with the BMW 801 engine aircraft for high altitude fighting and intercepts is that development of a high altitude 190 and what would eventually become the D, and ultimately the Ta-152 was monumentally hamstrung by powerplant development difficulties and supply delays. In the ups and downs and leap frogs of comparative aircraft performance the Jadgwaffe was unlucky to be at one the nadirs of both of it's fighter models performance in early to mid 1944, just at the time when most of it's opponents were improving their relative performance. That said the A-8 is still competitive: Compare top speeds at most altitudes for the Spitfire LF.IX and the Fw 190 A-8; at ~20000ft they're neck and neck. Yes the Mustang is faster, turns as well and has similar climb, but the 190 has excellent roll rate, huge firepower and can scissor like a demon. It should not be taken lightly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cintra Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 Hey Reflected. I dont think that the AI uses the right fighting technique for the 190 anyways, it is in no way a turn fighter against either the 51 or spit, Germans designed their planes around the boom and zoom concepts almost exclusively, which I'm sure you know about because of your expertise. So using the AI vs AI might be a difficult judgement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grafspee Posted March 10, 2020 Share Posted March 10, 2020 Hey Reflected. I dont think that the AI uses the right fighting technique for the 190 anyways, it is in no way a turn fighter against either the 51 or spit, Germans designed their planes around the boom and zoom concepts almost exclusively, which I'm sure you know about because of your expertise. So using the AI vs AI might be a difficult judgement. Especial Bf 109 which could not pull out of high speed dive :) Large stick forces at high IAS System specs: I7 14700KF, Gigabyte Z790 Aorus Elite, 64GB DDR4 3600MHz, Gigabyte RTX 4090,Win 11, 48" OLED LG TV + 42" LG LED monitor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reflected Posted March 11, 2020 Author Share Posted March 11, 2020 Thanks for all the advice, so it's not just me, then. In my missions I'll make sure there are some 109s around to keep the battle in balance. The Thunderbolt will help a lot too, I guess, it will be a good adversary to the 190A :thumbup: Facebook Instagram YouTube Discord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronJockel Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 The AI does not conserve energy at all, so the A8 and p47 will always lose badly to fighters with better turn and climb performance. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted March 12, 2020 ED Team Share Posted March 12, 2020 Next time I see the same characters trying to spin a thread in the directions of their own beef, warnings will be handed out, for now, all the extra stuff has been deleted. Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grafspee Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 Thanks for all the advice, so it's not just me, then. In my missions I'll make sure there are some 109s around to keep the battle in balance. The Thunderbolt will help a lot too, I guess, it will be a good adversary to the 190A :thumbup: What if you put ace pilots in Antons and rookies in Spitfires ? System specs: I7 14700KF, Gigabyte Z790 Aorus Elite, 64GB DDR4 3600MHz, Gigabyte RTX 4090,Win 11, 48" OLED LG TV + 42" LG LED monitor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reflected Posted March 12, 2020 Author Share Posted March 12, 2020 What if you put ace pilots in Antons and rookies in Spitfires ? That was my first try, but 12 ace Antons vs 12 rookie Spits (or Mustangs) ends in a massacre, and I'm obliterated each time within a minute. Facebook Instagram YouTube Discord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DD_Fenrir Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 Just to clarify Reflected, what airframe are you in; I assumed the Anton as you were testing viability for campaign, but it's not actually 100% clear? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grafspee Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 I assumed that he was flying Anton. System specs: I7 14700KF, Gigabyte Z790 Aorus Elite, 64GB DDR4 3600MHz, Gigabyte RTX 4090,Win 11, 48" OLED LG TV + 42" LG LED monitor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrExplosion Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 That was my first try, but 12 ace Antons vs 12 rookie Spits (or Mustangs) ends in a massacre, and I'm obliterated each time within a minute. "The Spitfire LF Mk.IX and the Fw 190 A-8 make excellent counterparts for DCS World." :megalol: Kein Anderer als ein Jäger spürt, Den Kampf und Sieg so konzentriert. Das macht uns glücklich, stolz und froh, Der Jägerei ein Horrido! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grafspee Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 "The Spitfire LF Mk.IX and the Fw 190 A-8 make excellent counterparts for DCS World." :megalol: Piloted by good pilots i would say yes, as AI no. System specs: I7 14700KF, Gigabyte Z790 Aorus Elite, 64GB DDR4 3600MHz, Gigabyte RTX 4090,Win 11, 48" OLED LG TV + 42" LG LED monitor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reflected Posted March 12, 2020 Author Share Posted March 12, 2020 Yes, I was testing the playability flying the Anton in SP, sorry if I wasn’t clear. Facebook Instagram YouTube Discord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grafspee Posted March 12, 2020 Share Posted March 12, 2020 When i was flying Anton in aerobatics server i found that it is extremely hard to make loop in this plane, Fw190 D9 easy, spit p-51 bf109 you can do loop after loop. But Anton struggle a lot, this is saying something important about Fw190 A8. System specs: I7 14700KF, Gigabyte Z790 Aorus Elite, 64GB DDR4 3600MHz, Gigabyte RTX 4090,Win 11, 48" OLED LG TV + 42" LG LED monitor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrExplosion Posted March 13, 2020 Share Posted March 13, 2020 But Anton struggle a lot, this is saying something important about Fw190 A8. Yes it quite underpowered. Try to make a somewhat fast lvl turn at somewhat high altitude... Kein Anderer als ein Jäger spürt, Den Kampf und Sieg so konzentriert. Das macht uns glücklich, stolz und froh, Der Jägerei ein Horrido! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cintra Posted March 13, 2020 Share Posted March 13, 2020 Do you guys mean that ED has underpowered the A8 or is th A8 just an underpowered plane in real life? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain_Deveraux Posted April 26, 2020 Share Posted April 26, 2020 against the mustang against the spit I have recognized that I can take on mustangs, if they're not too bright: The A8 is a monstrous scissor-deamon, so you'll let the mustang take on you (and survive it's first attack), then you scissor untill it has to break off, and then you take it. That doesn't work against the spit though, it will tear through you every time. I think you have to fly the A8 against the spit with a lot of energy conserving... I don't know how that should work in the A8 though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amazingme Posted April 26, 2020 Share Posted April 26, 2020 Especial Bf 109 which could not pull out of high speed dive :) Large stick forces at high IAS250-300km/h IAS is not a high speed.. Sent from my Redmi 5 using Tapatalk Specs: Asus Z97 PRO Gamer, i7 4790K@4.6GHz, 4x8GB Kingston @2400MHz 11-13-14-32, Titan X, Creative X-Fi, 128+2x250GB SSDs, VPC T50 Throttle + G940, MFG Crosswinds, TrackIR 5 w/ pro clip, JetSeat, Win10 Pro 64-bit, Oculus Rift, 27"@1920x1080 Settings:2.1.x - Textures:High Terrain:High Civ.Traffic:Off Water:High VisRan:Low Heatblur:High Shadows:High Res:1920x1080 RoC:1024 MSAA:4x AF:16x HDR:OFF DefS: ON GCI: ON DoF:Off Lens: OFF C/G:390m Trees:1500m R:max Gamma: 1.5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amazingme Posted September 13, 2020 Share Posted September 13, 2020 If defeating a P-51D AI(Ace) on an Anton is still an issue, here I there is a video. Conditions are on the description I can kill any AI from a bicycle.. try killing MAD in P51 for example.. :) Sent from my Redmi 5 using Tapatalk Specs: Asus Z97 PRO Gamer, i7 4790K@4.6GHz, 4x8GB Kingston @2400MHz 11-13-14-32, Titan X, Creative X-Fi, 128+2x250GB SSDs, VPC T50 Throttle + G940, MFG Crosswinds, TrackIR 5 w/ pro clip, JetSeat, Win10 Pro 64-bit, Oculus Rift, 27"@1920x1080 Settings:2.1.x - Textures:High Terrain:High Civ.Traffic:Off Water:High VisRan:Low Heatblur:High Shadows:High Res:1920x1080 RoC:1024 MSAA:4x AF:16x HDR:OFF DefS: ON GCI: ON DoF:Off Lens: OFF C/G:390m Trees:1500m R:max Gamma: 1.5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynnux Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 (edited) Especial Bf 109 which could not pull out of high speed dive :) Large stick forces at high IAS Don't know where this myth is coming from. Finnish pilots were flying escort for their bombers diving with high speed (700+ km/h) and pulling up again. Dangerous was to pull too many G at high speed because the tailplane could break off. But anyways this is a FW-190 thread... Btw. the official top speed of the 109 was 750 km/h. The K model could already almost fly this speed when going level. Was it just able to fly straight at top speed because the stick forces were oh so high ? Edited September 18, 2020 by Lynnux Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amazingme Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 Don't know where this myth is coming from. Finnish pilots were flying escort for their bombers diving with high speed (700+ km/h) and pulling up again. Dangerous was to pull too many G at high speed because the tailplane could break off. But anyways this is a FW-190 thread... Btw. the official top speed of the 109 was 750 km/h. The K model could already almost fly this speed when going level. Was it just able to fly straight at top speed because the stick forces were oh so high ? You should make a difference between IAS and TAS. The 109 suffered from very high stick forces @ speeds over 720 km/h IAS. Otherwise, the controls were very responsive, even at low speeds due to the automatic slats. Specs: Asus Z97 PRO Gamer, i7 4790K@4.6GHz, 4x8GB Kingston @2400MHz 11-13-14-32, Titan X, Creative X-Fi, 128+2x250GB SSDs, VPC T50 Throttle + G940, MFG Crosswinds, TrackIR 5 w/ pro clip, JetSeat, Win10 Pro 64-bit, Oculus Rift, 27"@1920x1080 Settings:2.1.x - Textures:High Terrain:High Civ.Traffic:Off Water:High VisRan:Low Heatblur:High Shadows:High Res:1920x1080 RoC:1024 MSAA:4x AF:16x HDR:OFF DefS: ON GCI: ON DoF:Off Lens: OFF C/G:390m Trees:1500m R:max Gamma: 1.5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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