I Have Been Corrupted

Until recently, the Su-27 was my favorite aircraft to fly (I also liked the MiG-29S and F-15C). However, I just got into the Mirage 2000C, and I have turned from my ways. I have been corrupted. I have a new favorite aircraft to fly! Oh, the shame...:cry:;):)

She is a beaut to fly, and turns like nothing else - except maybe those pesky F-5's!

Until recently, the Su-27 was my favorite aircraft to fly (I also liked the MiG-29S and F-15C). However, I just got into the Mirage 2000C, and I have turned from my ways. I have been corrupted. I have a new favorite aircraft to fly! Oh, the shame...:cry:;):)

Then you need to change your signature picture :D

Then you need to change your signature signature picture :D

Lol.

Man... I'm really trying to not spend much more money with flight sims (which means DCS).

But reading threads like this makes it difficult - come on I've just spent money in Nevada map 2 days ago.

When I bought the Hornet last November or so, I was indecise between that and the Mirage...

(But then I kept seeing several reports of its devs not finishing several stuff.)

Now I keep reading these threads where I see several people praising its maneuverability characteristics - which is a major factor of interest in jet fighters, for me.

Even @FlankerMan seems to have been conquered by the Mirage!

And also amusing (and informative) threads like this: :lol:

https://forums.eagle.ru/forumdisplay.php?f=322

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=177149&page=21

I thought that being it a delta wing design, almost "obligatorily" it would be somewhat disadvantaged at low speeds, specially against the Hornet.

But reading here I see that maybe it isn't so.

So I'll start by asking: is the Hornet's higher STR enough to deal with the Mirage's higher ITR ?

For the ones who have flown them both, do you feel that one of them is more "handyicapped" in BFM than the other ?

Thank you.

So, anyone?

If you ask for BVR Handicap, the Mirage has a disadvantage against the Hornet there. The range of the Super 530 Radar misile is pretty short and not fire and forget. An Amraam has a greater kill range and is to some extend fire and forget if I remember correctly.

Our dogfight testings between those two showed that the Mirage is a beast and very hard to beat in a Hornet. For me right now only Mirage, sexy, fast, see it as a european F 16 just almost 5 years younger.

BVR ? only experience M2K pilot could win against fully armed A2A Hornet.

WVR magic vs aim-9x ? Hornet clearly have the advantage

WVR guns only ? I'd say its equal then its depend on how good the pilot handling the jet.

I'd buy the Hornet over M2K without hesitation. Its multirole and developed by ED itself.

Don't forget the carrier fun with the Hornet!

BVR ? only experience M2K pilot could win against fully armed A2A Hornet.

 

WVR magic vs aim-9x ? Hornet clearly have the advantage

 

WVR guns only ? I'd say its equal then its depend on how good the pilot handling the jet.

 

I'd buy the Hornet over M2K without hesitation. Its multirole and developed by ED itself.

Let's match these two airframes in their respective time frame. The Hornet actually depicted in DCS is a 21st century aircraft, I don't see the point to compare it to a 80s/90s aicraft.

Let's match these two airframes in their respective time frame. The Hornet actually depicted in DCS is a 21st century aircraft, I don't see the point to compare it to a 80s/90s aicraft.

There were more upgrades to the Hornet yes but the timeframe these two jets went into service is pretty much the same.

Go for the Mirage :-)

By 1997 the Mirage 2000-5 was put into service. By now Link 16 and Fox 3.

Mirage 2000-5 can even launch Mica IR at BVR range (no warning for the target).

But we don't have it, like we don't have MiG-29SMT, Su-30SM/ Su-35 or over upgraded gen 4 fighters.

If you just want to be competitive on MP servers, yes, get the Hornet with all the latest toys.

But during the Cold War, most fighters were using Fox 1.

F/A-18 and F-15 were using AIM-7M and AIM-9M during Desert Storm. :smilewink:

As someone who owns the hornet (and F-14), while the crazy carrier ops and great BVR performance is cool, there's just something about the Mirage which is really fun. It can pull G's like an F-16 (maybe the flight model isn't perfect but it's fun), and I like the quirky avionics such as the way the autopilot works. The auto-ILS landing feature is pretty cool, and for the time period (before upgrades to 4th generation fighters), the S530 is a pretty good missile.

Plus, the campaign is REALLY good, Baltic Dragon did an amazing job with it. I don't think anyone could be disappointed flying this plane. Despite being Fly-By-Wire, it has a lot of character.

As someone who owns the hornet (and F-14), while the crazy carrier ops and great BVR performance is cool, there's just something about the Mirage which is really fun. It can pull G's like an F-16 (maybe the flight model isn't perfect but it's fun), and I like the quirky avionics such as the way the autopilot works. The auto-ILS landing feature is pretty cool, and for the time period (before upgrades to 4th generation fighters), the S530 is a pretty good missile.

 

Plus, the campaign is REALLY good, Baltic Dragon did an amazing job with it. I don't think anyone could be disappointed flying this plane. Despite being Fly-By-Wire, it has a lot of character.

The plane can fly quite aggressively :smilewink:

https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3886548&postcount=191

Thank you everyone for your insight.

If you ask for BVR Handicap, the Mirage has a disadvantage against the Hornet there. The range of the Super 530 Radar misile is pretty short and not fire and forget. An Amraam has a greater kill range and is to some extend fire and forget if I remember correctly.

 

Our dogfight testings between those two showed that the Mirage is a beast and very hard to beat in a Hornet. For me right now only Mirage, sexy, fast, see it as a european F 16 just almost 5 years younger.

BVR ? only experience M2K pilot could win against fully armed A2A Hornet.

 

WVR magic vs aim-9x ? Hornet clearly have the advantage

 

WVR guns only ? I'd say its equal then its depend on how good the pilot handling the jet.

 

I'd buy the Hornet over M2K without hesitation. Its multirole and developed by ED itself.

This is the kind of details I'm also looking into.

Always paid particular attention to energy / turn performance in jet fighters.

Let's say that if I was into WW2 fighters - probably my favourite would be a Mitsubishi Zero... or something that could turn better than the average.

(And I know - a fighter isn't just turn performance.)

Never tried multliplayer yet, so my experiences in the Hornet and MiG-29 vs the Mirage 2000 C and 2000-5 were always against the AI.

By the way, does Razbam plan to modify the actual Mirage flight model that some people claim it's too "powerful", or do they consider it to be truth with reality ?

Please look at the thread I pointed above, especially the end.

A lot of people have wrong expectations about delta wing, because of F-106 or Mirage III or whatever.

Overall it's close to what it should do, or at least what we know.

A guy* tested sustained turn rate and it was lower than Hornet or Tomcat with higher thrust to weight ratio, only instantaneous turn rate was slightly higher. So we are in line with what is expected.

[Edit]:*Hummingbird :thumbup:

Bought it yesterday and what a bird ! Love it already.

Please look at the thread I pointed above, especially the end.

A lot of people have wrong expectations about delta wing, because of F-106 or Mirage III or whatever.

 

Overall it's close to what it should do, or at least what we know.

 

A guy tested sustained turn rate and it was lower than Hornet or Tomcat with higher thrust to weight ratio, only instantaneous turn rate was slightly higher. So we are in line with what is expected.

Oh you mean this, (at post #203) ?

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=177149&page=21

Thank you.

Oh you mean this, (at post #203) ?

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=177149&page=21

 

Thank you.

Especially this one

https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3887339&postcount=196

But overall, from #191 :smilewink:

Clarifying!

Interesting feedback from a former tomcat pilot

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/27889/confessions-of-a-navy-f-14-fleet-pilot-turned-f-5-aggressor

I remember being amazed at the lack of proficiency and proper weapons employment from their F-16 pilots. When we were in the Persian Gulf, we had a week where we fought the Emirati Mirage 2000-5 pilots. They were actually quite aggressive pilots who displayed a keen awareness of the tactics to employ against the weaknesses of the F-14A. They would jam to the merge, then pull 9Gs, flying so high we almost lost sight. If we did, they would tag us with a heater (infrared short-range guided missile). But if you could survive the first merge to employ follow-on BFM, they became easy prey.

Yep, "jam to the merge", Vs powerful AWG-9, it tells you something about Mirage ECM.

(ok, it isn't the same on Emiratis Mirage 2000-9 [Qataris use Mirage 2000-5] and French Mirage 2000C).

But currently in DCS, any fighter burns through Mirage ECM around 20Nm, still in BVR !