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Which Tornado do you want?


CyMPAK

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Is there even anything to discuss here - definitely not the ADV F2 standard - they came with blue circle radar (concrete ballast - not joking for the first few years). The stage 1 radar was appalling and struggled to track anything that turned.

 

It was only marginal post stage 2+ radar, so even in the Gulf war 91 it didn't even have NCTR so couldn't even operate at the front. Even in the late 90's it had TWS but in order to engage it had to lock STT target and provide terminal guidance to skyflash - thus losing the TWS picture, stored on screen but effectively outdated and a guessing game for the crew. Only in the very late F3 with Stage 3 was it up to a standard. Best British radar at the time was in the Sea Harrier - Blue Vixon - however i doubt this would be modelled or source data available due to it going on to form the CAPTOR (Eurofighter).

 

Please lets not have the ADV, the tomcats AWG9 would chew it up - however the IDS.....GR4 would be a dream, and a blast especially given Heatblur's amazing multicrew experience like the 14!

 

I would also like to see the F-111 if the Tornado cannot be done!

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IF GR1 then definitely JP233....however thankfully i don't think ED would map the reduced impact on desert runways / PG map.

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Can someone tell me the differences between GR.1 and IDS? I thought they were the same version with different nomenclatures.

Sure: https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=2924544&postcount=70 :)

In short: IDS (Interdiction Strike) is the interdiction (ground attack) variant of the Tornado while GR.1 is the british designation for their first version (meaning: not upgraded) of this variant.


Edited by QuiGon

Intel i7-12700K @ 8x5GHz+4x3.8GHz + 32 GB DDR5 RAM + Nvidia Geforce RTX 2080 (8 GB VRAM) + M.2 SSD + Windows 10 64Bit

 

DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing!

 

Tornado3 small.jpg

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Can someone tell me the differences between GR.1 and IDS? I thought they were the same version with different nomenclatures.

 

Hey, I don't know all of them, but a few.

 

First you have to understand that the British like to use their own way of designation.

 

Example: Take a Volkswagen Golf, generation three (1993-1998 or so).

In Germany, people will say "Golf three".

In the UK people say something like "Golf Mk. three" (Mk. stands for mark)

I understand it as a way of clearly stating the generation of something.

 

The GR1 is their first iteration of an IDS Tornado, or Tornado in genreal, because the row is like that: GR1, F2, F3, GR4.

So in full something like "GR1 IDS", where the "GR" more or less stands for the role "IDS" (InterDiction Strike).

Its their way of describing the role, like the US with F-111, A-10, SR-71, and all those letters as role designation.

 

Now to the differences.

The planes were very similar across the nations in the early days.

One big difference was the additional fuel tank the British GR1s had in the fin (vertical stabilizer).

As of my knowledge it holds approximately 500kg of extra fuel, so the British could hold up to 5300kg whereas the other two nations birds were at 4800kg of internal fuel.

 

Another difference was the SMS (Stores Management System, where you configure and select the stores) where Germany had a "digital" one and the British birds had a pretty easy/standard one

 

A third notably difference is the "Laser Range Finder & Marked Target Seeker" (LRMTS).

Its the right hand sensor (Note that the FLIR on the left side came only with the GR4) and does what it says.

It was not able to designate a target for a guided bomb run.

 

There are possibly other A/C specific differences, for example the British later on used two small stub-pylons per inboard wing station, whereas the other nations used only one per side.

 

And then there is the different stores of course.

The British used dual carriers for their iron bombs, so they could fly with 8 instead of 4, or 5.

They sometimes used bigger external fuel tanks (2250L vs. 1500L), although Germany had those big ones as "single use, war time, drop tanks", but never used them as of my knowledge.

The UK had a target designation pod quite some time earlier than the other nations. The TIALD was operational used in the 90s already.

The list goes on.

I guess the different stores which were used are already stated by QuiGon and are also described on wikipedia.

 

https://www.tornadosig.com/variants.html


Edited by Bananabrai

Alias in Discord: Mailman

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>Another difference was the SMS (Stores Management System, where you configure and select the stores) where Germany had a "digital" one and the British birds had a pretty easy/standard one

 

Not "pretty easy' according to the book I'm reading at the moment "Tornado Over the Tigris" he frequently describes how over complicated it is and how it is too easy to mess up the settings in the short time between IP and the target and not have the bomb release.

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sorry to intervene, but do we have any indication that Heatblur will do the Tornado next? I really hope for that to be true, but is there any clue for that thread to exist?

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Only good thing with tornadoes was the low level interdiction missions. When these were reduced it had very little going for it really to make it interesting in a sim.

 

 

Forgot the twin seater feature. Amount of A2G weapons and the emotions that are connected with the people who have been watching it flying since childhood.

 

 

If a F-86 is a plane of interest a Tornado will certainly be. My opinion.

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Forgot the twin seater feature. Amount of A2G weapons and the emotions that are connected with the people who have been watching it flying since childhood.

 

 

If a F-86 is a plane of interest a Tornado will certainly be. My opinion.

 

We are all only voicing opinions here. I want to see one of the earlier versions screaming down low with its older weaponry in dcs instead of another bombtruck Lasing and SEADing everything . As for feelings yeah I get that.

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Or the Viggen..... ;)

 

The Viggen was the only strike aircraft of the time to perform the task with a single pilot, the first with a nav computer and a hud. Its arguably the best aircraft of its time. It can do what the tornado, F111 and SU24 did with single crew, land on a highway and do it again in half an hour. Far from an example of a less interesting airframe that’s simply nice to have.

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The Viggen was the only strike aircraft of the time to perform the task with a single pilot, the first with a nav computer and a hud. Its arguably the best aircraft of its time. It can do what the tornado, F111 and SU24 did with single crew, land on a highway and do it again in half an hour. Far from an example of a less interesting airframe that’s simply nice to have.

I'm not talking about inovation. I'm talking about the task this aircraft was designed for and that's the same as for the AJS37. You think the tornado is a less interesting airframe? Ok - that's your opinion no problem but absolutely not mine ;).

I want to see one of the earlier versions screaming down low with its older weaponry in dcs

And which aircraft are you talking about? Buccaneer? Javelin (appart from it's fighter role)? Hunter? Thud? Su-17? I'm just curious ;)


Edited by Gizmo03
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I would rather see the old forgotten SEPECAT Jaguar which were replaced by Tornado.

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Only good thing with tornadoes was the low level interdiction missions. When these were reduced it had very little going for it really to make it interesting in a sim.

:huh:

 

The Tornado covers pretty much the entire spectrum of A-G warfare:

 

  • Low level interdiction bombing (high drag bombs as well as its special cluster munitions JP-233 and MW-1 it was famous for)
  • Medium - high level precision bombing (Paveways and JDAMs)
  • SEAD (ALARM and HARM)
  • ASuW (Sea Eagle and Kormoran)
  • Stand Off Strikes (Storm Shadow and Taurus)
  • BAI/tank hunting (Brimstone)
  • CAS (whatever weapon is necessary including internal guns)

And this all is just the Tornado IDS. On top of that it also has limited A-A capabilities.

But what the Tornado has going that actually makes it interesting for me personally is not its weapons, but it's onboard systems and the crew coordination, especially in its classic low level interdiction role.


Edited by QuiGon

Intel i7-12700K @ 8x5GHz+4x3.8GHz + 32 GB DDR5 RAM + Nvidia Geforce RTX 2080 (8 GB VRAM) + M.2 SSD + Windows 10 64Bit

 

DCS Panavia Tornado (IDS) really needs to be a thing!

 

Tornado3 small.jpg

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:huh:

 

The Tornado covers pretty much the entire spectrum of A-G warfare:

 

  • Low level interdiction bombing (high drag bombs as well as its special cluster munitions JP-233 and MW-1 it was famous for)
  • Medium - high level precision bombing (Paveways and JDAMs)
  • SEAD (ALARM and HARM)
  • ASuW (Sea Eagle and Kormoran)
  • Stand Off Strikes (Storm Shadow and Taurus)
  • BAI/tank hunting (Brimstone)
  • CAS (whatever weapon is necessary including internal guns)

And this all is just the Tornado IDS. On top of that it also has limited A-A capabilities.

But what the Tornado has going that actually makes it interesting for me personally is not its weapons, but it's onboard systems and the crew coordination, especially in its classic low level interdiction role.

 

Exactly what I said. Plenty of SEAD, paveways and jdams around already.

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