How to correctly lock with the AGM-65E?

I've loaded up some AGM-65Es and a TGP, nothing more. After take-off, I made sure that both the Maverick and TGP are on the same laser code (1111 in this case). After that, I've locked something on the ground and made the laser combat ready. Then I selected my Mavericks and uncaged them. The yellow or greenish crosshair appears and the U on the HUD tells me that it's uncaged. After that, I've fired the laser.

The weird thing comes now: After firing my laser, the Maverick locks onto the Laser BUT not where I'm aiming at but rather locks a point in the sky. In order to make sure that it's not just a display error, I've launched both Mavericks and both of them just went up in the sky and then flew perfectly straight into the nowhere. I've also checked if there is any plane interfering with the laser but as there were only Flankers and Eagles around, it should have been good.

Did I make a mistake or is the AGM-65E not working yet?

Same issue, I think we got a bugged one sadly.

The AGM-65E cannot be used when your own aircraft is lasing. Also Razbam said the AGM-65E was bugged and it was up to ED to fix it but they managed to make it work so i don't understand that.

Strange. That last Harrier pilot I talked to told me you should find the target being lased, and then lase it yourself for self guidance. He said you never rely on outside lasing for Mavericks.

I hope this might help.....Cheers :thumbup:

My bad then, i read that in the maverick update video from razbam, i might have misunderstood that.

https://fr-fr.facebook.com/RazbamSims/videos/1702770763142888/

Strange. That last Harrier pilot I talked to told me you should find the target being lased, and then lase it yourself for self guidance. He said you never rely on outside lasing for Mavericks.

There are different variants of the AGM-65E. The one RAZBAM or ED will model into DCS World would be the AGM-65E2 which can rely on the the aircraft's laser.

I fired 18 LMAVs today, using a Predator with auto-lase script. 14 of those hit their target; the other 4 missed.

The AGM-65E cannot be used when your own aircraft is lasing. Also Razbam said the AGM-65E was bugged and it was up to ED to fix it but they managed to make it work so i don't understand that.

Strange. That last Harrier pilot I talked to told me you should find the target being lased, and then lase it yourself for self guidance. He said you never rely on outside lasing for Mavericks.

For as long as the AGM-65E has been around, it has not been reliable to self-lase for various reasons and has always relied on either a buddy-lase from your wingman or a third-party lase from a JTAC/JFO. My understanding is that when self-designating you ran a high risk of the exhaust plume either washing out the Litening pod image and breaking lock, or masking the laser from hitting the target when the weapon is critically looking for the spot.

You'll notice in the Flight Syllabus Guide floating around that there is no self-designating LMAV Attack profile - the only example given is a buddy-lase for a reason.

There wasn't a lot of impetus to change this for many years because having a JTAC hosting your weapon for you speeds up the correlation process in close air support (the weapon's primary use case), and the firing platform not having to continue driving toward the target for the duration of the slow missile's time of flight was seen as a good thing. The firer can stay more distant from a possible threat, and the guys on the ground are sure that the weapon will hit the target they intended it to.

In 2014 they began developing the AGM-65E2 which when combined with aircraft and Litening pod software upgrades provided a self-designation capability. The Air Force is following suit with the AGM-65L.

It's possible that the Harrier pilot referenced is too new to understand that this used to be a problem, and too inexperienced to understand the potential benefits of relying on outside lasers for Mavericks.

Luckily, the DCS engine doesn't cause the AGM-65E the same problems it faced in real life so you can self-lase to your heart's content.

I've loaded up some AGM-65Es and a TGP, nothing more. After take-off, I made sure that both the Maverick and TGP are on the same laser code (1111 in this case). After that, I've locked something on the ground and made the laser combat ready. Then I selected my Mavericks and uncaged them. The yellow or greenish crosshair appears and the U on the HUD tells me that it's uncaged. After that, I've fired the laser.

 

The weird thing comes now: After firing my laser, the Maverick locks onto the Laser BUT not where I'm aiming at but rather locks a point in the sky. In order to make sure that it's not just a display error, I've launched both Mavericks and both of them just went up in the sky and then flew perfectly straight into the nowhere. I've also checked if there is any plane interfering with the laser but as there were only Flankers and Eagles around, it should have been good.

 

Did I make a mistake or is the AGM-65E not working yet?

Try using a different laser code. I found it to be more reliable when NOT using 1111.

I've had great success self lasing and hitting the target. Trying to use a Reaper as a JTAC though, and the missile just misses every time. It looks like the Reaper is lasing the ground as it rotates around the target, rather than the actual tank.

Do it yourself, and you get a prize every time. :thumbup:

I am about 80% sure the TGP laser is bugged at the moment.

Just done with 3 hrs of testing on the new map. with a few findings

1. Laser wont track unless its in point track mode. Area track seems to be 50:50 if will track or not.

2. Laser spot will some times be stuck even if the laser user is not there any more, it happen a few times when the designation aircraft was shot down while the laser was on. It created what we suspect to be a permanent laser spot.

3. Laser will lock a random fast moving object we call it the UFO, it will be no where close to the spot. we where only able to notice that using scope on the 65E.

4. Laser will some times spot the lasing aircraft, even if it has clear LOS on the target "we had 10 out of 30 GBU12 drops from a M2k trying to chase the lasing AV8b"

5. Laser does not appear to work with any consistency over 10nm, we got some shots on target if you lase at under 10nm and drag it to 13nm "ish" but I would say that was about 10% of the time with GBU12, with the 65E the missile will self distruct or turn randomly chasing another gohst laser spot.

From some of the guys that fly the A10c "i dont" they said that this bug was around before in 1.5 with the same strange stuff going on.

I hope this gets fixed, the inconsistency with laser in Mplayer is frustrating, of the top of my head 30% hits,30% did not track at all, 30% chased a phantom laser spots or the aircraft thats lasing even if lasing aircraft is not even remotely in the FOV of the GBU/65E, I am talking about doing 90 degree turns and pitching up.

we had about a 20% chance for the menue to bug out on the 65E "aka it wont uncage" so you have to turn on and off the pylons and the TGP to get it to work and even then its not 100% sure to work. we did a few server restarts, ping was decent 130ms max, and a few client restarts

Edit "This was Purely a test for Buddy lasing", Self lasing works about 90% of the time

Just reporting here:

I just had a perfect flight with them. Had 4 65-E's loaded. Fired all four on one pass ( several second break in between) I was able to move the TGP and Laser onto all four targets and destroy them all! it works well. That last one was a little tough because I need practice, but no issues found :)

Same issue, I think we got a bugged one sadly.

I can confirm it's not bugged at all, you need point and not area lasing and of course better mastering

I can confirm it's not bugged at all, you need point and not area lasing and of course better mastering

Point tracking and Area tracking should not have any effect on the missile performance as it needs to track the laser spot despite it being on a point/area.

At the moment the point track "and you are right it works well 80%ish with point track under 9nm, the missile should have a range grater than 12nm depending on alt and weather" But that seems to indicate a gamy solution and not an actual simulation to how Laser tracking works.

Other issue it seems there is phantom laser spots that do not go away even if the designating aircraft is gone.

How to correctly lock with the AGM-65E?

I’ve had success using area track self lasing . I think the problem is using code 1111. I’ve always used 1688. And the TGP isn’t bugged. I’ve used both 65E and GBU12 in the same mission. Both 100% effect.

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Some questions if I may:

- is the 65E fire and forget?

- does the 65E require the target to be to the front of the aircraft?

Some questions if I may:

- is the 65E fire and forget?

- does the 65E require the target to be to the front of the aircraft?

1. No, it tracks by laser detection

2. Yes to detect the laser energy to track and be fired within the launch keyhole

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Some questions if I may:

- is the 65E fire and forget?

Once, locked on the laser spot, the launching aircraft can fire and break away. If not self lasing, you can forget about the missile, as it'll track the JTAC's laser.

- does the 65E require the target to be to the front of the aircraft?

Yes, for the scan and AGM-65E launch.

If self lasing with the TPOD, you can break to the side keeping the target at distance and continue lasing until impact.

1. No, it tracks by laser detection

2. Yes to detect the laser energy to track and be fired within the launch keyhole

 

 

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Once, locked on the laser spot, the launching aircraft can fire and break away. If not self lasing, you can forget about the missile, as it'll track the JTAC's laser.

 

 

Yes, for the scan and AGM-65E launch.

If self lasing with the TPOD, you can break to the side keeping the target at distance and continue lasing until impact.

 

That's true. I forgot about buddy lasing.

1) Yes and no.

2) See above.

It's a bit off-topic, but I'm a bit unsure as to what the benefits of the laser-guided MAV is, it would seem the regular mavs would be more practical as you can fire several in a row with having to stay locked on a target with the laser.

I'm probably missing something.

Buddy lasing, fire and forget.

Buddy lasing, target search dont needed.

Precision on moving targets.

I wondered the same thing.

I assume it's so that IRL ground forces with better eyes on the target can designate.

The only other thing I could think of was moving targets. Once you fire an D/G/H/K you have to rely on internal tracking. Having control over the guidance until impact may be more reliable in certain situations by removing the chance of losing point-lock mid-flight?

But in general I agree with you. All things being equal, I'd stick to the D/G/H/K varients.

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BTW what's the max fire distance of LMAV?

Lasers are going to offer better precision in general than something that's optically or infrared guided, moving target or stationary.

Force correlate isn't the hack in real life that it is in DCS, so LMAVs also offer a more distant acquisition range, whereas with IR/CCD Mavericks you're typically well within the kinematic range of the missile by the time you get a good track.

But also, rippling off a handful of air-to-ground missiles in a single pass isn't something done in reality so I don't think that was ever a consideration.