Night - not so dark? (Rift)

i think NTTR in 2.1 looks much much better at night and dawn/dusk in VR. I don't see the banding like before.

 

Anyone else given it a try?

Yes I just did a whole bunch of tests with night flying in VR over the weekend and again last night after trying some tweaks and I am not sure how you are not seeing the banding and graphic issues we all seem to see.

I have no issue with color banding during the day. But night in VR in DCS is unusable in my opinion. I have made comments in several posts about it and how it needs to be worked on. The brown and purple splotches are all over the place. Last night I tested setting time at 11pm,12am,1am, should have no sun then, sure enough there is a glowing horizon like it is late dusk. Stars are way too big. They are as big as street lamps and flash/twinkle. And finally, all ground(street lamps, airport, etc) and plane(nav, interior, gear/landing) lights need to be reworked. They employ that cotton ball halo/looks like a physical globe or cone effect that just looks terrible in VR and even out of VR. Also, currently the ocean in Normandy glows, yes it glows now, however the ground no longer does as much as it does in 1.5. Also, in Normandy all trees turn red/burgandy as well at night.

So...yeah. No night flying in VR though I want too badly.

By the way I own a Rift and a Vive and night is the same for both. I also have a GearVR and Nolo coming soon for it so will try to run DCS through it to see if it gives a better result at night.

I wish someone at ED took a look at X-Plane 11 with Flyinside. Night looks amazing in that in VR. I just wish someone at ED would take some time to fix some of this. I am sure some of it can be. Hopefully one day. I want to do night ops and night carrier landings in VR. But right now, it is just too terrible to really fly at night in VR

PLEASE ED, look at VR at night, PLEASE work on fixing some of these issues. VR users really are limited to Day and Dusk/Dawn flying...except maybe capthaltl from the sound of it. Which kinda baffles me..lol

Improving Night time performance in VR...PLEASE ED!

nevermind..lol

I look forward to seeing if this helps the issues that exist. Would be great if so certainly. Just the issue is this will most likely adjust gamma for everything, which may not be the exact type of fix needed to address the issues. Looking forward to trying the function though to see. I kinda would have hoped, someone at ED, actually has a VR set to test this with and we would know for sure if it fixes it. Sounds like it will be up to us to learn if so upon release.

Maybe ED could pull a VR user into their fold to assist if VR isn't really available to test with internally. I just assumed ED had a couple Vives and Rifts at their studios for testing purposes. But have since heard that may not be the case.

I've looked for the gamma option but doesn't seem to be there. I guess it's not available yet?

I've looked for the gamma option but doesn't seem to be there. I guess it's not available yet?

Not yet, I am hoping for next update.

In addition, in2.1, I noticed that the mon do not generate lighting, opposite with 2.0 and 1.5 versions. Full mon nights seems very strange now, also the mon does not generates any reflect in wáter.

I flew NTTR in the dark the other night, it looks so much better IMO than before. I made a video but the Rift does not lend itself to watchable gameplay :(

Gamma option will fix this

I flew NTTR in the dark the other night, it looks so much better IMO than before. I made a video but the Rift does not lend itself to watchable gameplay :(

Unfortunately the view depicted on the monitor while in VR does not reflect in any way how it renders in the HMD. Night in DCS looks fine on my monitors as well for the most part.

So Cibit are you saying that in the Rifts actual display you do not see odd splotches all over the sky and the horizon glow long after it should be gone or the giant stars and fuzzy/oversized ground lights, glowing terrain/ocean? I have 2 buddies, one with Rift one with Vive who DCS and they both see what I see when they try night flying in VR.

But you don't at all?

I've not noticed any improvement. I could live with the silly looking sky, but I can't stand the ground looking like it's bathed in moonlight so bright you can fly VFR at 50ft. I think you're right: a gamma option is a crutch for a bigger issue.

This feature will ultimately fix the problem

This feature will ultimately fix the problem

Thank you very much for this video Jabbers. It looks like it will certainly help the situation. I look forward to trying it.

As my main issues are with night flying in VR I am curious if this does indeed address the issues with the sky banding/color splotches and horizon still being lit up at 1am? Could you confirm those behaviors are affected by this adjustment?

Also, my concern is things like in your video that starts at the 5:15 mark. DCS for some reason makes their ground lights look like giant fuzzy balls. Take a look at a the pic below. This is from your video at 5:16. Look at the runways lights. They are just fuzzy white lines. I mean I do not see why DCS renders runway/ground/aircraft lights as they choose too. This big ball of blur that ends up running into the next big ball of light blur that then becomes theses giant fuzzy light lines that look even worse in VR than they do in the pic below. I mean in the pic below, the white lines on either side of the runways together equal the width of the runway itself almost(which for an international airport runways is on avg 262 ft or so, meaning the lights are scaling at crazy sizes in the game). This really needs to be changed because they look terrible I am sorry to say even in 2d monitor view.

If one looks at how the lights appear, I have to ask the question, does this look right to anyone else? Maybe you could use some of your influence to get these on the soon to be fixed list. I have not ever heard anyone from ED say "yeah, these need to be fixed and are on a list of to be addressed". I think the entire community would benefit from tweaking how DCS renders their lights and it would make a huge improvement in the environment at night. And hopefully would not be a huge effort to do so. But thank you for the vid and the preview of the new function. I just cannot see how it will address most of the issues that exist regarding night flying but maybe I will be surprised.

I'd imagine this is a side effect of updated the PBR/Deferred rendering in 2.1, Seems like all effects/lights/etc have to be updated in some fashion, give it time.

Hi Torso sorry for the delay in answering. I am more than happy now flying in NTTR in the dark. I did do the hdmi tweak though. Replacing the rift for a monitor in the hdmi slot and tweaking the hue and saturation sliders. Then replace the rift hdmi with tweaked settings

Check this link for details :)

https://forums.oculus.com/developer/discussion/45293/tip-adjusting-color-saturation-brightness-etc-and-more-on-your-rift

I've tried the new gamma option and, while it still looks a little strange, it certainly improves things. No more 50ft flying without NVGs!

The light bleed (best description I can come up with) between very dark and very light areas is probably the biggest issue at night now, but I'm guessing this is an issue with the Rift. Any views on this one? Hopefully something future headsets can solve?!

Hi Torso sorry for the delay in answering. I am more than happy now flying in NTTR in the dark. I did do the hdmi tweak though. Replacing the rift for a monitor in the hdmi slot and tweaking the hue and saturation sliders. Then replace the rift hdmi with tweaked settings

 

Check this link for details :)

https://forums.oculus.com/developer/discussion/45293/tip-adjusting-color-saturation-brightness-etc-and-more-on-your-rift

Sorry for not replying back myself..lol. Thanks for your info. It just sounds like we are having different experiences is all.

I have done more tests since the gamma slider introduction which does allow me to help make the sky actually black which is nice to have.

I've tried the new gamma option and, while it still looks a little strange, it certainly improves things. No more 50ft flying without NVGs!

 

 

The light bleed (best description I can come up with) between very dark and very light areas is probably the biggest issue at night now, but I'm guessing this is an issue with the Rift. Any views on this one? Hopefully something future headsets can solve?!

Actually the issues DCS has at night are not present for other sims. Try out XP 11 at night, demo is free or IL-BoS. The night in those looks great with none of the issues DCS STILL suffers from. So not an issue with the Rift. It is an issue with how the game engine does night/lights in DCS and how for VR it just kinda sucks currently.

At night there is a very big "magenta shift" that occurs somehow in the game engine lighting. You can see actual magenta in the textures at night. It is like how some of the planes lighting needs to be fixed because they for some reason default to magenta since 2.1. Why magenta?

I have a VR video camera I should be getting in July that should actually allow me to record via the Rift and Vive(I own both and issues are in both so not a Rift headset issue) headsets as the eyes see it, using 2 lens so 1 for each eye lens. Perhaps I can get some vid then to post to show what I am seeing. I just am shocked others do not seem to have much issue with how night looks in VR. It kills me. I feel like I have less of a game. I want to do night ops but night just looks so crappy in VR to me.

I knew before it was released the gamma slider would not truly fix the issues at night but it does provide a crutch. Hopefully real fixes come eventually.

Sorry for not replying back myself..lol. Thanks for your info. It just sounds like we are having different experiences is all.

 

I have done more tests since the gamma slider introduction which does allow me to help make the sky actually black which is nice to have.

 

 

 

Actually the issues DCS has at night are not present for other sims. Try out XP 11 at night, demo is free or IL-BoS. The night in those looks great with none of the issues DCS STILL suffers from. So not an issue with the Rift. It is an issue with how the game engine does night/lights in DCS and how for VR it just kinda sucks currently.

 

At night there is a very big "magenta shift" that occurs somehow in the game engine lighting. You can see actual magenta in the textures at night. It is like how some of the planes lighting needs to be fixed because they for some reason default to magenta since 2.1. Why magenta?

 

I have a VR video camera I should be getting in July that should actually allow me to record via the Rift and Vive(I own both and issues are in both so not a Rift headset issue) headsets as the eyes see it, using 2 lens so 1 for each eye lens. Perhaps I can get some vid then to post to show what I am seeing. I just am shocked others do not seem to have much issue with how night looks in VR. It kills me. I feel like I have less of a game. I want to do night ops but night just looks so crappy in VR to me.

 

I knew before it was released the gamma slider would not truly fix the issues at night but it does provide a crutch. Hopefully real fixes come eventually.

Agreed, with or without gamma slider, there is no way to make the night flying look even remotely correct in VR.

Just because I got home and the little woman is now crashed I figured I would beat this horse some more with some pics. I wanted to see if other Rift/Vive users see similar.

These shots were taken on NTTR map with gamma slider at 1.3, time is like 1 am, month of June. They show what I see in my headset as they were taken through the Rift lens. They do accurately portray what I see with my eyes but obviously some detail is lost. My VR camera gets shipped tomorrow it sounds like so I will have proper 4k VR pics once it arrives for better results.

1st shot, what my monitor view of the scene looks like. Nice night time scene.

Now this is the same shot, but through my Rift lens.

You see all that magenta? See how bright that now is? Is this what other VR users see? My Rift does not have the red shift some have. Everything else looks amazing on it, Night not an issue for other titles. DCS only seems to do this. Why?

Here is the horizon still, AFTER gamma slider. It is set to 1.3 just to get a black sky. Much higher and the sky goes crazy It is better than it was for sure, but still, why does DCS do this. This is at 1am.

Another plane shot.

Also see how the stars are as big as the building lights. Anyways, I have other pics but did not turn out as well. If I set gamma to 2 or so or higher, the colors all are correct, but once again it looks like daylight at 1am.

Anyways, curious if these pics look familiar to other VR users? What is it about the DCS engine that makes it behave this way with the VR headsets? I got both Rift and Vive, they both look like this. I mean on monitor these issues do not exist really. Why in VR do they?

I don't know why DCS does this, but it's not just you.

I set gamma to 1.3. The weird colours at this setting are annoying, but I can live with that as it's no longer as bright as day. My biggest gripe now is the weird light bleed from light to dark areas, particularly when in the cockpit. Very distracting.

Well that makes me feel a bit better for sure....in a sick at least I am not alone kinda way...lol. I want you all to suffer like me..haha. Yeah the cockpit lights, bleed..etc and glass reflections are all whacked out still. The canopies can get real funky and flat plate ones like the 109 become non-transparent, so..opaque?. So many issues. Not to mention the nav and gear lights behaviors. Well I wish there was some fix for this. Maybe some will come. I have other examples where the terrain just looks wonky if you want an actual dark sky, but then a whole bunch of other issues arise. The gamma slider does not fix the issues sadly. It really sucks because DCS at night in VR could be just amazing. But so many issues exist. Even the ground lighting literally disappears at altitudes it clearly should still be visible from, airports and cities virtually dark below you until you get real close and then you can see their lights, terrain textures changing to weird colors..etc. I guess very few actually fly at night it seems from the sound of it I guess. That's too bad if so. Keeping the flame of hope alive ED really takes a look at this from a user perspective and finds a way to make night time lighting somewhat realistic. I know they got a team of some very smart and talented people. Maybe one will crack this code mystery one day.

Imagine Dubai lit up, flying the Huey around, or whatever. I want it to look amazing in VR at night. Hell, I want Vegas to look great at night in VR...anywhere at night...you get it.

But I am still gonna crap on this until it gets fixed.squeaky wheel and all...lol.

More pics to come

I just tried my first night mission in the A-10C and unfortunately I was not impressed. The colors during night time are horrible. There's a reddish glow in certain part of the sky. The light from the cockpit's controls, ect, bleed around the light sources and causes a glare on the lens. There's also a shadow or reflection on the sides of the canopy that makes it hard to see out of. I really hope this is addressed in 2.5.

Still an issue for me in 2.7.8, anyone aware of any fixes since this was posted 4yrs ago?

I also use a Rift CV1 and those screenshots is what I see.