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Flight model


Lenux

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I'd like to ask you about the flight model of MiG19

I purchased 3, 4 days ago, the F16 C

It's amazing.

My question is : does the MiG19 get close to the F16C, for flight model ?

Thank you in advance

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https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=233759

 

Never compare different aircraft to each other. Compare DCS module to the charts of the real thing. F-16C is a fly by wire with control by desired g load. MiG-19 is a second generation stick and rudder jet. Uncomparable.


Edited by Кош

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My question is : does the MiG19 get close to the F16C, for flight model ?

 

TL;DR:

 

No.

 

Detail

 

They are both early access modules :

 

• F-16C

 

The F-16C FM feels to slightly under perform ATM and some FLCS gains perhaps need tweaked.

 

There is a wealth of F-16 information available from NASA test flights, feedback from pilots and SME's, etc. to help ED get it right.

 

• MiG-19P

 

The MiG-19P feels to be over performing ATM. There were big improvements after it's release but it still feels similar to the first iterations of the M-2000C flight model in that there is further work required. Currently it perhaps has too little drag and the glide ratio is too good.

 

There isn't the same detailed information available for the MiG-19P but IMHO Razbam have shown themselves willing to iterate their flight models until they give a 'reasonable' approximation.

 

As a 'simpler' aircraft, there is less for Razbam to get wrong but systems modelling doesn't seem to be their strong point i.e. it seems strange that the 'fuel cutoff valves' need to be powered to close, as in the event of a fire, the aircraft may lose electrical power.

 

Comments

 

Any addition to Redfor's lineup is appreciated and as such, the MiG-19P is a worth while purchase.

 

It makes a good counter to the F-5E and includes Baltic Dragon's Training missions and a 10 mission campaign - when bought in a sale it is (IMHO) particularly good value (as is the M-2000C).

 

However, fun as it is, the MiG-19P is not a module to purchase "just for the flight model", rather you should look at the "value" of the whole package. YMMV.

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The MiG-19P feels to be over performing ATM.

 

It is, particularly during turns (ITR and STR), were it´s not bleeding speed as it should pass a certain G load and AOA. It also needs limitations and consequences added to the top speed limit.

 

Currently it perhaps has too little drag and the glide ratio is too good.

 

Aircraft aerodynamic deceleration parameters(-Nx) are within 2-5% of the real aircraft deceleration performance charts, both with airbrakes or without them. We are working to improve this, but right now it could be considered good enough.

 

There isn't the same detailed information available for the MiG-19P but IMHO Razbam have shown themselves willing to iterate their flight models until they give a 'reasonable' approximation.

 

We have detailed data to work on the MiG-19 flight model and this is verifiable in the current iteration available. More work is being made to shorten even more the gap between simulated and real performance.

 

but systems modelling doesn't seem to be their strong point i.e. it seems strange that the 'fuel cutoff valves' need to be powered to close, as in the event of a fire, the aircraft may lose electrical power.

 

The fuel cutoff valves need indeed electrical power. The valves charged with closing fuel flow to the engines are electro-pneumatic valves. They use compressed air from the pneumatic system to close the fuel flow. There´s a really small chance from battery power to be cut from this system.

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The fuel cutoff valves need indeed electrical power. The valves charged with closing fuel flow to the engines are electro-pneumatic valves. They use compressed air from the pneumatic system to close the fuel flow. There´s a really small chance from battery power to be cut from this system.

Yes, I've worked with similar systems but not in aeronautics - in those an electro-pneumatic valve opened a "cut off" fuel valve and would shut off the fuel in the event of a loss of air pressure / electrics (to prevent an engine runaway, etc.).

 

Obviously, you have detailed information and using some reverse logic it's possible an unintended in-flight engine shutdown was considered a greater risk by the designers.

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I purchased the aircraft, just did a quick Free Flight 10 - 15 minutes

Well, I can say, I like it so far

There is a lot of work, hopefully, they'll improve it in the future updates

Thank you

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Mirage 2000 Fuel Shut Off valve is also electricaly powered IRL, it's not strange for me.

 

Yes, but in the Mirage, the Fuel Shut Off is Open when powered, if electrical power is removed the fuel valve closes, shutting off fuel.

 

In the MiG-19P, the AB Cut Off and Oil valves are Open when unpowered.

 

In fact in "Training Mission 02. Startup from cold and dark", you are even told to turn ON the AB and Oil Cut Off circuit breakers during the cold start tutorial.

 

l2cKGd9.jpg

 

... but if you do so, the Mil Power and AB systems don't work (AFAIK the Oil system doesn't take damage / is WIP).

 

This (plus my own experience) is why it looked like a bug, if OverStratos is saying it's working as intended, I guess the training mission / voice over will need to be adjusted.

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Could anyone please, explain how to activate / release the rockets ?

I do something wrong, I think. I followed the instructions but can't make it work

Thank you

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Could anyone please, explain how to activate / release the rockets ?

I do something wrong, I think. I followed the instructions but can't make it work.

 

Check out this video

 

 

and Chuck's MiG-19P Guide, page 107

 

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1gXePAywvO6fnq6JdN-7HP-Lp7nfafwoi

 

If you still have issues, please post a track and I'll try to see what you've missed.

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I find it confusing that whilst Razbam had the flight characteristics of the S Model of the MiG-19,or so they have told us,that they chose to model the less famous P Model,which because of it's aerodynamics is quite different.

 

Would'nt it have made sense given this data available,just to have modelled the far more famous S Model,the flight model,obviously would have then been more accurate,saving themselves all sorts of headaches.

 

So,leading on from this,please Razbam,how about giving us the S Model as soon as you can.....makes sense ? thumbup.gif

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I find it confusing that whilst Razbam had the flight characteristics of the S Model of the MiG-19,or so they have told us,that they chose to model the less famous P Model,which because of it's aerodynamics is quite different.

 

Would'nt it have made sense given this data available,just to have modelled the far more famous S Model,the flight model,obviously would have then been more accurate,saving themselves all sorts of headaches.

 

So,leading on from this,please Razbam,how about giving us the S Model as soon as you can.....makes sense ? thumbup.gif

 

 

Actually, you know, it's not all that confusing if you look at it from the perspective of Razbam being rational.

 

The Mig-19p is the only variant that historically had radar and was armed with a combination of cannons and air to air missiles.

 

This loadout makes it the most fun variant to fly of the bunch, and makes it the most competitive it can be in the highly assymetric DCS environment.

 

The S didn't have radar and those models that came after the P (the PM) switched to an all A2A missile design (removing the cannons, which we all know was a briefly undertaken folly by any nation that made that move and wouldn't be all that fun to fly in DCS given the famed unreliability of that early generation of A2A missiles.)

 

So basically the S had neither radar nor even primitive A2A missiles and I got the feeling they were looking for something that was clearly a step beyond the Mig-15/F86 in terms of tech. The Mig-19p with radar and AA-2 vympels seems to be the perfect technological step up from the Mig-15 as a sort of, close enough equivalent to the American F-5e I guess.

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How does the smoke pods working ?

Could anyone explain, please ?

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