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Old 12-13-2017, 01:39 PM   #131
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Originally Posted by MikeMikeJuliet View Post
Multicrew is in the works and has had some working implemetations already. Problem is that the rear seat has so far been non-function, but this should be corrected during the 2.0 recode.

Abd yes, I've flown it multicrew on both seats.

Regards,
MikeMikeJuliet
This was a hot fix that Mike and Chris tried but at the request of ED and server owners we disabled it as it was causing crashing - again as it was an ad-hoc fix.

See the above post for the full story

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Old 12-13-2017, 07:22 PM   #132
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Originally Posted by Pman View Post
When the Hawk was first coded mutlicrew wasn't a thing in DCS - It wasn't even on the planning board, even for ED.

Hawk's base code is not compatible with multicrew and it would require probably an 80% re-write to implement multi crew for Hawk, it simply wasn't designed that way.

The amount of work required to put this into Hawk means that it is not a viable addition for Hawk so currently there are no plans to bring multicrew to Hawk.

If this ever changes I will let you all know but it is not something we are working on or plan to with the updates I have planned out for 2018.

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Old 12-13-2017, 08:36 PM   #133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pman View Post
This was a hot fix that Mike and Chris tried but at the request of ED and server owners we disabled it as it was causing crashing - again as it was an ad-hoc fix.

See the above post for the full story

Pman
How many hours of re-code would it take to bring the Hawk up to par? Thanks TC
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Old 07-27-2018, 02:17 PM   #134
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pman View Post
This was a hot fix that Mike and Chris tried but at the request of ED and server owners we disabled it as it was causing crashing - again as it was an ad-hoc fix.

See the above post for the full story

Pman
So you got it to work as a hotfix but it would require an 80 percent recode?


Can you explain that to me because I am having trouble following the logic.
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Old 07-27-2018, 02:20 PM   #135
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MikeMikeJuliet says yes..... Pman says no..... which is it?


I am leaning toward PMan since he seems to be a VEAO developer but now I am a bit confused.
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Old 07-27-2018, 04:12 PM   #136
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Seems simple enough, Hawk developed before multicrew was even a gleam in someone's eye. The "hotfix" was tried in order to satisfy customer requests. It didn't work. If anyone thinks that Pman "only seems to be a developer", something has failed during the thought process.
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Old 07-27-2018, 05:24 PM   #137
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Actually Pman works for a company that does software development. He does not write code.
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Old 07-27-2018, 06:15 PM   #138
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Originally Posted by cichlidfan View Post
Actually Pman works for a company that does software development. He does not write code.
Actually I do write code. I also run all our DCS product development, both consumer and non consumer for VEAO.

Multicrew is not in the works and is not planned, there was a temp fix posted by some old members of the team to try and do a work around but it was flawed and had to be pulled from the multiplayer environment. There are no plans to bring back multi crew to Hawk

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Old 07-28-2018, 02:45 AM   #139
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So you got it to work as a hotfix but it would require an 80 percent recode?


Can you explain that to me because I am having trouble following the logic.

Major glitch #1 - Caused server crashes whenever the second pilot was killed (which, coincidentally, was also when the first pilot was killed... such is often the case with two seaters )


Major glitch #2 - The plane was designed for you to operate from the primary pilot's seat with appropriate controls, prior to multicrew ever coming up. After the L-39, they discovered they could jury rig a back seat pilot but due to the way the plane had been originally coded, the back seat guy was "reaching through the dash" and could accidentally hit buttons etc in the front seat (or something similar). They tried a few workarounds, but combined with the whole "crashing servers" thing and sync issues (due to not having been designed as multi-seat from the outset) it would require rewriting the whole thing. Which is kinda what they're doing right now, but in a much more limited fashion.


-edit Above sourced from the discussions that took place when all this originally was announced as being aborted



It's pretty simple, the multicrew tech was a late addition to DCS and highly experimental even with the first few aircraft. The L-39 brought it out first, but it's a two-seat trainer, effectively two guys doing THE SAME JOB and only one or the other can control the aircraft at any given moment. The Gazelle was the first "true" multi-crew aircraft, and has had major issues with syncing and miscellaneous other problems.

These were both designed FROM THE OUTSET as multi-person aircraft, and yet still have design limitations or serious flaws. It's reasonable with those observations in mind, that it would be very difficult to rig it up for something that was NOT designed with it in mind from the beginning. Our first fully functional, multi-crew combat aircraft is most likely going to be the F-14... assuming it doesn't also have serious issues (but based on videos of them flying together, it seems they've worked the kinks out of the tech finally).

Is it possible to redo the Hawk for multicrew? Duh, yes, of course it is. Anything you're willing to throw time and money at is technically doable. The issue is "is it WORTH throwing time and money at?" If it takes a comparable amount of time to starting from scratch, for a module they're unlikely to recoup the investment from... meh. It's easy to see why they'd rather invest that effort into a new module, or watching paint dry, or something else productive.

Likewise, the Mi-8 and Uh-1 have multiple crew members... but prospects of that ever being re-rigged are slim to nil, also. They came to the party too late, just like the Hawk, and weren't really designed for it. Basically, virtually everything in this game is a single-seater... Even the ones that aren't.

Here's to the Tomcat!
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Old 07-29-2018, 10:40 PM   #140
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Guys,
Pete has been pretty clear on the situation with multi-crew and the issues it’s causing with server crashes on player death.

The reason it worked before was using the simple method of just telling DCS there are two players available in the aircraft.
At that time it worked but ED made a change to make it more robust for multi-crew.
With that needed change it meant that when either the front or rear player died in the Hawk the server went into a loop re-loading Hawk which was infinite, causing massive memory leaks thus causing the server crash.

Our original ASM code was written way before multi-crew came out therefore it needs a big update to make it work properly given the new method.
That’s a huge task.

With the help of a community member/developer I am looking into single player seat switching.
But, that will be looked at after I finish the new cockpit model/texture integration which I want to get out to you guys as soon as the night lighting bug is fixed which I’m working on at the moment.

Thanks,
Chris.
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