Ln's fourth jet after F-14: Mig-23 or Su-22?

There are a million threads discussing this very topic so take this there, I don't understand why a new thread is made every month or so with the same posts by the same people about the same planes

Plus I'd rather have some redundant activity in the forums then none at all. Much better then the one guy that whines about it every time.

It would really be nice. Not just from LNS, but from anyone. Western planes are great but it'd be nice to have more than just one Russian fighter that's above FC3 level to fight them with. It's kind of funny with ED being Russian and all that they seem to have little to no drive to make Russian birds. I'd have expected (and preferred) that from them even over the F/A-18. With the F-14 coming the "ultimate" heavy hitter in western aviation outside of something that will never happen like the F-22 is going to be in. We need something good from the other side someday. Even something that should be incredibly simple given what's already in, like any variant of the Flanker done properly.

There's speculation that an early su-24 might be lined up after f-18 by ED

Is that just based on the FB picture or were there other hints? Any reason for it being an early one?

Probably depends on what is ment with early.

In my mind the Basic Su-24 or the Su-24M would be the most likely (since post 2000 upgrades like the Su-24M2 would be less likely as they are more classified)

And either could be called an early version by todays standard

(with the Base Su-24 entering service in 1974 and the Su-24M in 1983)

So an early (as in not the latest) version i think would be the most likely then its just a matter if they go with the Earliest (Su-24) or the slightly later but far more capable variant (Su-24M)

Personally i would hope for a Su-24M since its FAR more capable in all areas and most of the capabilities we thinking of when we think of the Su-24 are from the Su-24M and not the base version

(Laser/Optical system allowing to self laze,The ability to use TV guided weapons, and most of the weapons it uses like the KH-25 and KH-29 etc).

Is that the same speculations that hint at a A-50? :)

That said, i'd love a Su-24!

It's going to be the A4 Skyhawk without a doubt

Okay, that's just a dream but the Mig28, the F-14 and the A4 - Jesters Dead Aha

It's going to be the A4 Skyhawk without a doubt

 

Okay, that's just a dream but the Mig28, the F-14 and the A4 - Jesters Dead Aha

A Simple A-4 is on the way from Hoggit already.

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=159823

ohh?.

 

I was simply going by the sources ive been able to find (Including Wiki etc)

 

and they had led me to believe that the first generation Mig-23s (M,MF etc) still used a radar display and that the Bis was the first that ditched the radar display.

 

If i was incorrect then i acknowledge that, i was simply going by the sources / info i had been able to find.

 

Do you know of any Sources in ENG with correct information? since i would be very interested in knowing more about the Mig-23

(as its an aircraft that i like).

mattebubben, MiG-23M, MF, ML or MLD all use the HUD as a radar display. And there is no such thing as "MiG-23Bis"

Here is a "real world" M or MF simulator:

Ad here a MLD during ground checks:

Thank you for the correction.

And this also shows the Dangers of going by Wikipedia (could not find that many other sources on the Mig-23)

This is the Quote from Wiki that got me so sidetracked.

"MiG-23bis("Flogger-G") Similar to the MiG-23P except the IRST was restored and the cumbersome radar scope was eliminated because all of the information it provided could be displayed on the new head-up display (HUD)."

And the Mig-23Bis is shown as one of the first Second Gen Mig-23s (after the Mig-23P and to my knowledge there was a Mig-23Bis it just never entered large scale production / use)

so my guess from that was that earlier aircraft used the Cumbersome radar display mentioned.

But thank you for getting me straightened out.

I knew Mig-23s used a HUD that displayed radar data i was just mistaken in what variants had it.

Yes, that is some nonesense in Wikipedia. The only MiG-23 versions with a radar scope in cockpit were S and MS, as they had the same radar as MiG-21bis (also the same optical sight). All the other versions with radar use the HUD as radar display:

M, MF, early ML, early P use ASP-23 HUD

late ML, late P, MLA, MLD use ASP-17 HUD

Viggen and Cat are top priorities right now. :)

We work many years ahead, especially since we've grown the team considerably in the past few years. I've said it before; wishlist threads are, in general, not useless-- but we already have a good indication of what is out there for us to build, and we've chosen projects based on this.

It's difficult to balance how realistic it is to build something, versus your own passion and goals.

Thank you for the correction.

 

And this also shows the Dangers of going by Wikipedia (could not find that many other sources on the Mig-23)

 

This is the Quote from Wiki that got me so sidetracked.

 

"MiG-23bis("Flogger-G") Similar to the MiG-23P except the IRST was restored and the cumbersome radar scope was eliminated because all of the information it provided could be displayed on the new head-up display (HUD)."

 

And the Mig-23Bis is shown as one of the first Second Gen Mig-23s (after the Mig-23P and to my knowledge there was a Mig-23Bis it just never entered large scale production / use)

 

 

so my guess from that was that earlier aircraft used the Cumbersome radar display mentioned.

 

But thank you for getting me straightened out.

 

I knew Mig-23s used a HUD that displayed radar data i was just mistaken in what variants had it.

I had no idea the Mig-23 got an IRST at any point. I can actually see that playing an important role on that aircraft. With cooperation from gci, a Mig-23 can use IRST to get in range for an optimal shot before even switching on its radar and exposing its presence.

Viggen and Cat are top priorities right now. :)

 

We work many years ahead, especially since we've grown the team considerably in the past few years. I've said it before; wishlist threads are, in general, not useless-- but we already have a good indication of what is out there for us to build, and we've chosen projects based on this.

 

It's difficult to balance how realistic it is to build something, versus your own passion and goals.

You guys gonna do an AMA or something at some point? I'd really like to learn which aircraft you would personally most love to see in the game - and possibly why. Paying no mind to whether it's an aircraft that LN have planned down the line or not.

You guys gonna do an AMA or something at some point? I'd really like to learn which aircraft you would personally most love to see in the game - and possibly why. Paying no mind to whether it's an aircraft that LN have planned down the line or not.

That would be a bad idea. These developers need to make contracts with the aircraft manufacturers in order to make their modules. Going out and saying "Oooh, this plane would totally be a passion project for us!" shows their hand. It's like getting excited at a car dealership. Better to play things close to the chest.

That would be a bad idea. These developers need to make contracts with the aircraft manufacturers in order to make their modules. Going out and saying "Oooh, this plane would totally be a passion project for us!" shows their hand. It's like getting excited at a car dealership. Better to play things close to the chest.

It would also be bad if they said they would like a module in dcs if not planned or on roadmap as people would say they are making it because someone on the dev team said they would like to see it in dcs.

I think they just need to stick with mentioning things on their roadmap or announcing something new that is approved.

ohh?.

 

I was simply going by the sources ive been able to find (Including Wiki etc)

 

and they had led me to believe that the first generation Mig-23s (M,MF etc) still used a radar display and that the Bis was the first that ditched the radar display.

Never use Wiki as a primary reference. It is good for starting researching about something, but not as a final say and not for reliable citations. Look what books they cite and see if you can get hold of those.

If i was incorrect then i acknowledge that, i was simply going by the sources / info i had been able to find.

I based my information on technical orders (there's none in english).

Do you know of any Sources in ENG with correct information? since i would be very interested in knowing more about the Mig-23

(as its an aircraft that i like).

Try finding Yefim Gordon's MiG-23/27 book from the Aerofax series. It is out of print and available for outrageous prices -- but the internet is a big place, with a lot to find. But take Yefim Gordon with a grain of salt. In the past, some information he provided turned out to be false or inaccurate. There's discussion about this in other threads (especially in his MiG-21 book and why it is not good to use it as only reference). Also, Yefim Gordon is probably not a real person, but a pen name for various russian writers writing/translated into english.

The best sources are technical orders/offical manuals of course... but you have to be proficent in (technical) russian/etc. to understand them, as most of them are not translated into english (or at least not shared -- see MiG-21bis manual, which was I think the translation (by an american intelligence service) of a captured arab (?) manual and was available first on the old pre-LNS MiG-21bis website)

I would go with the Mig 23.I know i saw someone tried to create one in the Mods & Apps fourm from somebody.It would be great to see you guys in Leatherneck try help his project of the Mig-23MLD,but this is wishful thinking.As for the Sukhoi Fitter series,i would like to see someone make the Su-7 & the wing swept Su-17.The Su-7 would go great in a Six-Day War setting since Razbam is already making the Mirage IIIC used by the IAF.:music_whistling:

I've try to post pdf download link on this forums.

but the moderator hates the pirate.

so, find them by yourself meatbutten.

:pilotfly:

however I've try to find the old one on amazon or ebay, but the FRA series book on that place is over 300 usd, wtf.

My hope is for a decent red aircraft. Mig23MLD will be great, Mig31/BM or MIG25PD will be amazing.

-- but we already have a good indication of what is out there for us to build, and we've chosen projects based on this.

So besides AJS-37 & F4-U, what other projects have you chosen?

Just tell us the models & please no lengthy explanations are needed ;).

My hope is for a decent red aircraft. Mig23MLD will be great, Mig31/BM or MIG25PD will be amazing.

Mig-31 is probably impossible to do. Mig-25 however would be very cool.

Never use Wiki as a primary reference. It is good for starting researching about something, but not as a final say and not for reliable citations. Look what books they cite and see if you can get hold of those.

 

 

 

I based my information on technical orders (there's none in english).

 

 

 

Try finding Yefim Gordon's MiG-23/27 book from the Aerofax series. It is out of print and available for outrageous prices -- but the internet is a big place, with a lot to find. But take Yefim Gordon with a grain of salt. In the past, some information he provided turned out to be false or inaccurate. There's discussion about this in other threads (especially in his MiG-21 book and why it is not good to use it as only reference). Also, Yefim Gordon is probably not a real person, but a pen name for various russian writers writing/translated into english.

 

The best sources are technical orders/offical manuals of course... but you have to be proficent in (technical) russian/etc. to understand them, as most of them are not translated into english (or at least not shared -- see MiG-21bis manual, which was I think the translation (by an american intelligence service) of a captured arab (?) manual and was available first on the old pre-LNS MiG-21bis website)

Thanks mate.

I generally dont rely on Wikipedia but in this instance i was unable to find anything else that had detailed information on the subject.

But again thanks for the correction and info =).

I want their next project to be an F-111E, F-111F, F-4E, F-4G or F-4J. I also recognize that there is a need for more full fidelity Russian aircraft. The MiG-21PF, Mig-23MF, MiG-23ML, MiG-23BN, MiG-27M, MiG-27K, MiG-25RBS, MiG-25BM, MiG-25PD, Su-17M3, Su-17M4, Su-15TM, Su-24M, Tu-22KD or Tu-128M.. Any of those would be nice to have in game as well.

Mig-31!! :)

i will accept any aircraft

all airplanes are glorious