[REPORTED]MIG 29S has huge bounce on landing

Dear all, we are going to take a hard look at it, it seems that our of spec landings do not have a realistic result/consequence when doing so, we will see what we need to do, as a workaround, obviously trying to land as recommended is the best way to go.

Thanks!

You were lucky. My touchdown 3 days ago end on the grass with nose in the ground and final explosion. With one death extra in my score.... disappointed

For maximum help, please include videos or tracks of your examples, it will better help us see what is going on, thanks.

Sorry I am working all the time. I will do my best. If that work, I am a honest person and all I post here is not exaggerated and the only goal is feel as good as possible with a god MiG-29 as other aircrafts in DCS do.

You can only do what you can do, I am only saying if you can, we would appreciate it, thanks!

That is all we ask as loyal MiG and DCS lovers and I will help as much as I can by posting videos and tracks of what I am experiencing

Thanks, we appreciate the support for sure!

here is another video plus track

 

observation: to me it seems like compared to the DCS Flanker on landing the MiG loads up with AOA much faster and also can develop excessive sink rate quickly if not having the pilot pay attention to it, one of the problems I have is while looking at VVI or better yet, constantly staring at it while giving managing back-pressure with stick and moving the throttles... If I don't every so often look at the AOA scale I can find it has built upto around 15 degrees AOA, sometimes I do feel buffeting warning of an approaching stall by the cockpit shake but landing the MiG seems very unforgiving unlike the Flanker. Even in the flare for landing / round out the Flanker is not building so much AOA and feels like stalling. I can hike the nose up in the Flanker without fear of excessive sink rate or AOA on the landing flare and touch the wheels down smooth and gentle as well as maintain the nose high for aerobraking.

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1qS9ajaHXDb4qOKvu53P6vUnhGnr_on-S/view?usp=sharing

 

Yes, you need to apply a lot of aft stick at flaring constantly and fast keeping AoA or attitude. Additionally you need to keep in mind that reducing throttle creates nose-down pitching moment too.

Su-27 is different plane, so it's handled in different way.

It also is not a similar landing technique as with the MiG-21 which I also fly in DCS?

 

Maybe we need training mission for MiG-29 or additional documentation added to the DCS manual?

I can not say about MiG-21... it is not ED made. :)

It is quite simple to master the landing at least to perform it safe. As you are confident in "school" landing you will be able to perform it more free.

It is exactly what is written in the manual.

1. Stabilised approach - 5 m/s sink rate at 290-300 kph.

2. Start flaring at 280-290 kph at 8-9 m (take a look at radio alt on HUD)

3. Look forward-left to check altitude and maintain touchdown attitude progressively pulling the stick. Gently retard the throttle.

4. Freeze the stick at touchdown to avoid ballooning.

As the flaring is very fast, I think, this video could help. Please pay attention to the approach parameters/attitude, flaring start and virtual stick movement (can be seen at control box window as well).

Notice the right landing attitude at touchdown.

Yo-Yo, can you comment on the nose strut behavior at 1:25 and 1:27? Shouldn't it break at those points? Should it return that much force to make the nose jump that high?

Absolutely normal. I posted L-410 cadet's landing with the same typical behavior. MiG-29 nose wheel is known as a bit bumpy by the way.

Take a look at the nose wheel: it is over the ground. The point is that there is a small water drain pit there (Kubinka) and the plane at taxiing behaves this way. I know that there is a video but I can not find it now.

https://russianplanes.net/images/to249000/248128.jpg

 

 

I wouldn't call these anywhere near comparable and the gears on the L-410 got damaged finally. If you say it's absolutely normal than case closed I guess.

I posted this video not to say the planes must demonstrate EXACT behavior. As you can see the planes are a bit different with different stability margins, for example, different wheels service limits, etc, etc.

The goal of this video is to show that progressive bouncing is absolutely normal for this situation, but of course the exact angles, rotational speed must not be the same, for sure.

MiG-29 itself has low, up to neutral at AoA higher than 15 degrees, stability and at low speed the aircraft has low ability to counteract the moments from the ground strike.

If you take a careful look to 1-28 you can see that nose wheel impulse is not a reason for a rotational acceleration as the plane hits high AoA where the plane becomes instable. DUE TO THE LOST STABILISER.

To me it seems extremely excessive, especially when watching Anatoliy land in his MiG-29 hard onto the ground. Sorry I keep bringing it up but it is the only hard MiG-29 landing I can find video of, every other pilot wants to baby it back onto the runway lol. This issue is more to do about the design of the aircraft and the landing gears, obviously it has more durable landing gear than say F-16. Also it could be some other issue in entirety like drag from flaps or other control surfaces, engine thrust, wing having too much lift effect on ground, effects of ground effect hitting the plane. Could be so many other factors involved or even multiple factors together. To me I observe like the plane wants to fall out of the sky when on landing approach, very unforgiving when you finally get close to runway and try to flare and you have such little margin of AOA and sink rate.

 

Flying the Su-27 for example I have alot of margin between the approach and flare where I don’t seem like i’m behind the power curve and going to stall the plane in the performance of the flare, in fact I don’t even need to have perfect landing approach as long as I time the flare correctly, whereas in the MiG i’m constantly fighting to keep the plane in the air and not develop excessive sink rate or AOA and stall.

This nose-down effect described as"strong" is mentioned in every manual for this plane. If you take a look at the in-cockpit video you can see the final fast stick pulling at touchdown.

Ground effect you mentioned works in both directions - it increases the lift slightly but causes nose-down pitch effect due to downwash changes.

If you find a video where the pilot holds the stick frozen at touchdown as you do or where the plane hits the ground with the nose wheel .

P.S. this is the video our L-39 and MiG-29 SME lands the plane exactly as it should be in RL. Take a look at the stick movement.

i’ll look for more and in particular with the MiG-29 airframe but here is what I found so far

 

Why not the Me-262?

first of all a delta wing MiG-21 would be far more comparable to a MiG-29 than a L-410 cargo/passenger plane considering it is a Soviet fighter jet from the very same design bureau with very similar design philosophy of combat operations.

Have you seen the difference between a clean plane and a plane with a chute? If you mean Kvochur's landing I can turn your attention to the second landing in my video. It is very close to it. And it is safe.