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430 into the huey?


acdelta57

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Love this GNS430 great piece of equipment. Just curious to know what are the chances of this bad boy being thrown into the best module of all..UH1. With GPS CDI interlink to the hueys nav system would be even more amazing :):thumbup:

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]1000 miles of road will take you around town, a 1000 feet of runway can take you around the world...unless your in a Huey, you can go anywhere with no runway in a Huey!

 

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The Huey would be a logical choice.

Why ?

  • No Garmin 430's were used in Vietnam/Korea.
  • Most civilian Huey's on the web that do have a Garmin use the older GNC250XL or a portable like the GNS696
  • This
    , uses twin GNS430 and a glass cockpit. It doesn't carry rockets or machine guns.

Part of the joy in flying DCS modules is flying with realistic instruments and learning the 'old fashion' skills needed.

 

  • The Bo-105 being developed has a very basic GPS - should it be NS430 compatible?
  • How about the Spitfire, Mi-24, AV-8, F-14 or Hornet, they don't have a GNS430 but could carry a potable GPS device today?
  • Why add a fiction when players have the F10 map and better route planning could be added to that?


Edited by Ramsay

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Why ?

  • No Garmin 430's were used in Vietnam/Korea.
  • Most civilian Huey's on the web that do have a Garmin use the older GNC250XL or a portable like the GNS696
  • This
    , uses twin GNS430 and a glass cockpit. It doesn't carry rockets or machine guns.

Part of the joy in flying DCS modules is flying with realistic instruments and learning the 'old fashion' skills needed.

 

  • The Bo-105 being developed has a very basic GPS - should it be NS430 compatible?
  • How about the Spitfire, Mi-24, AV-8, F-14 or Hornet, they don't have a GNS430 but could carry a potable GPS device today?
  • Why add a fiction when players have the F10 map and better route planning could be added to that?

 

The fact that no Huey used a Garmin 430 in any conflict doesn't mean it couldn't realisticly have this equipement in a more modern conflict, it's of course not purposely built for military use but still.

 

And you will still be able to do so by not buying or by deativating the GPS in the settings for the Huey.

 

I'd like to know how the F10 map is less fictional then a working, complex GPS unit that can be fitted to any aircraft that has space for it and the antennas ^^.

 

EDIT : SAR requires that kind of precision, and as you showed, it was used for such a purpose.


Edited by Rex854Warrior

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Why ?

  • No Garmin 430's were used in Vietnam/Korea.
  • Most civilian Huey's on the web that do have a Garmin use the older GNC250XL or a portable like the GNS696
  • This
    , uses twin GNS430 and a glass cockpit. It doesn't carry rockets or machine guns.

Part of the joy in flying DCS modules is flying with realistic instruments and learning the 'old fashion' skills needed.

 

  • The Bo-105 being developed has a very basic GPS - should it be NS430 compatible?
  • How about the Spitfire, Mi-24, AV-8, F-14 or Hornet, they don't have a GNS430 but could carry a potable GPS device today?
  • Why add a fiction when players have the F10 map and better route planning could be added to that?

 

No Garmin 430's were used in Vietnam/Korea.

- we don't simulate only vietnam/korea do we?

 

Most civilian Huey's on the web that do have a Garmin use the older GNC250XL or a portable like the GNS696

- keyword is "most"

 

This

, uses twin GNS430 and a glass cockpit. It doesn't carry rockets or machine guns.

- see, everything is possible

 

The Bo-105 being developed has a very basic GPS - should it be NS430 compatible?

- Are we talking about some buil-in GPS that comes from factory? In that case it should be compatible if it is possible IRL to make them compatible.

 

How about the Spitfire, Mi-24, AV-8, F-14 or Hornet, they don't have a GNS430 but could carry a potable GPS device today?

- We will have to see, so far noone denied or confirmed that we will get this GPS for anything else than Mi8

 

Why add a fiction when players have the F10 map and better route planning could be added to that?

- If something is fiction than it would be using F10 map, having real life GPS device which can be mounted into ANYTHING can only be more realistic

 

My opinion is that if we are implementing some standalone GPS device in Mi8, the aircraft that does not have it from stock, it should be available for every other aircraft.

That would be "logical choice" for me.


Edited by cicimicikiller

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Agreed. ^ and for the realsism aspect just don't activate it in the Huey module. I'm ALL for realism. And I would much rather have a 430 unit then look at the F10 map. The best part about the Garmon 430 unit is that it can be placed literally in almost any aircraft in real world. And wth the Huey having native VOR/LOC capability it would make even more sense to have a Garmin talking to that instead of an mi8 Doppler thingymajig lol

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]1000 miles of road will take you around town, a 1000 feet of runway can take you around the world...unless your in a Huey, you can go anywhere with no runway in a Huey!

 

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Why ?

  • No Garmin 430's were used in Vietnam/Korea.

 

The Huey is a post-Korean War aircraft and our specific Huey is in a 1980s configuration IIRC. So that makes Vietnam/Korea rather irrelevant in this discussion.

 

  • Most civilian Huey's on the web that do have a Garmin use the older GNC250XL or a portable like the GNS696

 

But we're not discussing which GPS would be a good choice for the Huey but rather, which aircraft would be a good choice for the set we already have. A GNS 400 for example would make more sense for the Hip, since the COM/NAV controls and screen real estate of the 430 are effectively wasted. Or a 155XL which was installed on Polish Mi-17-1Vs.

 

  • This
    , uses twin GNS430 and a glass cockpit. It doesn't carry rockets or machine guns.

 

And how does this support not putting the NS 430 we have on our Huey? I don't understand.

 

Part of the joy in flying DCS modules is flying with realistic instruments and learning the 'old fashion' skills needed.

 

The entirely optional GPS set doesn't prevent you from doing any of that. At the same time, somebody else might find joy in learning the ins and outs of the GPS set in their favourite aircraft.

 

  • Why add a fiction when players have the F10 map and better route planning could be added to that?

 

Because using the F10 map is 100x more immersion breaking than having a realistically recreated GPS set that - even if it hasn't been done IRL or not very often - can be realistically installed on a Huey with relative ease. Of course that's a very subjective opinion, but hey, if you don't agree, you don't have to buy the GPS or you can untick the option for the Huey in the Special tab if you want it for another aircraft (all that of course hypothetically, if the set ever makes it into the Huey) and use the F10 map instead. That would be a win-win solution, don't you think? Everybody plays the way he likes.

 

I would agree with the realism concerns if the GPS was forced onto us, but it isn't. We don't have to use them, much like we don't have to use the unrealistic RS-2US missiles or gunpods in the MiG-21bis.

 

Here are some other arguments why Huey specifically:

  • The Huey is rather mediocre in the radionav department. Consider the campaign that came with the Mi-8. It took place almost entirely in South Ossetia, which has no VORs or NDBs. Not a huge problem in the Mi-8 - a pen, some paper and the doppler system will get you where you need to be. But if you flew it in the Huey, you would need to learn the map really well.
  • Possibly the COM and NAV radios could be married to the 430, increasing it's functionality?
  • Development would be in house, no need to coordinate with another 3rd party.

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And you will still be able to do so by not buying or by deativating the GPS in the settings for the Huey.

Choice is good, the 'Open Conflict' server might enable it (as friendlies are already shown on the map) and Blue Flag or SP missions disable it.

 

The only real advantage GPS brings is in poor visibility or over featureless terrain i.e. water - unless you don't want to plan adf/vfr

 

I'd like to know how the F10 map is less fictional then a working, complex GPS unit that can be fitted to any aircraft that has space for it and the antennas ^^.

The 'map only' option makes the F10 map equivalent to a paper map. You'll only know where you are if you can recognise landmarks or have appropriate instrumentation.

  • Giving the F10 map, GPS functionality turns it into a generic portable GPS device and doesn't 'pretend' to be realistic.
  • Adding a cockpit GPS device does pretend to be realistic and the feature should be held to the same standard as the module being added to.
  • Integrating a complex GPS unit into existing avionics is more than just finding some space for the unit (it often requires supporting upgrades/equipment changes) and is why a portable GNS 696 might be better a choice.

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Choice is good, the 'Open Conflict' server might enable it (as friendlies are already shown on the map) and Blue Flag or SP missions disable it.

 

The only real advantage GPS brings is in poor visibility or over featureless terrain i.e. water - unless you don't want to plan adf/vfr

 

 

The 'map only' option makes the F10 map equivalent to a paper map. You'll only know where you are if you can recognise landmarks or have appropriate instrumentation.

  • Giving the F10 map, GPS functionality turns it into a generic portable GPS device and doesn't 'pretend' to be realistic.
  • Adding a cockpit GPS device does pretend to be realistic and the feature should be held to the same standard as the module being added to.
  • Integrating a complex GPS unit into existing avionics is more than just finding some space for the unit (it often requires supporting upgrades/equipment changes) and is why a portable GNS 696 might be better a choice.

 

 

The option has to do with the user, not with the mission. Everyone uses it at their convenience.

 

While being the equivalent of a paper map, it's still less immersive then a proper unit in your cockpit.

 

You won't have any or at least very few features with the F10 map that a GPS provides.

 

A garmin gps unit requires power, that's about all that i could think you'd need to run it, you don't need a proper HSI, you do need wiring to the antennas,... That's exactly what was done with the Mi-8.

 

To sum up, why wouldn't you want one in the Huey, F-5,... If you don't like it's usefull and/or not realistic then just don't buy it/disable it. I'm still going to be using a good old clock and maths in the F-5 during mission nights at the VEAF, but when i'm on a multiplayer server or in a more modern mission i might use the GPS.


Edited by Rex854Warrior

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430 into the huey?

 

Why ?

  • No Garmin 430's were used in Vietnam/Korea.
  • Most civilian Huey's on the web that do have a Garmin use the older GNC250XL or a portable like the GNS696
  • This
    , uses twin GNS430 and a glass cockpit. It doesn't carry rockets or machine guns.

Part of the joy in flying DCS modules is flying with realistic instruments and learning the 'old fashion' skills needed.

 

  • The Bo-105 being developed has a very basic GPS - should it be NS430 compatible?
  • How about the Spitfire, Mi-24, AV-8, F-14 or Hornet, they don't have a GNS430 but could carry a potable GPS device today?
  • Why add a fiction when players have the F10 map and better route planning could be added to that?

 

 

 

Edit: I mixed you up with somebody else. Sorry for that. I deleted my post.

 

As of the NS430 in the Huey, I don't know how realistic it is. If it could be supported, it's a welcome addition in my opinion.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Edited by TomCatMucDe
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Why ?

  • No Garmin 430's were used in Vietnam/Korea.
  • Most civilian Huey's on the web that do have a Garmin use the older GNC250XL or a portable like the GNS696
  • This
    , uses twin GNS430 and a glass cockpit. It doesn't carry rockets or machine guns.

Part of the joy in flying DCS modules is flying with realistic instruments and learning the 'old fashion' skills needed.

 

  • The Bo-105 being developed has a very basic GPS - should it be NS430 compatible?
  • How about the Spitfire, Mi-24, AV-8, F-14 or Hornet, they don't have a GNS430 but could carry a potable GPS device today?
  • Why add a fiction when players have the F10 map and better route planning could be added to that?

 

"Why?"

 

Because you have a choice to use or not, it’s not implemented in the original module.

It’s an add on. If you don’t like “fiction”, simply forget it.

 

Why must people tell others how to act and play “correctly”, in order to be truly authentic?

I know hundreds of real warbirds which have been updated with modern GPS navigation.

An extra instrument on the panel doesn’t spoil the fun and joy of flying these authentic birds.

Because authenticity is controlling these birds in the air, you’ll feel it on the stick, not when looking at the panel.

 

And: no real warbird has a F10 button with moving map. This is fiction.

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And: no real warbird has a F10 button with moving map. This is fiction.

 

True, but F10 behavior can be limited by server admins.

 

I support them adding it as something that could be blocked in the mission editor, if an admin/mission author chose to do so.

 

But having the capability in general is a good thing. There are thousands of UH-1 still flying today, in both combat and non-combat capacities.

 

--gos

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True, but F10 behavior can be limited by server admins.

 

I support them adding it as something that could be blocked in the mission editor, if an admin/mission author chose to do so.

 

But having the capability in general is a good thing. There are thousands of UH-1 still flying today, in both combat and non-combat capacities.

 

--gos

 

absolutely right.

Don’t get me wrong, gospadin, I’m not complaining about F10 option. It’s just the opposite.

The DCS player may choose his way of authenticity. With NS430 or not, with the aid of moving map or not.

The NS430 module and F10 function can easily be switched off and on.

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No Garmin 430's were used in Vietnam/Korea.

- we don't simulate only vietnam/korea do we?

 

Most civilian Huey's on the web that do have a Garmin use the older GNC250XL or a portable like the GNS696

- keyword is "most"

 

This

, uses twin GNS430 and a glass cockpit. It doesn't carry rockets or machine guns.

- see, everything is possible

 

The Bo-105 being developed has a very basic GPS - should it be NS430 compatible?

- Are we talking about some buil-in GPS that comes from factory? In that case it should be compatible if it is possible IRL to make them compatible.

 

How about the Spitfire, Mi-24, AV-8, F-14 or Hornet, they don't have a GNS430 but could carry a potable GPS device today?

- We will have to see, so far noone denied or confirmed that we will get this GPS for anything else than Mi8

 

Why add a fiction when players have the F10 map and better route planning could be added to that?

- If something is fiction than it would be using F10 map, having real life GPS device which can be mounted into ANYTHING can only be more realistic

 

My opinion is that if we are implementing some standalone GPS device in Mi8, the aircraft that does not have it from stock, it should be available for every other aircraft.

That would be "logical choice" for me.

 

 

The Av8B and F18 wont get garmin 430. In fact those aircraft dont need to because they were developed represent modern 21st century iterations of those aircraft that already have Integrated Military grade GPS Mapping/ Navigation suites.

 

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The Av8B and F18 wont get garmin 430. In fact those aircraft dont need to because they were developed represent modern 21st century iterations of those aircraft that already have Integrated Military grade GPS Mapping/ Navigation suites.

 

Agreed. What they have is already way better. Nothing prevents them from programming approach waypoints too if they chose to do so, though in reality they're probably going to be flying TACAN/DME or ILS, instead of a RNAV (GPS) approach.

 

--gos

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True, but F10 behavior can be limited by server admins.

 

I support them adding it as something that could be blocked in the mission editor, if an admin/mission author chose to do so.

 

But having the capability in general is a good thing. There are thousands of UH-1 still flying today, in both combat and non-combat capacities.

 

--gos

 

 

 

 

 

Totally agree here, as long as the GPS can be excluded from historical missions online or off and at the discretion of the creator, then I think the GPS is good. It will look good in my Stang sucky cupped to the cannopy.

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I second this considering its an addon by belsimtek. Might also allow them to rewrite the code to support the alleged, promised multicrew... I'm not starting a fight, just stating that even as BST added this to a ED product, L-39C, it should also be added to non equipped crafts, as optional. Realism wise, it can simply be deactivated or turned off.

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NS430 makes more sense for the Huey than for the Mi-8.

 

A GPS as the NS430 makes more sense for the Huey than for the Mi-8. The latter has doppler NAV which not only gives heading guidance but distance information as well. Doppler is the poor man’s GPS, it requires some brainpower but allows true immersion - if one loves it.

 

Many of today’s flying Hueys in utility operation or rescue missions not only have basic GPS but huge glass cockpits.

So why getting upset about “immersion” and “true sim” of the plain NS430?

There is a simple ON/OFF switch for each preference.

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Many of today’s flying Hueys in utility operation or rescue missions not only have basic GPS but huge glass cockpits.

So why getting upset about “immersion” and “true sim” of the plain NS430?

There is a simple ON/OFF switch for each preference.

 

well said

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