ED Team NineLine Posted April 6, 2018 ED Team Share Posted April 6, 2018 (edited) Hey guys, This post is to clarify the issues that some have been having with 2.5, and to clarify what is going on, and the best way to approach working with it. First, this is NOT a memory leak. A memory leak would be that usage of RAM continues to increase during running of the sim until it uses all you memory and the program crashes or stops responding. What is actually happening is that with 2.5 and all its new features, people are hitting their RAM limit on load of maps. Why? Well 2.5 has added higher object counts, from collide-able trees, new buildings, more buildings, and other objects to make the maps look more alive and detailed. Include in this higher detailed textures and you can see how more RAM is needed. Currently ED is testing a solution that will help much of this. The initial version of the dynamic texture unload manager which will greatly improve performance for heavy online missions is currently under test and should be available for users within the coming two weeks. We apologise for the delay but a last minute issue arose with this module. What can you do while you wait? Adjusting older missions from 1.5, especially for multiplayer, by removing un-needed units can help. Mission design can really help manage RAM usage, and for the time being will be the best bet to help. As well, look at your computer specs, by no means does ED demand you guys upgrade to 32GB, but if you are running 8GB, you may need to evolve with the times, and understand that as ED offers bigger more detailed environments, the demands on your system will need to evolve as well. I hope this clarifies a little more of what is going on, and that ED is truly working to make this the best experience for all. Edited April 6, 2018 by NineLine Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magic Zach Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Two more weeks! Thanks for the update, Nine. Hardware: T-50 Mongoose, VKB STECS, Saitek 3 Throttle Quadrant, Homemade 32-function Leo Bodnar Button Box, MFG Crosswind Pedals Oculus Rift S System Specs: MSI MPG X570 GAMING PLUS, RTX 3090, Ryzen 7 5800X3D, 32GB DDR4-3200, Samsung 860 EVO, Samsung 970 EVO 250GB Modules: AH-64D, Ka-50, Mi-8MTV2, F-16C, F-15E, F/A-18C, F-14B, F-5E, P-51D, Spitfire Mk LF Mk. IXc, Bf-109K-4, Fw-190A-8 Maps: Normandy, Nevada, Persian Gulf, Syria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny_Rico Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 So from your post doing the following should reduce RAM use 1. Reduce textures (Textures and Terrain Textures) 2. Reduce preload radius to a lower value Both of these should help out ? and reduce the amount of RAM being used ? METAR weather for DCS World missions Guide to help out new DCS MOOSE Users -> HERE Havoc Company Dedicated server info Connect IP: 94.23.215.203 SRS enabled - freqs - Main = 243, A2A = 244, A2G = 245 Please contact me HERE if you have any server feedback or METAR issues/requests Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJaromir Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Is possible that there can be memory leaks by bad made scripts? Like in CTLD script or in SLmod or in some unofficial addons like Simple radio or TacView? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted April 6, 2018 Author ED Team Share Posted April 6, 2018 So from your post doing the following should reduce RAM use 1. Reduce textures (Textures and Terrain Textures) 2. Reduce preload radius to a lower value Both of these should help out ? and reduce the amount of RAM being used ? If you examine the issue yourself, you will see that a large amount is used on launch of a mission, and then it stabilizes, the issue happens when people hit their RAM limit before it can stabilize. The pre-loader will help, but untill then the only option is reduce the RAM load or increase the RAM limit. Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny_Rico Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 (edited) By Grabthars HAMMER ... what a savings! Loaded a mission of mine, ran it for 2 mins (no flying, just sitting in my pit) My normal "high" settings = 11.6G of RAM used (@ 2 min mark) Changed settings to "low" = 5.1G of RAM used (@ 2 min mark) Edited April 6, 2018 by Johnny_Rico METAR weather for DCS World missions Guide to help out new DCS MOOSE Users -> HERE Havoc Company Dedicated server info Connect IP: 94.23.215.203 SRS enabled - freqs - Main = 243, A2A = 244, A2G = 245 Please contact me HERE if you have any server feedback or METAR issues/requests Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kokomakak Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 My rig (Dell gaming laptop) is already maxed out at 32 GB of RAM so that explains why I never experienced these memory issues. If you have the cash and RAM slots upgrading your RAM is another way to go until ED releases the fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted April 6, 2018 Author ED Team Share Posted April 6, 2018 Is possible that there can be memory leaks by bad made scripts? Like in CTLD script or in SLmod or in some unofficial addons like Simple radio or TacView? I dont know, beyond Tacview, I dont use much, when testing we use clean installs, its up to the people building mods and addons to test their own stuff, and if you run into issues that others dont have, the first thing to do is remove addons like this. Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted April 6, 2018 Author ED Team Share Posted April 6, 2018 My rig (Dell gaming laptop) is already maxed out at 32 GB of RAM so that explains why I never experienced these memory issues. If you have the cash and RAM slots upgrading your RAM is another way to go until ED releases the fix. Yup, and honestly expect for some heavy duty MP missions, my 16GB rarely causes me much issues except for some delyaed loading. Hasnt stopped me from sending an invoice to the wife request the purchase of more RAM :) Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vitormouraa Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Thanks, I have a system with 8gb and I notice DCS will keep unnecessary stuff in the RAM after you finish a mission, that makes my system very slow when I return to the menu. I assume DCS isn't managing the RAM very well, hence the reduced performance. It's basically stagnating my system, but if it could somehow remove the files that aren't being used from the memory, it would be a huge improvement. I could be wrong but I'm going to try to give an example; You fly the A-10C for a while, the game will load all the necessary stuff and will keep that in the RAM, now if I jump into other cockpit, let's say the Harrier, DCS is still keeping A-10C stuff in my RAM, which I'm not even using it, I don't even need them, but it's still there. That's what I see at least, I know nothing about the subject. SplashOneGaming Discord https://splashonegaming.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted April 6, 2018 Author ED Team Share Posted April 6, 2018 There is no easy way to put this, but 8GB is for the low-end, this means less eye candy and less objects, DCS is speeding away from systems with lower GB totals. Now the unload Manager should improve things, but dont experience miracles on lower end systems either. Just to manage expectations. Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted April 6, 2018 Author ED Team Share Posted April 6, 2018 By Grabthars HAMMER ... what a savings! Loaded a mission of mine, ran it for 2 mins (no flying, just sitting in my pit) My normal "high" settings = 11.6G of RAM used (@ 2 min mark) img Changed settings to "low" = 5.1G of RAM used (@ 2 min mark) imgg Good post, there are things that you can do until the unload manager shows up. You just have to manage your settings based on the level of PC you have. Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snoopy Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Well I’ve got 32 gigs of ram already and it still takes forever to load most missions. Hoping what’s “in the pipe” corrects it. It’s more of a hassle than anything. v303d Fighter Group Discord | Virtual 303d Fighter Group Website | v303rd Fighter Group Twitter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted April 6, 2018 Author ED Team Share Posted April 6, 2018 Well I’ve got 32 gigs of ram already and it still takes forever to load most missions. Hoping what’s “in the pipe” corrects it. It’s more of a hassle than anything. Yeah, I think you guys fall under the heavy mission category too, so I am interested to see how it works for you when the unload manager hits. Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
_e10 Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Currently ED is testing a solution that will help much of this. The initial version of the dynamic texture unload manager which will greatly improve performance for heavy online missions is currently under test and should be available for users within the coming two weeks. All good but I dont understand why this was not mentioned before to avoid all that "misunderstanding" of the last few days... A good example of failed communication :smilewink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted April 6, 2018 Author ED Team Share Posted April 6, 2018 All good but I dont understand why this was not mentioned before to avoid all that "misunderstanding" of the last few days... A good example of failed communication :smilewink: I dont know why the term Memory Leak went wild.... For the unload Manager, it was just too early in testing to let out of the box, but now you know. I wish it was a perfect world, but we try the best we can :cry: Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkateZilla Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 (edited) I dont know why the term Memory Leak went wild.... For the unload Manager, it was just too early in testing to let out of the box, but now you know. I wish it was a perfect world, but we try the best we can :cry: Because majority of the Users saw their ram fill up until the application crashed, especially 8GB/12 GB users. That behavior implied Memory Leak, because they assumed it was the same for everyone 16, 24, 32GB and up. The issue isnt a memory leak, it's the Lower Memory Quantity Users running out of memory before the loading process completes, resulting in crash or excessive use of a slower page file, which slows things weaaaaaaaay down. Pre 2.5 users even w/ 8GB cranked their Preload Radius all the way up to reduce texture loading in game causing stutters, 2.5 Caucasus has a significantly larger memory foot print per 10km^2 than it did in 1.5, Due to higher resolution terrain (mesh and textures), more objects, higher resolution objects (mesh and textures), etc etc. Edited April 6, 2018 by SkateZilla Windows 10 Pro, Ryzen 2700X @ 4.6Ghz, 32GB DDR4-3200 GSkill (F4-3200C16D-16GTZR x2), ASRock X470 Taichi Ultimate, XFX RX6800XT Merc 310 (RX-68XTALFD9) 3x ASUS VS248HP + Oculus HMD, Thrustmaster Warthog HOTAS + MFDs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted April 6, 2018 Author ED Team Share Posted April 6, 2018 Because majority of the Users saw their ram fill up until the application crashed, especially 8GB/12 GB users. That behavior implied Memory Leak, because they assumed it was the same for everyone 16, 24, 32GB and up. The issue isnt a memory leak, it's the Lower Memory Quantity Users running out of memory before the loading process completes, resulting in crash or excessive use of a slower page file, which slows things weaaaaaaaay down. We own as much of the blame though, we used Memory Leak on our side as well, I think the issue just wasnt understood well at first, and once the Memory Leak term hit the net, it was out there... Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolle Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 I am a bit worried that the unload manager will help RAM usage but make in-game stutters worse, as it presumably unloads textures that are not needed at the time, but later in the mission they may become needed again and have to be loaded (leading to a stutter). [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Intel Core I7 4820K @4.3 GHz, Asus P9X79 motherboard, 16 GB RAM @ 933 MHz, NVidia GTX 1070 with 8 GB VRAM, Windows 10 Pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDoctor46 Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 Thank you for the update Probably a stupid question, but here goes. Is this mem issue also the reason we experience this stuttering in game, even on low graphics setting? In VR for my part, never tried with regular monitor. I think I have a reasonable good spec computer, at least my february expenses thought so. I cant have TGP active and Maverick cam open at the same time in the A10C, too much stuttering. Intel i7-8700K 4.8Ghz, 32 GB RAM, GTX 1080ti, Windblows 10, 512 SSD Virpil MongoosT-50 base with TM Warthog Stick TM Warthog Throttle MFG Crosswind HP Reverb G1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vitormouraa Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 [...] Skate do you have any recommendation on how I should be managing the preload radius bar with an 8gb system? SplashOneGaming Discord https://splashonegaming.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted April 6, 2018 Author ED Team Share Posted April 6, 2018 I am a bit worried that the unload manager will help RAM usage but make in-game stutters worse, as it presumably unloads textures that are not needed at the time, but later in the mission they may become needed again and have to be loaded (leading to a stutter). It's still in testing, but I believe all the magic happens on mission load, and that is where the issue is, people hit a RAM limit on load, if you didnt hit it then, you RAM usage would drop to lower levels and you would be fine. Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uscstaylor Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 I have 32gbs of ram and I still have long load times even with a newly created mission with minimal objects in the mission. I'm curious to see how ED is going to fix this issue..this Load Manager sounds like another way of adjusting your settings, which we already have in game. Any idea when this will come out? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cibit Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 I have 32gbs of ram and I still have long load times even with a newly created mission with minimal objects in the mission. I'm curious to see how ED is going to fix this issue..this Load Manager sounds like another way of adjusting your settings, which we already have in game. Any idea when this will come out? The speed of your HDD/SDD is a factor too along with other variables i5 8600k@5.2Ghz, Asus Prime A Z370, 32Gb DDR4 3000, GTX1080 SC, Oculus Rift CV1, Modded TM Warthog Modded X52 Collective, Jetseat, W10 Pro 64 [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Adding JTAC Guide //My Vid's//229th AHB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bersagliere81 Posted April 6, 2018 Share Posted April 6, 2018 We own as much of the blame though, we used Memory Leak on our side as well, I think the issue just wasnt understood well at first, and once the Memory Leak term hit the net, it was out there... It is also due to the fact ED stated 2.5 surprisingly isn't that memory demanding and it won't affect that much performances. I feel like most of the users found these words conforting, and now we are getting punished for this heresy. At least this is the "message" I got from ED few months ago, assuming I didn't misread something. BTW I really hope things will get better. I have 16gb ram (and SSD) and I can safely say I spend a good portion of my gaming time in waiting for the server to be loaded. Add random server crashes and you can feel our frustration :D | A-10C | MiG-21bis | Hawk T1.A | L-39 Albatros | F-5E | Ka-50 | Mi-8 | NTTR | CA | SU27 | M2000C | F-86F | AV-8B | F/A-18C | Mig 15 | Mig 19| Specs Intel i7-9700k msi GTX 2060 Gaming Z msi Z390 Gaming PLUS 16gb RAM Hotas Warthog Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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