A-10C Training Video Available - Start Up

Excellent post, Deadsmell.

Pretty sure the military does not have clowns dancing around in front of the AC during their training either. The instructors are not cracking jokes for the pilot when he is starting up a very expensive AC. The voice over guy is not in the AC, you are. He is talking to you through some god like radio because its a sim, not real life. Not quite sure how you can compare this to the BS tutorials. They were not interactive like this.

 

I don't think its a failure because you want dancing gorillas on unicycles keeping you entertained.

 

 

Glad to see I was not the only one thinking it was Samuel L.

Its your right to feel as you do but 99.9% of the rest of us are thrilled at how this is shaping up. Some people you will just never please no matter what you do.

I like the training video personally.

 

Though I'd rather have the product in my hands.

I'm not going to mindlessly approve everything ED does, but I think this is a perfectly good tutorial, Deadsmell. I don't see how it doesn't do the job well... this isn't meant to be exciting and entertaining for you. It's a complicated sim designed for people who get their "fun" from the complexity and seriousness. They can't please everyone!

Kind of odd to refer to it as boring in my opinion, it's a training video, what more could you want? You're either entertained by the fact your learning about something you have enthusiasm for or your bored because it's a training video for something you have no interest in.

 

My only criticism would be that some of the gauges that are referenced by the narrator are not highlighted (eg for BS Matt would circle his mouse pointer around gauges he was describing or was focused on). But a quick glance at the manual would clear that up.

 

For entertainment we have GA and his splendid works.

See, now that is a useful suggestion/criticism.

 

My only criticism would be that some of the gauges that are referenced by the narrator are not highlighted (eg for BS Matt would circle his mouse pointer around gauges he was describing or was focused on). But a quick glance at the manual would clear that up.

Yeah I liked the vid also. Most people that are into sims like this have some kind of attention span. I personally find all the rubbish they put in the freefalcon manual (for example) to try and make it funny/interesting really irritating and time wasting.

To me the video is plagued with the same boredom factor as the previous tutorials.

 

I'm really interested in any suggestions you have for making it less "boring". But if you do find it boring, maybe you should consider whether you actually like this kind of game? I mean, learning all the systems is a major part of the 'fun' factor, at least for me. If it's not for you, maybe you should play in 'game mode' - at which point these tutorials aren't really a part of the game you'll actually be playing, so why worry about them?

 

Which is a disappointment, seeing as how there was some discussion about how superior the tutorials in this new edition were going to be.....

You do realise this is a video of someone doing an interactive tutorial? The opening narration explains how it works: they tell you what needs doing, the controls you need to use are highlighted, and it waits for you to perform that ask before the tutorial continues. If you can't see how this is a massive leap forward from DCS: BS (tutorial that runs at its own pace regardless of what the player is actually doing) or FC2 (actual videos so you can't even try to perform the steps as the tutorial runs) then, I don't really know how to have a conversation with you.

 

60 seconds in and you're already PAINFULLY bored.

I was nowhere near bored, and I was merely watching it. I'm sure I'll be even less bored when I'm actually doing the clicking!

 

Also, its youtube. don't post it there if you aren't capable of dealing with criticism would be my advice.

Hmm, the YouTube service makes it pretty clear that people who post videos have complete control over the comments etc. Just like ED have complete control over who can use this forum and what kinds of posts will be kept. If you don't like that, well, set up your own video hosting site that implements your own rules would be my advice. Just remember you're a guest on every web site you visit, and they have no obligation whatsoever to allow you to use their resources.

 

I am generally in favour of open discussions and not 'censoring' people you disagree with. Not knowing what you posted on YouTube means I can't have an opinion as to whether or not it "should've" been deleted. But I will say that the tutorial videos are a significant marketing avenue and it's understandable they'd want to keep the comments positive. Additionally, if your comment was anything like what you posted here, it's very likely to receive a lot of replies, and having people arguing back and forth over whether a training video for a study sim is 'boring' or not isn't particularly good marketing. Nor does it make for very interesting reading.

 

The voice acting I thought was fine for the purpose. Not an Oscar-winning performance, there's a few pauses at strange times and things like that which give the impression the reader wasn't all that familiar with the text. But for tutorials that you're going to see maybe 3 or 4 times max, it's fine. Or to put it another way: is the voiceover an improvement from simply having to read the text on-screen? To me, the answer is a resounding yes. The speech is clear and pretty easy to follow, even when your attention is focused on the cockpit.

 

I would like to agree with DratsaB regarding highlighting the displays etc. That would be a very nice addition, if there's time. What I think would work really well would be if a text label would pop up near the gauge when the instructor is talking about it, with an arrow pointing to the thing in question.

 

Yes this tutorial took time to make, by the looks of it, I would say it took about 17 minutes to make.

 

Again, you do realise it's an interactive tutorial, right? It would have taken a lot of time to program the tutorial system, and while the results may look pretty simple, that's usually the sign of a programming job done well.

Edited September 21, 2010 by nomdeplume

I like the training video personally.

 

Though I'd rather have the product in my hands.

 

Concur!

See, now that is a useful suggestion/criticism.

It was lacking in DCS BS but I would like to see this time - a monochrome simplified cockpit layout with subject panel (at least) shaded to appear here and there. If not in the training vids then in the manual. I recall I had to constantly switch to cockpit overview while reading Ka-50 manual to see where the actual gauge is located in 'the big picture'.

 

Such a figure can be made very small and still doing its job.

 

Click on the thumbnail to see WIP Ka-50 cockpit layout

 

Will these be avalible to download in HD, So I can start to learn the startup, without having to be logged onto Youtube, Like you did with the BS Vids?

It was lacking in DCS BS but I would like to see this time - a monochrome simplified cockpit layout with subject panel (at least) shaded to appear here and there. If not in the training vids then in the manual. I recall I had to constantly switch to cockpit overview while reading Ka-50 manual to see where the actual gauge is located in 'the big picture'.

 

Such a figure can be made very small and still doing its job.

 

Click on the thumbnail to see WIP Ka-50 cockpit layout

I had the idea of adding video "picture-in-picture" insets to show a close-up view of the panel being operated/viewed, but unfortunately had to move on to complete other lessons. For now, this video works best as a demonstration of the training system. If time allows, I'd like to have another go at implementing more training features into the video(s) later.

Edited September 21, 2010 by EvilBivol-1

Will these be avalible to download in HD, So I can start to learn the startup, without having to be logged onto Youtube, Like you did with the BS Vids?

Yes.

It was lacking in DCS BS but I would like to see this time - a monochrome simplified cockpit layout with subject panel (at least) shaded to appear here and there. If not in the training vids then in the manual.

 

+1 nice idea.

 

As the training will all be downloadable, an alternative will be to have your lappy to one side and follow (also the ability to pause and rewind will help).

+1 nice idea.

 

As the training will all be downloadable, an alternative will be to have your lappy to one side and follow (also the ability to pause and rewind will help).

 

 

Could we also make the video's iPhone friendly on YouTube so we can use that as an alternative to a Laptop which Im sure not everyone will have access to?

Could we also make the video's iPhone friendly on YouTube so we can use that as an alternative to a Laptop which Im sure not everyone will have access to?

 

does everyone have an iphone? damn I really must keep up & go out and get one! ;)

Deadsmell its a shame your post was filled with extreme overreaction, if it wasnt we still could have had a discussion and perhaps gotten some answers from you on what a training video should be like to make you feel less bored. In my opinion it was perfect for the purpose of learning to start up, it was not boring and Hammer did an excellent job, I really felt like I should listen to him carefully and follow his instructions, it felt real to me. We are not "applauding failure" we are applauding it because we like it, its very simple, that specific comment is very insulting. Its too bad that by overreacting and getting yourself banned you have locked yourself out of this discussion, your input would have been interesting, now you are just out. Maybe a lesson learned until next time..

Could we also make the video's iPhone friendly on YouTube so we can use that as an alternative to a Laptop which Im sure not everyone will have access to?

Well, we could also just buy a smarter smartphone that is more youtube friendly ;)

I had the idea of adding video "picture-in-picture" insets to show a close-up view of the panel being operated/viewed, but unfortunately had to move on to complete other lessons. For now, this video works best as a demonstration of the training system. If time allows, I'd like to have another go at implementing more training features into the video(s) later.

I understand. Thank you for your reply.

 

Another idea from the training basket - Key Commands usage statistics. I'm just about to print out DCS BS key commands and boy there are so many obsolete entries. It's also barely usable without having it opened in PDF reader with 'Find' function hot and ready all the time as it is organized per instrument panel basis rather than per task. You have testers doing thousands of hours testing A-10C. Why not hook them up, even without their knowledge, to gather the data? With supposed LUA capabilities it should be achievable.

 

If ED staff decides none of it is needed then the least I would expect is putting up a Key Commands template (editable table) for download so everyone could easily tailor it to his needs.

 

 

 

Will these be avalible to download in HD, So I can start to learn the startup, without having to be logged onto Youtube, Like you did with the BS Vids?

You can download the HD YouTube version right now using one of many solutions - Grab++, internet browser plugins, internet browser cache etc.

 

Could we also make the video's iPhone friendly on YouTube so we can use that as an alternative to a Laptop which Im sure not everyone will have access to?

AFAIK you can play YT videos on iPad using its built-in application without special requirements regarding the video 'format'. Also, same as above, you can launch an YT vid in any quality/resolution and download the vid in THAT specific quality/resolution.

My Android phone plays the video just fine...

Is it common practice on A10s to turn the Generators on before starting the engine? On jets ive worked on they are usually left off until the engine is running to reduce load on startup.

Im not saying its wrong, its interesting to compare procedures!

Is it common practice on A10s to turn the Generators on before starting the engine? On jets ive worked on they are usually left off until the engine is running to reduce load on startup.

Im not saying its wrong, its interesting to compare procedures!

 

I thought the same thing, but a check of the -1CL shows that this is normal. Part of the engine start procedure is to look for the Generator Caution Lights to go out by a specific RPM.

 

On a similar note, in the original startup video (the Producer's Note by Wags), he incorrectly shutdown the APU before turning off the APU GEN. The new startup video corrects that.

Is it common practice on A10s to turn the Generators on before starting the engine? On jets ive worked on they are usually left off until the engine is running to reduce load on startup.

Im not saying its wrong, its interesting to compare procedures!

 

AFAIK, moving the switch does not automatically connect the generators to the electrical load. The circuits only become connected when the engine spools above a certain value during the start cycle. That threw me off as well, until I read about it in the manual.

EDIT: Damn, I'm just too slow.

Ah cool, cheers! Ill try find a systems diagram and have a nosey before I comment next time. Great training mission, beats the DIY training from BS :) I think most people will be more at home with a jet to start with aswell, cant wait :)