Bearfoot Posted January 10, 2018 Share Posted January 10, 2018 The Mi-24 will have the same effect on rotary-wings community as the F-18 on the fixed wings one. it will be a game changer. Suddenly, you have one awesome platform that can do just about everything the other ones can do together and so everybody will want to fly it. I am expecting to see a massive shift of activity towards this platform only and for a prolonged period of time before anyone will want to come back to an Mi8 or simple aircraft like the Huey. I am incredibly excited about the Mi-24!!! Totally iconic helicopter and this is the one module I am looking forward to more than the F-18 and every other fixed-wing announced COMBINED! But curious: why do you say it is a multi-capable multi-role helo over the existing ones combined? Surely the current KA-50 can do it all, and perhaps more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northstar98 Posted January 10, 2018 Share Posted January 10, 2018 I am incredibly excited about the Mi-24!!! Totally iconic helicopter and this is the one module I am looking forward to more than the F-18 and every other fixed-wing announced COMBINED! But curious: why do you say it is a multi-capable multi-role helo over the existing ones combined? Surely the current KA-50 can do it all, and perhaps more? The -24 apart from being a gunship/attack helicopter also has limited troop carrying capacity. Something the single-seat Ka-50 doesn't have Modules I own: F-14A/B, Mi-24P, AV-8B N/A, AJS 37, F-5E-3, MiG-21bis, F-16CM, F/A-18C, Supercarrier, Mi-8MTV2, UH-1H, Mirage 2000C, FC3, MiG-15bis, Ka-50, A-10C (+ A-10C II), P-47D, P-51D, C-101, Yak-52, WWII Assets, CA, NS430, Hawk. Terrains I own: South Atlantic, Syria, The Channel, SoH/PG, Marianas. System: GIGABYTE B650 AORUS ELITE AX, AMD Ryzen 5 7600, Corsair Vengeance DDR5-5200 32 GB, Western Digital Black SN850X 1 TB (DCS dedicated) & 2 TB NVMe SSDs, Corsair RM850X 850 W, NZXT H7 Flow, MSI G274CV. Peripherals: VKB Gunfighter Mk.II w. MCG Pro, MFG Crosswind V3 Graphite, Logitech Extreme 3D Pro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
firmek Posted January 10, 2018 Share Posted January 10, 2018 I am incredibly excited about the Mi-24!!! Totally iconic helicopter and this is the one module I am looking forward to more than the F-18 and every other fixed-wing announced COMBINED! But curious: why do you say it is a multi-capable multi-role helo over the existing ones combined? Surely the current KA-50 can do it all, and perhaps more? +1. I'm also looking forward for Mi-24 but I don't see how it'll be a game changer. While a western attack helicopter would be a game changer and as far iconic the Mi-24 is with generally analog avionics, the KA-50 is much more capable platform. The answer to the Mi-24 replacing Mi-8 question is actually not so obvious if you look from DCS perspective - which is not always reflecting the real world. For the most part how the MP missions in DCS are currently setup, the lift capability and hull capacity of the helicopters quite often does not matter. Through the CTLD script, Huey and Mi-8 are able to take the same ammount cargo, squizing an SA-6 into internal cargo compartnment plus taking a group of soldiers next to it. In other words, much depends on the mission designers which currently have tools to design the missions either towards "balancing" or by taking an realistic approach. F/A-18, F-16, F-14, M-2000C, A-10C, AV-8B, AJS-37 Viggen, F-5E-3, F-86F, MiG-21bis, MiG-15bis, L-39 Albatros, C-101 Aviojet, P-51D, Spitfire LF Mk. IX, Bf 109 4-K, UH-1H, Mi-8, Ka-50, NTTR, Normandy, Persian Gulf... and not enough time to fully enjoy it all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearfoot Posted January 10, 2018 Share Posted January 10, 2018 +1. I'm also looking forward for Mi-24 but I don't see how it'll be a game changer. While a western attack helicopter would be a game changer and as far iconic the Mi-24 is with generally analog avionics, the KA-50 is much more capable platform. The answer to the Mi-24 replacing Mi-8 question is actually not so obvious if you look from DCS perspective - which is not always reflecting the real world. For the most part how the MP missions in DCS are currently setup, the lift capability and hull capacity of the helicopters quite often does not matter. Through the CTLD script, Huey and Mi-8 are able to take the same ammount cargo, squizing an SA-6 into internal cargo compartnment plus taking a group of soldiers next to it. In other words, much depends on the mission designers which currently have tools to design the missions either towards "balancing" or by taking an realistic approach. I am working on a Lua scripting library that (among other things) allows for different capacities for different helos (e.g., MI-8 can carry 20-24 troops, while Huey can carry 10-14), as well as different types for different helos (e.g., Mi-8 can carry small jeep). I think it will be straightforward to incorporate into either CTLD or MOOSE. The Mi-24 cannot replace the Mi-8. Either in reality, in the sim, or in my heart! These two are "sisters" meant to be used in concert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearfoot Posted January 10, 2018 Share Posted January 10, 2018 The -24 apart from being a gunship/attack helicopter also has limited troop carrying capacity. Something the single-seat Ka-50 doesn't have True. Though in practice it was almost never used that way due to terrible performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearfoot Posted January 10, 2018 Share Posted January 10, 2018 Do you think I can replace the Mi-8? Absolutely no way. Same as the AH-1 cannot replace the Huey. Or the Apache the Black Hawk. Or Romeo Juliet. They complement each other beautifully, and one cannot live with one but not the other. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msalama Posted January 10, 2018 Share Posted January 10, 2018 True. Though in practice it was almost never used that way due to terrible performance. Hmmm... I think I've read somewheres many a moon ago that they actually did that quite a lot in Afganistan. I.e. took 10 troops onboard, fueled the chopper lightly and took all armament they could while still staying below MTOW & then dropped the troops off, rocketed the target before the troops went in, landed the chopper and waited for the troops to come back before flying back to base. But I can't remember any particulars anymore since it really was ages ago... The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearfoot Posted January 10, 2018 Share Posted January 10, 2018 (edited) Hmmm... I think I've read somewheres many a moon ago that they actually did that quite a lot in Afganistan. I.e. took 10 troops onboard, fueled the chopper lightly and took all armament they could while still staying below MTOW & then dropped the troops off, rocketed the target before the troops went in, landed the chopper and waited for the troops to come back before flying back to base. But I can't remember any particulars anymore since it really was ages ago... "As noted earlier, the 'flying IFV' concept did not prove feasible in combat. The crews were reluctant to fly a 'battlebus' full of 'passengers' firing out of the windows, as the Mi-24 was decidely overweight and sluggish with a full payload. Hence the armor plating and troop seats in the cabin were often removed to save weight." -- "Mil Mi-24 Hind Attack Helicopter" (Yefim Gordon and Dmitriy Komissarov, Airlife) The above book is a truly fantastic resource on the Mi-24. Great detail on its development and operations across all variants, including typical missions, weapons loads, performance, and pilot stories. Definitely worth getting! Anyway, while I have no doubt that the Mi-24 may have been used in the battlebus capacity, it does not look to be a SOP or even common, and certainly not liked. The typical and certainly common usage that I've seen in numerous accounts is working in close conjunction with Mi-8's, with the latter not just fulfilling the troop transport role by also airborne FAC, C&C, etc. There are also reports of Mi-8 gunships working in conjunction with Mi-24's, with the former the providing initial heavy salvos of longer range rocket fire to plaster and area and then turning away, while the Mi-24's continue in for the close-in work with guns. I think I read that on these forums somewhere. As anyone who has done a run in on/over ground forces in Mi-8 can tell you, as it is unarmored it is extremely vulnerable to fire, even small arms fire, to the extent that even getting close to (let alone flying over) troops firing at you can shred you up. According to the above source, the Mi-24 with its armor proved itself time and time again on the battlefield to be, for all practical purposes, invulnerable to small arms fire, taking it with impunity, so that is definitely going to make for different employment! Edited January 10, 2018 by Bearfoot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverick24 Posted January 10, 2018 Share Posted January 10, 2018 I am incredibly excited about the Mi-24!!! Totally iconic helicopter and this is the one module I am looking forward to more than the F-18 and every other fixed-wing announced COMBINED! But curious: why do you say it is a multi-capable multi-role helo over the existing ones combined? Surely the current KA-50 can do it all, and perhaps more? It depends on what historical period you want to simulate. Mi-24 definetly belong 80s and 90s, the times, when Ka50/52 was only as a prototype or times, when Ka50/52 was sending to fights only in very small ammount. Besides those two types works in cooperation till this day in modern conflict - including V or P versions (dont deny more or less modifications). The Mi-24 will have the same effect on rotary-wings community as the F-18 on the fixed wings one. it will be a game changer. About that - i dont know if it will be a game changer, but I hope so. Maybe I think yes. We have to consider the fact there are many fans, who look up to Mi-24, their armies have this type and that is not only a few fans, I think there are waiting hundreds and hundreds fans for Mi-24 - including me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tirak Posted January 10, 2018 Share Posted January 10, 2018 About that - i dont know if it will be a game changer, but I hope so. Maybe I think yes. We have to consider the fact there are many fans, who look up to Mi-24, their armies have this type and that is not only a few fans, I think there are waiting hundreds and hundreds fans for Mi-24 - including me. On servers like Blue Flag it will be a game changer no question. An airframe that literally can move the war on its own will be a huge deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearfoot Posted January 10, 2018 Share Posted January 10, 2018 It depends on what historical period you want to simulate. If the Huey legend was born in Vietnam, the Mi-24 and Mi-8 legend was born in Afghanistan, 1979-1989. The various African Wars from the 60's till today would also be the runner-up/second-stage for this legend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogue Trooper Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 We will be schooled in the MI-24s abilities! I think hot and high in Afghanistan seriously puts a limit on the lift capability of the MI-24, as it does with all choppers. MI-8 included. I think Hot and high is a blood stain on the minds of most Russians and this shows in the way they view the capability of their machines. In Afghanistan or Europe, on a nice cool clear day, I reckon a couple of gunners out the side doors might just work perfectly. HP G2 Reverb, Windows 10 VR settings: IPD is 64.5mm, High image quality, G2 reset to 60Hz refresh rate as standard. OpenXR user, Open XR tool kit disabled. Open XR was a massive upgrade for me. DCS: Pixel Density 1.0, Forced IPD at 55 (perceived world size), 0 X MSAA, 0 X SSAA. My real IPD is 64.5mm. Prescription VROptition lenses installed. VR Driver system: I9-9900KS 5Ghz CPU. XI Hero motherboard and RTX 3090 graphics card, 64 gigs Ram, No OC at the mo. MT user (2 - 5 fps gain). DCS run at 60Hz. Vaicom user. Thrustmaster warthog user. MFG pedals with damper upgrade.... and what an upgrade! Total controls Apache MPDs set to virtual Reality height with brail enhancements to ensure 100% button activation in VR.. Simshaker Jet Pro vibration seat.. Uses data from DCS not sound.... you know when you are dropping into VRS with this bad boy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogue Trooper Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 In terms of the KA-50 and how the MI-24 ranks in comparison; The MI-24 is a brute of a chopper... especially the machine we will get with its dual rapid fire 30mm Kannons. just a Brute. The KA-50 is a high precision, High capacity sniper that fires guided missiles that have a shocking.... shocking velocity that can be fired quickly after an attack and still hit first ! HP G2 Reverb, Windows 10 VR settings: IPD is 64.5mm, High image quality, G2 reset to 60Hz refresh rate as standard. OpenXR user, Open XR tool kit disabled. Open XR was a massive upgrade for me. DCS: Pixel Density 1.0, Forced IPD at 55 (perceived world size), 0 X MSAA, 0 X SSAA. My real IPD is 64.5mm. Prescription VROptition lenses installed. VR Driver system: I9-9900KS 5Ghz CPU. XI Hero motherboard and RTX 3090 graphics card, 64 gigs Ram, No OC at the mo. MT user (2 - 5 fps gain). DCS run at 60Hz. Vaicom user. Thrustmaster warthog user. MFG pedals with damper upgrade.... and what an upgrade! Total controls Apache MPDs set to virtual Reality height with brail enhancements to ensure 100% button activation in VR.. Simshaker Jet Pro vibration seat.. Uses data from DCS not sound.... you know when you are dropping into VRS with this bad boy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogue Trooper Posted January 11, 2018 Share Posted January 11, 2018 If the MI-24 we get can laser range find, then a pair of MI-8s port and starboard would be a seriously nasty wing of 3 choppers.... MI-8s peeling of at 2-1.5 clicks. HP G2 Reverb, Windows 10 VR settings: IPD is 64.5mm, High image quality, G2 reset to 60Hz refresh rate as standard. OpenXR user, Open XR tool kit disabled. Open XR was a massive upgrade for me. DCS: Pixel Density 1.0, Forced IPD at 55 (perceived world size), 0 X MSAA, 0 X SSAA. My real IPD is 64.5mm. Prescription VROptition lenses installed. VR Driver system: I9-9900KS 5Ghz CPU. XI Hero motherboard and RTX 3090 graphics card, 64 gigs Ram, No OC at the mo. MT user (2 - 5 fps gain). DCS run at 60Hz. Vaicom user. Thrustmaster warthog user. MFG pedals with damper upgrade.... and what an upgrade! Total controls Apache MPDs set to virtual Reality height with brail enhancements to ensure 100% button activation in VR.. Simshaker Jet Pro vibration seat.. Uses data from DCS not sound.... you know when you are dropping into VRS with this bad boy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyso4ek Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 I dont like ka50 anymore, there is too much workload for a single person. An experimental helicopter, no more. This is the reason why Russia adopted the mi28 and the ka52 instead. Mi24 does not have such a drawback. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawk6201 Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 If the MI-24 we get can laser range find, then a pair of MI-8s port and starboard would be a seriously nasty wing of 3 choppers.... MI-8s peeling of at 2-1.5 clicks. Well I found this but I dont know if its a range finder... Look at 0:55 [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow KT Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 looks like the laser targeting system on the su-25 'Shadow' Everybody gotta be offended and take it personally now-a-days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hawk6201 Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 looks like the laser targeting system on the su-25 The targeting system seems pretty much the same. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Askerov24 Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 Actually it's Mi-24PU1, Ukrainian modernisation program for Mi-24P, first stage. Yes, it has a laser rangefinder. Front cockpit Rear cockpit Acer Aspire E5-571G-713W/Intel® Core™ i7-4510U 2.0-3.1GHz/12 GB DDR3 L Memo/NVIDIA® GeForce® 820M 2 GB/1000 GB HDD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Askerov24 Posted January 12, 2018 Share Posted January 12, 2018 And then there is the second stage of the modernisation, Mi-24PU2 Acer Aspire E5-571G-713W/Intel® Core™ i7-4510U 2.0-3.1GHz/12 GB DDR3 L Memo/NVIDIA® GeForce® 820M 2 GB/1000 GB HDD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msalama Posted January 13, 2018 Share Posted January 13, 2018 "Mil Mi-24 Hind Attack Helicopter" (Yefim Gordon and Dmitriy Komissarov, Airlife) Yeah, I've heard this book is the source as it comes the Hind. So if they say the flying IFV concept wasn't practiced much, then it probably wasn't. Looking forward to the Mi-8 / Mi-24 combo, BTW. Makes for really interesting attack scenarios, that pretty pair! :thumbup: The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearfoot Posted January 13, 2018 Share Posted January 13, 2018 Worth posting again for the absolutely AWESOME footage of Mi-24's and Mi-8's in action .... dZa86ObSc6w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guitrz Posted January 13, 2018 Share Posted January 13, 2018 Of course the Hind is gonna be a game changer. Maybe not capability-wise, but because of the impact it's gonna have on the rotorhead community. It's Huey-level popularity. Like it was mentioned before, it's gonna be the F/A-18C of helicopters! [sIGPIC][url=http://www.blacksharkden.com][/url][/sIGPIC] http://www.blacksharkden.com "Come join us" - Bad Religion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoBlue Posted January 13, 2018 Share Posted January 13, 2018 (edited) I adore the Mi-8, therefore I will love the Mi-24 ;). Also Belsimtek doing it is a huge :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:. Edited January 13, 2018 by CoBlue i7 8700k@4.7, 1080ti, DDR4 32GB, 2x SSD , HD 2TB, W10, ASUS 27", TrackIr5, TMWH, X-56, GProR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msalama Posted January 13, 2018 Share Posted January 13, 2018 Sure as hell the Hind (and the Hind & Hip combo) is going to be a game changer with the SoH and the new Caucasus maps. Counter-insurgency heaven for us rotorheads! The DCS Mi-8MTV2. The best aviational BBW experience you could ever dream of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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