Complete modules

Hi to everyone,

I have one rather simple question, which modules are on the level of development of A10c/Black Shark? As far as I can see none.

I am in DCS since Lock on ( or Flanker days), so I have pretty much knowledge how the things are going on here, and I am on and off from DCS. But every time when I come back after some time I realize that only really flyable module is A10c.

Everything else is in endless development... i.e. I tried again M2000 and Vigen and I see a lot of bugs and issues.... F18 and F14b same story (ok F14b is rather new)... now F16....

I am really tired of financing never ending projects.... Devs should be legally obliged to finish the projects in some reasonable time (i.e in one year time after the release of early access in some percentage i.e. 90%). Otherwise return the money if you don´t deliver. Like this we are paying something which will never be finished or at lest brought to 90%.

I know, I know, this is utopia but, I am really disappointed.

Maybe I am wrong...

Cheers

Don't worry, you're not alone.

I have one rather simple question, which modules are on the level of development of A10c/Black Shark? As far as I can see none.

Apart from the FC3 planes, I can fly with no problems on the MiG-15, F-86, P-51, Fw-190D, Bf-109, UH-1, F-5E and L-39.

Save for a few issues, I can also happily fly on the C-101, MiG-19, I-16, F-14 and MiG-21.

The ones that I find still incomplete are the Harrier, the F-18, the Viggen, the Spitfire and the Gazelle ... and of course, the Viper.

on the level of development of

1 ) Mi-8

2 ) F-86

3 ) L-39

4 ) F-14

5 ) P-51D

6 ) MiG-15

7 ) Fw-190D-9

8 ) What I forgot, such as the F5-E (edit)

9 ) The originals mentioned by you already

10) Myself forever being on the level of development of weenie (edit)

As has been pointed out, there are a few that you could consider finished and working quite well, although there of course is a tendency of things to break and the older the module the longer it sometimes takes to get fixed back up.

Still I do see the point you are trying to make and I'm increasingly convinced that this issue is sadly a bit inherent in DCS. Simply put, 'early access' makes a lot of sense because it helps along the costly and lengthy development, plus vastly broadens the base of testing results, but on the other hand sometimes you might wonder what the point is in finishing up a module at all when you are - say - 85% done and realise that most people in the community who are interested in your module bought it already a long time ago. From a business point of view all those prospective customers have already turned into whining former customers, you could argue.

1 ) Mi-8

2 ) F-86

3 ) L-39

4 ) F-14

5 ) P-51D

6 ) MiG-15

7 ) Fw-190D-9

8 ) What I forgot

9 ) The originals mentioned by you already

Many thanks for reply, but it is my fault, I did not make it clear in initial post, I am in DCS/Lock on/Flanker because of modern fighter jets not helis and other relics (which I also like and appreciate). To be more precise A10c offers a huge complexity and systems, so there are no other modules on the same level of development (except Black Shark).

Flaming cliffs (which I mastered a long time ago) is great to enter the world of DCS but it is way different then A10C complexity.

into whining former customers, you could argue.

Indeed. FWIW, I've personally quit buying EA modules just because of that.

because of modern fighter jets

Hmmm... well modernish? F5-E perhaps? Gotta add it to the list anyway ;)

As has been pointed out, there are a few that you could consider finished and working quite well, although there of course is a tendency of things to break and the older the module the longer it sometimes takes to get fixed back up.

 

Still I do see the point you are trying to make and I'm increasingly convinced that this issue is sadly a bit inherent in DCS. Simply put, 'early access' makes a lot of sense because it helps along the costly and lengthy development, plus vastly broadens the base of testing results, but on the other hand sometimes you might wonder what the point is in finishing up a module at all when you are - say - 85% done and realise that most people in the community who are interested in your module bought it already a long time ago. From a business point of view all those prospective customers have already turned into whining former customers, you could argue.

Your completely right, I was helping them all the way, but nothing came in return for many years, only new unfinished modules.

JF-17 soon, don't worry ;)

...I am really tired of financing never ending projects.... Devs should be legally obliged to finish the projects in some reasonable time (i.e in one year time after the release of early access in some percentage i.e. 90%)...

I know there is still a lot going on, we have 2 huge products in development, the other option was to keep closed-door development, but we know many customers want in right away, many like the hands-on during development approach.

 

That said, I hope the door is never closed on a module, why? I always want ED to be upgrading, tweaking, adding and fixing all modules. New cockpits, external models, system upgrades, etc. DCS World, since the concept was brought about has been in constant development, and will continue to be.

 

The Viper and Hornet will get to feature complete status, released stuff will continue to get loved, new stuff will come, it's how this sandbox works. The development time on these products is so long that I am not sure many wouldn't want to have some early access. And if you are ok with long waits, and don't want to do the Early Access thing, then its totally optional as well.

Did you moved my thread to chit chat forum section? This is not chit chat, this is the core issue, mother of all issues.

I want also early access, I have bought many modules in early access (F16 the other day) but my question is so simple and question of many people here I am sure, finish the work to some level if not completly... We are financing a project, and instead that project is mostly completed in time, we are getting new projects....

Yeah, it's the same impatient chitchat that's bandied around for years. If you don't like early access then quite literally don't buy it, as it is NOT a complete product nor will it be anytime soon. This is not ''Steam Early Access'' where you get the complete product a week before anybody else. This is ''the product still has a few years of dev time but it's currently in a semi usable state''.

The A-10 was in dev for what, 5-7 years originally before it reached ''finished'' state? The F-18 will likely still be receiving substantial updates for at least another year or two and the F-16 will likely have similar, although since it reuses some stuff from the 18 they will likely finish up around the same time. The alternative to EA is nothing for a few more years and half as many modules available now.

ALL these modules, despite their sometimes imperfect state, are quite usable. No amount of bitching about bugs and ''hurrr it's not finished to my standard'' will change that. You get your money's worth, imperfections aside.

It's been explained many times why it's done how it is. No new products, no DCS before long. That simple. Take your lumps and bugs or move on, pretty much all there is to it, or stick to ONLY the fully completed modules.

It's also worth noting the modern aircraft you're talking about are increasingly complicated, and their attempts to better simulate stuff like radar etc also are themselves becoming more complicated. Dev time can be expected to take longer as a result.

I have question.For example new module is released on 01/01 2020,in a early excess.

Is it ok for me to get a little ticked of if product is still in early excess on 01/01 2022.

If it is not than when;2023,2024 maybe?I need time frame