Suncom SFS and Talon restoration and mods

Received my board today any chance you can PM me a few photos of how it looks installed or being installed thanks mate

Received my board today any chance you can PM me a few photos of how it looks installed or being installed thanks mate

Here is the PCB. There are 3 connectors at the botom. Two 2pin connectors are for pinkie and Auto Acquisition Switch. Jaust solder wires on switches and that is it. Also there is 5pin connector you have to connect it to mini din connector.

You can see written on PCB: VCC, C/S, CLK, OUT and GND. VCC top pin and GND is bottom pin. Use this diagram for soldering. Latch is C/S, data is OUT, VDD is VCC, clock is CLK.

This works when you look at the connector from bellow. When you solder you solder from above, so be careful, then everything is mirrored.

This is how it should look like.

I went and bought the Suncom F-15E Hawk without realising that the trim hat and the coolie switch were non functional

Hi Myst,

You'll need an additional PCB with diodes on RKJXL only for the intermediate positions (like up+right) to register as both adjacent contact pressed (both up AND right). This is how the POV hats on most of the typical joystics work. If you want the applicable axes (up, down, left and right) to work separately, then you can wire the switches directly.

As for TM handles compatibility- no, it won't work with BU0836A. TM handles interface with a controller via so called shift registers (these are located in the handles) that cannot be connected to BU0836A.

As Sergey said it cannot be like TM grips with Leo Bodnar's board. I recommend using mmjoy2 with Leonardo pro micro. If you want replaceable grips you have to use shift register inside grip.

Hawk grip is like Talon. You can remove even china hat, it looks glued but it is not. Use small diameter drill from below and it will fall off.

The real OTTO/ Eaton switches have longer travel, MUCH higher activating force and they do have a sharp click. I would highly recommend Knitter MPS103/ MPS203 switches, as they are reliable, quite similar to OTTO P1 in terms of travel and pronounced click, but the force required is much lower- exactly what is needed for joystick use. Knitter is a German company, so they should be easily available in Europe; BTW, Leo Bodnar is selling MPS103's complete with colored caps at a very attractive price. APEM 8000 series is an alternative, but I don't like the operational feeling they provide.

To be more precise- here is a small comparison of the operating forces:

OTTO P1/ Eaton 1XX: 4 lbs.

NKK MB2000: 2 lbs.

Apem 8000: 1.8 lbs.

Knitter MPS103: 0.7 lbs.

Typical membrane "tact" switches (as used in Suncom) are 0.15- 0.25 lbs with practically no travel.

NKK MB 2000 series travel depends on model, see:

http://www.nkkswitches.com/pdf/MB2000Bushing.pdf

Pay attention in the size of switch, may became difficult fit inside Suncom grip.

What resistor is needed to make the LED work, and can you reuse the original LED? Thanks!

What resistor is needed to make the LED work, and can you reuse the original LED? Thanks!

You can use old led, but I think it is not very bright. Once I added resistor of 330 Ohms, but probably any value up to 1k will be OK.

Perfect, thanks!

Debolestis, using your PCB can I replace the switches with "real" ones. ie. remove the push buttons? I assume it's as simple as desoldering and hooking up the switches. Also, any possibility of adding a working recce button and the thumb switch or would I need to look at something else?

Should add I have one of your PCBs :)

Debolestis, using your PCB can I replace the switches with "real" ones. ie. remove the push buttons? I assume it's as simple as desoldering and hooking up the switches. Also, any possibility of adding a working recce button and the thumb switch or would I need to look at something else?

 

Should add I have one of your PCBs :)

Yes, you can use any switch you want, that is not a problem. I can send a PCB without switches, that is OK.

"Recce button and thumb switch" If you mean 3-way thumb switch, at the moment it will be difficult. It is possible but wires should be soldered directly on chip legs which are tiny. I wasn't thinking of this before and I forgot to add connectors for extra switches. I'll add those connectors on new version, when I order new PCBs it takes about a month or so before they arrive from China.

Yes, you can use any switch you want, that is not a problem. I can send a PCB without switches, that is OK.

 

 

 

"Recce button and thumb switch" If you mean 3-way thumb switch, at the moment it will be difficult. It is possible but wires should be soldered directly on chip legs which are tiny. I wasn't thinking of this before and I forgot to add connectors for extra switches. I'll add those connectors on new version, when I order new PCBs it takes about a month or so before they arrive from China.

If you make a new PCB that allows the 4-way switch on the thumb (as per the Hornet stick) and the recce button (again, as per the hornet) I'd gladly buy a second one :)

Thanks for the top-notch work!

Hello,

Just wanted to let every body know I just received a PCB from debolestis and I'm very pleased with the communication we had and the quality of this little piece of art.

Thanks again !

Mathieu

I am glad that you like it.

Hello,

 

 

Just wanted to let every body know I just received a PCB from debolestis and I'm very pleased with the communication we had and the quality of this little piece of art.

 

 

Thanks again !

 

 

Mathieu

Ditto on Killin`Ducks comment.

I too have the PCB board and am extremely happy, thanks Debolestis.

Hello,

Received all my parts this week, so I had to start converting the Hawk :)

Still need to solder the pinkie, autolock switches and mini-DIN connector but old grease inside have been removed and the new PCB is installed.

I'm a little concerned about the trim button because I can't really feel the switches when moving it (I clearly hear the castle ones) but I'll check this point once everyting is soldered.

Edit : I tested the stick on the Warthog base and the trim switch is not working properly. I'll try to cut 1mm off the nipple switches on the PCB and see how it perform. All other switches are working as intended ;)

Got the solution this morning after opening the stick again : coolie hat jumped out off his shaft, pushed by the spring :music_whistling:

So I was able to work on the plate located on the shaft to reduce it's thickness. No need to remove some material on the nipples :thumbup:

I bought faulty Warthog throttle some time ago. I decided to mod it with Mmjoy2. Since I have Honeywell toggles and Otto push buttons I decided to use them as well.

Warthog throttle is insanely difficult to disassembly, in my opinion it is made such so that nobody can repair it. I would have don it differently.

Biggest problem to remove were toggles on the base, I just couldn't unscrew the screw that were holding them. TM probably used special tool for that, socket wrench was too wide to fit. Tubular box spanner was also too wide. I have to break PCBs and break switches in the end.

This is the end result

I managed to save LED pcbs

I'll manage to do something with switches but problem at the moment is throttle sensor.

It is MLX900316

In data sheet it is mentioned that analog operation is possible. I have no idea how to connect them to Mmjoy2.

Maybe I can make PCB with different sensor. PCB is very small 14,3x9,3mm.

Any ideas are welcome.

In SimHQ MMjoy2 topic a guy say that manage to wire T.16000M sensor (same Melexis 3D) in MMjoy2, through external ADC I think.

Probable the easy way is replace then with TLE5010/11 or analog programmed version of MLX90333.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/MLX90333-Joystick-Sensor-Absolute-Position-Digital-Three-Dimensional-Angle-AL/232392093851

In SimHQ MMjoy2 topic a guy say that manage to wire T.16000M sensor (same Melexis 3D) in MMjoy2, through external ADC I think.

 

Probable the easy way is replace then with TLE5010/11 or analog programmed version of MLX90333.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/MLX90333-Joystick-Sensor-Absolute-Position-Digital-Three-Dimensional-Angle-AL/232392093851

I'd like to use original sensor, How does external ADC work? Any posts on that?

An option is use Hempstick firmware, compatible with Melexis MLX90333 and TARGET.

http://www.hempstick.org/The_Official_Hempstick_Site/Welcome.html

Compatible only with Arduino Due/X or Atmel SAM4S XPLAINED Pro, both a bit expensive.

Or SimmRGE controller made by MFG - if find available.

OK, thank you Sokol, I have SimmRGE controler, I'll try it out.

Here is the PCB. There are 3 connectors at the botom. Two 2pin connectors are for pinkie and Auto Acquisition Switch. Jaust solder wires on switches and that is it. Also there is 5pin connector you have to connect it to mini din connector.

 

 

You can see written on PCB: VCC, C/S, CLK, OUT and GND. VCC top pin and GND is bottom pin. Use this diagram for soldering. Latch is C/S, data is OUT, VDD is VCC, clock is CLK.

 

 

This works when you look at the connector from bellow. When you solder you solder from above, so be careful, then everything is mirrored.

 

This is how it should look like.

Hello,

I've a question regarding Auto Acquisition Switch : what items would be needed to convert the stock push button to a FWD / PUSH DOWN /AFT switch ?

I plan to get a Leobonar / Pokeys57 to make some panels and I was thinking I could use the board with the proper switch (which one ?)...

Any idea ?

Mathieu

I've a question regarding Auto Acquisition Switch : what items would be needed to convert the stock push button to a FWD / PUSH DOWN /AFT switch ?

Most used solution is get a 4 directions + push ALPS RJX* series switch and have a "5 way HAT" in this thumb switch - but if you are "purist" can wire only forward-backward + push, F-15 style. Seems that in F-18 the switch use 5 positions and Thrustmaster use this approach for their (incoming) F/A-18 grip add on for Warthog base.

*See back in this topic the complete code for ALPS switch.